We have a POPE!!!!

[Moore11]

Our you a priest?Did your parents not do their jobs? Why aren’t you s priest? Why should any one be willing to be one before you?

No, I am not a priest.
No, my parents did not do their job.

You are displaying that you do not understand what the vocation of the priesthood is.

My father was a mormon. My mother, an Anglican. I went by myself to a presbyterian Church down the street from age 7 on. I went to a Catholic high school, a Catholic college. Converted in College and I have a science degree and theology degree. I was in fact in the seminary. I did explore a vocation to be a priest. Both my wife and I are converts. We are a homeschooling family that teaches the faith to our kids.

As parents it we have only one job. To help our children become saints. And that includes helping them figure out what their vocation is. Or to put it another way. What God is calling them to do. No matter what it is. Many parents in our modern society would never want their children to receive holy orders. It is sad. We pray in front of the Blessed sacrament for vocations. I hope God blesses our Church with plenty of vocations and if they come from my pool of children, great! If not, great!

I think it would be beneficial to you to learn about what the priesthood is. About what it is intended to be. The shortage of priests cannot be fixed by opening the door wider, but rather by a more spiritual world that supports the priesthood.

I will say again. Quality over quantity!!

Interestingly, historically, when SOME priests were married it was not like the protestant model you see before you. It was chaste and for the most part, childless. And deacons and priests were not allowed to marry after they were ordained.

One final point before we bring this train wreck back to the topic.
Sometimes the idea of married priests is used by the progressive types not just as a cure for the shortage, but also a cure for the scandals that rocked our Church recently.
This is dangerous thinking. Married men account for a majority of sexual abuse offenders. Not only that but institutions that have married professionals (like schools or protestant denominations that marry) have a higher rate of sexual abuse than the Catholic Church does.
Here is an article for you to read.
catholiceducation.org/articles/facts/fm0011.html

Now back to the topic before we get in trouble!!

 

[JamesCaruso]

To coin your words in another way we could say any genuine authentic work of God always turns out sooner or later to be a SIGN OF CONTRADICTION to the world.
no matter how righteous pope Francis is the world will seek to humiliate him and discredit him.

Yes, a sign of contradiction. Wasn’t that the title of a book by Pope John Paul II? But, yes, Christianity is a sign of contradiction to the world and its values. When the Francis-meek-saint-and-lover-of-animals fest is over, we’ll see how many continue to applaud and receive him favorably. If only a few remain, so goes the world, but if multitudes remain, maybe Our Lady/s plan for peace is upon us. We can hope, can’t we? Say your rosaries.

 

[Moore11]

You are right. Working at an all boys Catholic high school with about 1100 student they have deep theological formation and are taught to be men for others; however, I cannot remember the last graduate that became a priest. They are extremely loyal to their school, even those who are not catholic and most go to continue to help the world in many ways, but they don’t become priest.

That is incredibly sad.
In our youth group alone we usually have one former student or core member go to Seminary a year. That is from a pool of about 60-100 young men.
I live in a liberal diocese but we have an orthodox youth program. We bring in young priests to talk about vocations, we bring in the vocations director for our diocese. We pray in adoration at youth nights for vocations.

BUT in our Catholic high school it is much like you describe. In fact many of the kids in our youth program who struggle with their faith the most come from the Catholic High school.
There is definitely something to your observation.
One thing Pope Francis is already doing is being a Pope that the youth will be able to understand.
World Youth day this year will be an incredibly interesting event. It has potential to absolutely fail or succeed like no other.
This Pope, in a country that is right next to his home. With millions of youth.
I think it will define this Papacy. For better or worse.

 

[JamesCaruso]

That is incredibly sad.

Do you think it is a matter of numbers? As I recall, Jesus got most of his Apostles from the same locale and even the same occupation, Maybe all of the kids in your smaller group had vocations, and none of the kids in the larger group had vocations. It’s impossible to make judgments about these things, other than it seems on the surface that some Catholic youths somewhere have shrugged off or failed to discern the call of God judging by the seemingly inadequate numbers who do respond. What is sad is that many Catholics do not foster vocations in their children, although the past when some Catholic parents practically forced their children into the seminaries was not any better. I don’t know which is worse, rejecting/failing to discern one’s vocation or joining the priesthood without a vocation. I do agree with all of you that we should pray for vocations. And maybe some of us (men) have unrecognized vocations to the Deaconite, as well.

 

[Moore11]

Do you think it is a matter of numbers? As I recall, Jesus got most of his Apostles from the same locale and even the same occupation, Maybe all of the kids in your smaller group had vocations, and none of the kids in the larger group had vocations. It’s impossible to make judgments about these things, other than it seems on the surface that some Catholic youths somewhere have shrugged off or failed to discern the call of God judging by the seemingly inadequate numbers who do respond. What is sad is that many Catholics do not foster vocations in their children, although the past when some Catholic parents practically forced their children into the seminaries was not any better. I don’t know which is worse, rejecting/failing to discern one’s vocation or joining the priesthood without a vocation. I do agree with all of you that we should pray for vocations. And maybe some of us (men) have unrecognized vocations to the Deaconite, as well.

Those are valid points.
But yes. It is sad. The poster lamented the shortage of priests to the point of allowing married clergy. So obviously from the poster’s perspective there is a problem.

While what you say is true it is important that we do not just throw up our hands and say “leave it up to God” We have vocations offices for a reason and programs for a reason.
Where the Church thrives there are always plenty of vocations. Just because some “forced” others to become priests in the past does not mean that we need to overcompensate now!
There should be discussion in ANY Church run program or school that focuses on vocations. ESPECIALLY WHERE YOUNG MEN ARE CONCENTRATED AT A TIME IN THEIR LIVES WHEN THEY SHOULD BE DICERNING. We should encourage it, talk about it, and educate about it! Not just silently pray for some other families kid to answer the call.

 

[JamesCaruso]

Those are valid points.
But yes. It is sad. The poster lamented the shortage of priests to the point of allowing married clergy. So obviously from the poster’s perspective there is a problem.

While what you say is true it is important that we do not just throw up our hands and say “leave it up to God” We have vocations offices for a reason and programs for a reason.
Where the Church thrives there are always plenty of vocations. Just because some “forced” others to become priests in the past does not mean that we need to overcompensate now!
There should be discussion in ANY Church run program or school that focuses on vocations. ESPECIALLY WHERE YOUNG MEN ARE CONCENTRATED AT A TIME IN THEIR LIVES WHEN THEY SHOULD BE DICERNING. We should encourage it, talk about it, and educate about it! Not just silently pray for some other families kid to answer the call.

The problem of vocations I believe stems from a larger problem, and that is a laity that is removed, insulated, isolated, and apart from the spiritual life of the Church. American Catholics live lives that are full of many things-- school, soccer, baseball, art classes, swimming, television, movies, rock concerts, parties, music, etc. for the kids, and work, television, outings, vacations, parties (good ones), adult hobbies, movies, stage and musical shows, etc., for the adults, and dinner is no longer the everyday meeting place for family members, and parents’ emphasis is on getting a college degree and making a good salary above all else, and the media hammers away at the American dream of a good job (or better) and a loving mate as the answers to one’s happiness, and religion becomes a minimum requirement of Mass on Sunday and holy days, (God won’t damn me if a miss a few) and no meat of Fridays during Lent (if I remember), – Is it any wonder that there are so few vocations? America has become one enormous distraction. If you go with the flow, and if God does not intervene in the circumstances of your life, America is designed to titillate you, entertain you, enthrall you, entice you, amuse you, feed you, comfort you, educate you, challenge you, interest you, excite you, deceive you, reward you, satisfy you, and in all things make you complacent from the cradle to the grave. There is not one mention of religion except maybe Thanksgiving, in all the secular media and plethora of secular activities we enjoy. Why would anyone growing up in America want to become a priest. The priesthood is a contradiction to everything we are being taught. The problem is systemic. If we don’t wake up, I am sure that God will provide us with a wake up call. Let’s pray that in this year of faith, that the new evangelization that Pope Benedict called for, will begin to take root, grow, and blossom in our generation. These really are desperate times we live in, and I don’t mean the economy.

 

[Moore11]

The problem of vocations I believe stems from a larger problem, and that is a laity that is removed, insulated, isolated, and apart from the spiritual life of the Church. American Catholics live lives that are full of many things-- school, soccer, baseball, art classes, swimming, television, movies, rock concerts, parties, music, etc. for the kids, and work, television, outings, vacations, parties (good ones), adult hobbies, movies, stage and musical shows, etc., for the adults, and dinner is no longer the everyday meeting place for family members, and parents’ emphasis is on getting a college degree and making a good salary above all else, and the media hammers away at the American dream of a good job (or better) and a loving mate as the answers to one’s happiness, and religion becomes a minimum requirement of Mass on Sunday and holy days, (God won’t damn me if a miss a few) and no meat of Fridays during Lent (if I remember), – Is it any wonder that there are so few vocations? America has become one enormous distraction. If you go with the flow, and if God does not intervene in the circumstances of your life, America is designed to titillate you, entertain you, enthrall you, entice you, amuse you, feed you, comfort you, educate you, challenge you, interest you, excite you, deceive you, reward you, satisfy you, and in all things make you complacent from the cradle to the grave. There is not one mention of religion except maybe Thanksgiving, in all the secular media and plethora of secular activities we enjoy. Why would anyone growing up in America want to become a priest. The priesthood is a contradiction to everything we are being taught. The problem is systemic. If we don’t wake up, I am sure that God will provide us with a wake up call. Let’s pray that in this year of faith, that the new evangelization that Pope Benedict called for, will begin to take root, grow, and blossom in our generation. These really are desperate times we live in, and I don’t mean the economy.

You are absolutely right! But it isn’t just america it is europe as well. It is our entire world.
For the sake of His sorrowful passion, Have mercy on us and on the whole world.

 

[shelby_sun]

That is incredibly sad.
In our youth group alone we usually have one former student or core member go to Seminary a year. That is from a pool of about 60-100 young men.
I live in a liberal diocese but we have an orthodox youth program. We bring in young priests to talk about vocations, we bring in the vocations director for our diocese. We pray in adoration at youth nights for vocations.

BUT in our Catholic high school it is much like you describe. In fact many of the kids in our youth program who struggle with their faith the most come from the Catholic High school.
There is definitely something to your observation.
One thing Pope Francis is already doing is being a Pope that the youth will be able to understand.
World Youth day this year will be an incredibly interesting event. It has potential to absolutely fail or succeed like no other.
This Pope, in a country that is right next to his home. With millions of youth.
I think it will define this Papacy. For better or worse.

The school I spoke of is a Jesuit high school. It is not sad at all. The vast majority of our boys are fine young men who are very well thought of in the larger community. Non Catholics who send their sons there are over whelmed by how good our students are as Men for Others. We are in a large materialistic city and these kids focus more on serving others than on keeping up with the Jones’. Just because they are not becoming priest doesn’t mean they are not Christ like. I am very proud to be a part of our school.

 

[Moore11]

The school I spoke of is a Jesuit high school. It is not sad at all. The vast majority of our boys are fine young men who are very well thought of in the larger community. Non Catholics who send their sons there are over whelmed by how good our students are as Men for Others. We are in a large materialistic city and these kids focus more on serving others than on keeping up with the Jones’. Just because they are not becoming priest doesn’t mean they are not Christ like. I am very proud to be a part of our school.

Oh, I misunderstood. It must just be our local high school.

 

[Serap]

There was no need to make that personal. I will say that if I were blessed with a child (a son), I would most definitely encourage the priesthood in whatever way that I could do so.

I would not. I am just being honest.

 

[shelby_sun]

I would not. I am just being honest.

Must be. Is that necessary.

 

[matutemats]

In reality, this is not even all that accurate. If they had been to South America in recent years, they would know that the Church is on the run there. I spent a few weeks in Brazil not that long ago. Everywhere I went there were new protestant Churches springing up, mostly Assembly of God, but some others as well. Masses were less than half full, with the exception of a shrine that we visited. The number of Catholics is dropping there faster than it is the rest of the world. Those that actually do stay Christians are becoming Protestant at an alarming rate, while many are just becoming secularized. Those Catholics that are staying Catholic dissent from Church teachings in a number of predictable areas. I am not entirely sure what the percentage of faithful orthodox Catholics would be in South America, or even in Brazil specifically, but it is very low indeed, probably about the same as anywhere else.

In short, anyone who think that South America is some sort of bastion of Catholicism is sadly and highly mistaken. I wish it were true, but it isn’t.

The Church is retreating on all fronts. Yet, the South American is still the one that can at least halt the advance due to Francis location. Yeah, stupid the way of thinking that only because his from my country, my fellow countrymen will start going to Church, but everyone seems to forget that South America, except for Chile and Colombia have a large percentage of uneducated people. Argentina is at an educational crisis, regardless what the government says. So, although as stupid as it may seem, Churches in Argentina are flourishing. Easter was, wow, more people than ever. Francis is proving everyday to teach us new things. Everyday my priest talks about him at mass. Alas, that is just my report from Argentina. I don’t know how it looks from the outside world.

 

[matutemats]

The picture is from June 19, 2006 at the Third Fraternal Encounter of the Renewed Communion of Evangelicals and Catholics

Notice the dude in the long brown habit with the cord around his waist? Notice everyone is looking at him? That is Fr. Raniero Cantalamessa (yup…Catholic priest), he is the one giving the blessing. What the other non-Catholics are doing during a Catholic blessing is irrelevant.

Media invention for orthodox Catholics to be reluctant. Context is important. Geez, it’s incredible how suspicious everyone is here. You evidently don’t know Pope Bergoglio.

 

[matutemats]

That is why I said that we don’t know the context, so I am giving the Pope the benefit of the doubt.

It comes down to what his intent was during that time. If his intent was to be blessed merely by the priest who was present, then we have no issues other than the potential to give scandal through the situation, which could have been avoided by turning towards the priest, etc. However, if the intent was to receive a blessing from others, then the situation is quite different. Perhaps there is a third option where he did not ask for a blessing but rather for them to pray for God to bless him, as he did yesterday in Rome. In that case, things would be even better yet, with the exception of the unfortunate picture.

Just don’t yet yourself tangled in that. Accept that the Church is universal, and one of it’s missions is to unite Christians throughout the world. You know what? Presbyterian and Baptist friends approached me to ask me further regarding the Catholic Church and ‘what we do’. It is a promising message.

 

[matutemats]

That statement makes me very happy. It takes a humble man of God to admit mistakes.

Congratulations. There must be more people like you in these forums. Here there is a lot of skepticism, and I just can’t see why forum users can’t admire our Holy Father’s humbleness.

 

[Moore11]

You don’t understand how I pray and hope that Franics will be to populism in South America like JPII was to communism in Poland.
Happy Easter.

That would be a great thing! But does that mean that each country that has gone astray needs a Pope from it to change? If so there are not enough Popes to help our world.

 

[Moore11]

I want to tell all fellow Catholics in this forum. Do not believe anything that is said about the Dirty War. It is a long complicated subject, were we had a military junta and communist guerrilla. Long story short, military in prison, guerrilla in government. So they victimize themselves, and make it look as if the junta was the worst thing ever, which it was, but, justice at halves is not justice. The issue here is that they portray themselves as an idealist youth. They do not portray the truth. Assassins. Terrorists. Killers. Kidnappers.
History is written by victors. Sadly.
God bless and happy easter!

Don’t worry most of us are quite familiar with a media with an agenda against the Church. Didn’t you know we had a Nazi Pope?

Do not believe anything that is said about the Dirty War

Does that include what you just posted.

 

[matutemats]

Why does everybody have to read into everything?

He’d be in a hell of a position if old Joe walked up to him and stuck his hands out to receive the Holy Eucharist.

I’m just exhausted of everybody freaking out over Francis.

Completely. I don’t know how, but everyone is freaking out. Everyone.

 

[Mariem2]

Completely. I don’t know how, but everyone is freaking out. Everyone.

Not everyone - just those who take pleasure in it. (Possible grave matter?)

Just get out your tin hat because the honeymoon is over and the media have had plenty of mileage from covering the pageantry. Now they need to dish dirt to garner an audience and they never let the truth get in the way of a good story. The time for us Catholics to worry is when he pleases the secular media because that could be an indication that our Pope isn’t Catholic.

 

[matutemats]

The Latin (official) version @Pontifex_ln is now working well too.

(You can use the google translator as an aid.)

Official? According to what they wanted to do at the Vatican, the official would be the English language, as @pontifex is in English. Then, you got several others, my favorite, @pontifex_es in Spanish. I follow both.
Is the Vatican official language Latin?
Happy Easter! God bless,