We don't need religion . .

[moen]

This from someone teetering on the CC fence : I think for many the root of CC bashing or “feeling” very comfortable with THE SHACK (which I read and left going, “AHHHH, that’s comfy”) is that there’s such a propensity in our culture/country toward being anti-authority! It underlies almost everything I see it more than ever in my own children, where it’s like pushing upstream trying to be a good parent, being careful about their friends, what they watch, etc.!! Even at the Catholic school they go to! My children aren’t Catholic (as we are not), and they come home and say , “MAAUUMM, all my friends at school have watched this or that pg-13 movie (with sexuality, women very scantily clad, etc) and I feel stupid cuz I haven’t!” (That’s a very painful issue- but back to the issue at hand
Regarding authority: I catch myself often saying If it doesn’t make sense to me or doesn’t pass my “comfy” test, the biblical test (of course my own interpretation) it, CAN"T be true…
I think because of the 60s especially we have a nation of people who simply will not submit to authority unless is makes perfect sense to each and every one. HA. That never will happen. There’s A LOT about the CC I have trouble with (seemingly way too many man-made rules that get in the way and/or force too much attention on them instead of rel’t with Jesus , yet when all is said and done, it’s like "To Whom shall we go…He(within the Church) have the words of Life! Otherwise, it’s “every man for himself” in regards to interpretation/how to live out the Bible, etc.
There’s lots that won’t make sense in the here and now, but somehow/someway we must believe that God has foreseen all this and made a way. Yes, there’s abuse; yes, there’s sin involved at times…but the same thing happened throughout Israel’s history, and time after time, God expresses his love and desire for His people to continue on course, not break off and run…but to endure and trust. ouch.

 

[VickiKapron]

To Moen,
“too many rules”
This is also spoken of in the Shack… “man-made” rules…
The Law is ONLY there to show us how we can’t keep it…

Yet we are told, be perfect as our Heavenly Father is perfect.
HE makes us perfect. HE sanctifies us. We are righteous IN HIM.

The book goes on to say too many want to DO things
to EARN/BECOME righteous in themselves. We can’t argue with that, but that is NOT the Catholic Faith.

It isn’t about US keeping the rules… The “rules” people perceive as man-made are there as helps to challenge us to ask… are we in true relationship with God? Are we hiding from ourselves and from Him? Jesus showed us in His life, in dealing with the leaders of the Jewish people, that it isn’t about what we do, it’s
about our heart… the why we do it. Do we SEEK holiness by
laying down our own desires and submitting to His will, that he might do his work within us? When our hearts are brimming over with love of God it spills out to all areas of our lives. It’s not a magic button that we “become holy” overnight… it’s a process of
laying things down in our lives, sometimes one thing at a time, in trust of God.

Our beloved non-Catholic brothers and sisters often have a HEART full of love of God… perhaps their challenge is not just to give God their heart/feelings but to lay down their very lives in
faithful obedience (not blind obedience, but in faith and joy).
Heck this is the same thing ALL who seek God honestly struggle
with because as you said, we abhor authority! But it’s easy to SAY, Lord, Lord, it’s another to submit. That’s MY struggle.
The desire is there, but I haven’t laid down enough of myself.

It is a journey, a journey of learning to trust God more and more.
And the difficulties/challenges/sorrows that arise in life are God just drawing us closer, but that doesn’t mean it’s easy for us to
accept. But amazingly, when we rest in His grace, He brings us
His joy and His peace, even if the difficulties life presents.

I love Philippians 4:6-7: Do not be anxious about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard our hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.

“Peace be with you, MY peace I give to you.”

Jesus, bring us your peace!
Vicki

 

[adamsf]

If there is no religion, can you imagine it, how it would be like now. Jesus came for this purpose, though he did not call it religion. He did asked us to be aware there is a living God. That we need to glorify him for mercies upon us that we take for granted. We need religion faithfully.

It is very important to take religion seriously.WE CAN SAY TO TAKE THE TEACHINGS OF JESUS CHRIST SERIOUSLY. There is no other salvation that can rescue human beings from the weaknesses of being human, but the constant reminder of Jesus teaching.

 

[VickiKapron]

Adam,
Guess you hit the nail on the head.
We’re afraid of the word religion and what we perceive and read into it…

I have to remind myself to be gentle with those who have come to
build religion up as some awful, self-centered abstraction rather than the church of Christ, living in the world today and bringing His the Good News of His love and mercy to all.

Don’t you just wish we could just cut through all the misperceptions/misunderstandings and bring others to the beauty and fullness of the church Jesus established to be a blessing to us, to all?

So perhaps God uses us in ways to be a little ray of light, truth, and love to this confused world.

I pray I won’t “hide in under a bushel” but let it shine.

 

[PRmerger]

Here’s the deal. My co-worker says something along these lines, “we don’t need religion and tradtions, it’s all about a relationship with Christ!”.

One can indeed simply have a relationship with Christ, but the moment one goes about trying to **talk about **this relationship, it becomes “religion”, in the sense that religion or theology is our understanding of God. We need religion in order to be able to discuss our relationship with Christ.

Also, Jesus told us to love God with our heart, mind and soul. Religion is the “mind” part–the knowing the Truth.

 

[ron77nyc]

Here’s the deal. My co-worker says something along these lines, “we don’t need religion and tradtions, it’s all about a relationship with Christ!” I’m sure you have all heard that before. Maybe at one time many of you said it yourselves… What have any of you done in this situation? Those of you who were on the other end and came home to the Catholic Church, what made you have a change of heart on this whole “it’s a relationship and religion and traditions are evil?”

God bless,
ZP

p.s.

I’m guessing by religion he means the Catholic Church.

I think your co-worker makes a good point but religious people also make a good point. We need religion but we don’t need overkill religion. All religions tend to overdo it at times. Paul sums it up in Colossians 2.usccb.org/nab/bible/colossians/colossians2.htm

6 So, as you received Christ Jesus the Lord, walk in him,
7 rooted in him and built upon him and established in the faith as you were taught, abounding in thanksgiving.
**8 See to it that no one captivate you with an empty, seductive philosophy according to human tradition, according to the elemental powers of the world and not according to Christ.
9 For in him dwells the whole fullness of the deity 4 bodily,
10 and you share in this fullness in him, who is the head of every principality and power. **
11 In him you were also circumcised with a circumcision not administered by hand, by stripping off the carnal body, with the circumcision of Christ.
12 You were buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.
13 And even when you were dead (in) transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he brought you to life along with him, having forgiven us all our transgressions;
14 6 obliterating the bond against us, with its legal claims, which was opposed to us, he also removed it from our midst, nailing it to the cross;
15 despoiling the principalities and the powers, he made a public spectacle of them, leading them away in triumph by it.
16 Let no one, then, pass judgment on you in matters of food and drink or with regard to a festival or new moon or sabbath. 8
17 These are shadows of things to come; the reality belongs to Christ.
18 Let no one disqualify you, delighting in self-abasement and worship of angels, taking his stand on visions, 9 inflated without reason by his fleshly mind,
19 and not holding closely to the head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and bonds, achieves the growth that comes from God.
**20 If you died with Christ to the elemental powers of the world, why do you submit to regulations as if you were still living in the world?
21 “Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!”
22 These are all things destined to perish with use; they accord with human precepts and teachings.
23 While they have a semblance of wisdom in rigor of devotion and self-abasement (and) severity to the body, they are of no value against gratification of the flesh. **

**Look at these footnotes by the US Catholic Bishops:**2 [4-23] In face of the threat posed by false teachers (Col 2:4), the Colossians are admonished to adhere to the gospel as it was first preached to them (Col 2:6), steeping themselves in it with grateful hearts (Col 2:7). **They must reject religious teachings originating in any source except the gospel (Col 2:8) because in Christ alone will they have access to God, the deity (Col 2:9). So fully has Christ enlightened them that they need no other source of religious knowledge or virtue (Col 2:10). **They do not require circumcision (Col 2:11), for in baptism their whole being has been affected by Christ