Was/Is Mary the Ark?

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onenow1 said:
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you” (Jer. 1:5);
Yhis may qualify Doki.

God Bless
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Unless we are all eternal past, present, future like God, then I don’t think so. God knew all of us before we were in our mother’s womb.
 
MariaG said:
:confused:why would she have to exist before she was conceived.

Frankly, I see it as one of the most biblical teachings around.

What did the ark of the OT carry? The word of God
Who did Mary carry? The Word.

The OT ark carried the old covenant
Mary carried the new covenant

It truly is beutiful how God connected it all.
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I don’t think she did pre-exist like Jesus pre-existed.
 
LilyM said:
Well, it’s not IMpossible. God says ‘BEFORE I formed you in the womb I knew you’. The use of the word ‘before’ indicates a point in time prior to our conception, so it’s not the same thing as saying ‘I knew you eternally (ie outside of time itself)’. So there seems a strong possibility that our souls (and thus in a sense we) pre-existed our bodily conception.

On another tangent - did the Meeting Tent of Moses pre-exist God? No. Yet did He not dwell there in a special way, such that Moses could not enter (see last chapter of Exodus)? Yes.

God can indeed dwell, in a unique way, in a location that post-dates Him.
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Of course He can and does if He lives in believers. That wasn’t why I asked.

BTW, how many Arks are there in Scripture?
 
Radical said:
was/is Mary the new ark? Nope…if any one could be properly labelled the new ark, then it would be Christ himself.

IMHO the shameless manipulation of scripture is utilized to make the claim…such as this “parallel”:

2 SAM 6:9 And David was afraid of the LORD that day and said How shall the ark of the LORD come to me?
LK 1:43 And whence is this to me that the mother of my Lord should come to me?

This sort of parallel is supposed to support the argument that Mary is the new Ark, but David’s question is one of dread and concern and Elizabeth’s question is nothing of the sort. One is positive and one is negative, but that inconvenient distinction is ignored to proclaim that since David asked how the ark can come to him and since Elizabeth asked how Mary should come to her, Mary must be the new ark. Utilizing that sort of fudging, any sort of result is possible.
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I agree.

Seems Hebrews 8-10 agrees with you too.
 
elvisman said:
**Wow - another **anti-Catholic who doesn’t understand (or rejects) polyvalent symbolism - what a shock . . . :rolleyes:
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Hey, buddy, stacked against all your anti - non-catholic remarks, this is meaningless.
 
Again, how many Arks are mentioned in the Bible? Please name them and give references so we can look them up. Thanks.
 
Dokimas said:
Again, how many Arks are mentioned in the Bible? Please name them and give references so we can look them up. Thanks.
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why not research the info youself and then ask what’s troubling you?Peace, Carlan
 
Ge 7:1 Then the LORD said to Noah, "Come into the ark, you and all your household, because I have seen that you are righteous before Me in this generation.

Ex 2:3 But when she could no longer hide him, she took an ark of bulrushes for him, daubed it with asphalt and pitch, put the child in it, and laid it in the reeds by the river’s bank.

Ex 25:10 "And they shall make an ark of acacia wood; two and a half cubits shall be its length, a cubit and a half its width, and a cubit and a half its height.
14 "You shall put the poles into the rings on the sides of the ark, that the ark may be carried by them.
15 "The poles shall be in the rings of the ark; they shall not be taken from it.
16 "And you shall put into the **ark the Testimony **which I will give you.
21 "You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you.
22 "And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.

Jos 4:16 “Command the priests who bear the ark of the Testimony to come up from the Jordan.”
Jos 4:18 And it came to pass, when the priests who bore the **ark of the covenant **of the LORD had come from the midst of the Jordan, and the soles of the priests’ feet touched the dry land, that the waters of the Jordan returned to their place and overflowed all its banks as before.

Jos 6:6 Then Joshua the son of Nun called the priests and said to them, "Take up the ark of the covenant, and let seven priests bear seven trumpets of rams’ horns before the ark of the LORD

1Sa 3:3 and before the lamp of God went out in the tabernacle of the LORD where the **ark of God **was, and while Samuel was lying down,

1Sa 5:8 Therefore they sent and gathered to themselves all the lords of the Philistines, and said, “What shall we do with the ark of the God of Israel?” And they answered, “Let the **ark of the God of Israel **be carried away to Gath.” So they carried the ark of the God of Israel away.

1Ch 15:25 So David, the elders of Israel, and the captains over thousands went to bring up the ark of the covenant of the LORD from the house of Obed–Edom with joy.

Heb 9:4 which had the golden censer and the ark of the covenant overlaid on all sides with gold, in which were the golden pot that had the manna, Aaron’s rod that budded, and the tablets of the covenant;

Re 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

1 - Noah’s ark

2 - The ark that held Moses

3 - The Ark that the Israelites made for the Tabernacle (later put into the Temple). This ark had many names (Ark of the Covenant, Ark of God, etc)

4 - The Ark in Heaven.

Anyone find any others?
 
Dokimas said:
Ge 7:1 Then the LORD said to Noah, "Come into the ark, you and all your household, because I have seen that you are righteous before Me in this generation.

Ex 2:3 But when she could no longer hide him, she took an ark of bulrushes for him, daubed it with asphalt and pitch, put the child in it, and laid it in the reeds by the river’s bank.

Ex 25:10 "And they shall make an ark of acacia wood; two and a half cubits shall be its length, a cubit and a half its width, and a cubit and a half its height.
14 "You shall put the poles into the rings on the sides of the ark, that the ark may be carried by them.
15 "The poles shall be in the rings of the ark; they shall not be taken from it.
16 "And you shall put into the **ark the Testimony **which I will give you.
21 "You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you.
22 "And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.

Jos 4:16 “Command the priests who bear the ark of the Testimony to come up from the Jordan.”
Jos 4:18 And it came to pass, when the priests who bore the **ark of the covenant **of the LORD had come from the midst of the Jordan, and the soles of the priests’ feet touched the dry land, that the waters of the Jordan returned to their place and overflowed all its banks as before.

Jos 6:6 Then Joshua the son of Nun called the priests and said to them, "Take up the ark of the covenant, and let seven priests bear seven trumpets of rams’ horns before the ark of the LORD

1Sa 3:3 and before the lamp of God went out in the tabernacle of the LORD where the **ark of God **was, and while Samuel was lying down,

1Sa 5:8 Therefore they sent and gathered to themselves all the lords of the Philistines, and said, “What shall we do with the ark of the God of Israel?” And they answered, “Let the **ark of the God of Israel **be carried away to Gath.” So they carried the ark of the God of Israel away.

1Ch 15:25 So David, the elders of Israel, and the captains over thousands went to bring up the ark of the covenant of the LORD from the house of Obed–Edom with joy.

Heb 9:4 which had the golden censer and the ark of the covenant overlaid on all sides with gold, in which were the golden pot that had the manna, Aaron’s rod that budded, and the tablets of the covenant;

Re 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

1 - Noah’s ark

2 - The ark that held Moses

3 - The Ark that the Israelites made for the Tabernacle (later put into the Temple). This ark had many names (Ark of the Covenant, Ark of God, etc)

4 - The Ark in Heaven.
Anyone find any others?
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Yup.
Here is the Ark of the New Covenant, as it refers to Mary - something you failed to mention:

Rev. 11:19, 12:1
***Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant could be seen in the temple. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, and peals of thunder, an earthquake, and a violent hailstorm. ***
***A great sign appeared in the sky, a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. *She was with child and wailed aloud in pain as she labored to give birth.

One thing you have to remember, my Scripturally-confused friend, is that Chapter and verse were not included in the original writings.
Rev. 11:19 flows right into Rev. 12:1.

Hope that helps! 👍
 
Dokimas said:
Hey, buddy, stacked against all your anti - non-catholic remarks, this is meaningless.
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Scripture and hermeneutics, menaningless??
I guess it IS meaningless when you rework it 1500 years AFTER it was written . . .
 
elvisman said:
Yup.
Here is the Ark of the New Covenant, as it refers to Mary - something you failed to mention:

Rev. 11:19, 12:1
***Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant could be seen in the temple. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, and peals of thunder, an earthquake, and a violent hailstorm. ***
***A great sign appeared in the sky, a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. ***She was with child and wailed aloud in pain as she labored to give birth.

One thing you have to remember, my Scripturally-confused friend, is that Chapter and verse were not included in the original writings.
Rev. 11:19 flows right into Rev. 12:1.

Hope that helps! 👍
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I’d love to see a comment by you that doesn’t put down the person you are disagreeing with. I don’t think you have that kind of love in you.

BTW, thank you for telling me something that is common knowledge (chapter and verse numbers - however, it sure does help us have this conversation now that there are chapter and verses).

As for the Ark of the New Covenant - did you give us the reference?
 
elvisman said:
Scripture and hermeneutics, menaningless??
**I guess it IS **meaningless when you rework it 1500 years AFTER it was written . . .
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You missed my point: you calling anyone anti-catholic is meaningless in the light of ALL your anti non-catholic remarks.
 
Dokimas said:
I’d love to see a comment by you that doesn’t put down the person you are disagreeing with. I don’t think you have that kind of love in you.

BTW, thank you for telling me something that is common knowledge (chapter and verse numbers - however, it sure does help us have this conversation now that there are chapter and verses).

As for the Ark of the New Covenant - did you give us the reference?
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Ummm . . . RE-READ the post.
I gave you the Scriptural reference. Oh, what the heck - here it is again . . .

**Rev. 11:19, 12:1
Then God’s temple in heaven was opened, and the ark of his covenant could be seen in the temple. There were flashes of lightning, rumblings, and peals of thunder, an earthquake, and a violent hailstorm. **
A great sign appeared in the sky, a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars. She was with child and wailed aloud in pain as she labored to give birth.

This is referring to MARY.
 
Dokimas said:
Ge 7:1 Then the LORD said to Noah, "Come into the ark, you and all your household, because I have seen that you are righteous before Me in this generation.

Ex 2:3 But when she could no longer hide him, she took an ark of bulrushes for him, daubed it with asphalt and pitch, put the child in it, and laid it in the reeds by the river’s bank.

Ex 25:10 "And they shall make an ark of acacia wood; two and a half cubits shall be its length, a cubit and a half its width, and a cubit and a half its height.
14 "You shall put the poles into the rings on the sides of the ark, that the ark may be carried by them.
15 "The poles shall be in the rings of the ark; they shall not be taken from it.
16 "And you shall put into the **ark the Testimony **which I will give you.
21 "You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you.
22 "And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.

Jos 4:16 “Command the priests who bear the ark of the Testimony to come up from the Jordan.”
Jos 4:18 And it came to pass, when the priests who bore the **ark of the covenant **of the LORD had come from the midst of the Jordan, and the soles of the priests’ feet touched the dry land, that the waters of the Jordan returned to their place and overflowed all its banks as before.

Jos 6:6 Then Joshua the son of Nun called the priests and said to them, "Take up the ark of the covenant, and let seven priests bear seven trumpets of rams’ horns before the ark of the LORD

1Sa 3:3 and before the lamp of God went out in the tabernacle of the LORD where the **ark of God **was, and while Samuel was lying down,

1Sa 5:8 Therefore they sent and gathered to themselves all the lords of the Philistines, and said, “What shall we do with the ark of the God of Israel?” And they answered, “Let the **ark of the God of Israel **be carried away to Gath.” So they carried the ark of the God of Israel away.

1Ch 15:25 So David, the elders of Israel, and the captains over thousands went to bring up the ark of the covenant of the LORD from the house of Obed–Edom with joy.

Heb 9:4 which had the golden censer and the ark of the covenant overlaid on all sides with gold, in which were the golden pot that had the manna, Aaron’s rod that budded, and the tablets of the covenant;

Re 11:19 Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.

1 - Noah’s ark

2 - The ark that held Moses

3 - The Ark that the Israelites made for the Tabernacle (later put into the Temple). This ark had many names (Ark of the Covenant, Ark of God, etc)

4 - The Ark in Heaven.

Anyone find any others?
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Okay,now are you saying all the above mentioned arks have no relations to each other?
 
Yes Marry is the ark of the covenant and unless you take her as your honorable Mother you have not the word of God and you have not Sabbath.

Its sad really but there are so many cults these days that deny the honor of mother and father yet they claim to keep the commandents. They not only don’t keep the commandments but they don’t even know the comandments. The saddest part is they tend to call themselves by the name of accuser (protestant).
 
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