"We only hear one side of the story"

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I think that reading this made my blood pressure go up a bit.
Yes, I am imagining that DarkLight has a mother very much like my own, and reading the comments her mother says to her makes me queasy and shaky. This is NOT the common difficulties of mother-adult daughter relationships. This is a situation where I am reading about constant manipulation, guilt-tripping, gas-lighting, emotional abuse, criticisms, and quite possibly, narcissism and/or sociopathy. The mother is pulling out the stops to keep her independent daughter under her thumb. It is frankly a dangerous situation. It has taken me two years of no visits and extremely minimal contact to be able to clearly see and deflect my mother’s torpedoes. It is not easy to recover from such treatment when it is still ongoing on a regular basis.

DarkLight,
Please be careful and gentle with yourself. And keep reading those good books. God bless you.
 
Actually, the best deflection for that is to say, “you may have a point, I will think about it.” SEE be noncommittal without actually in her face. Nothing she can say back. Then keep saying, “I will think about it.” Broken record is a great thing. LOL
I had the impression that there is no response that this mother would find puts her in a “nothing she can say back” position. For instance, I would expect her to say, in somewhere between an hour and a day, “Well? Have you thought about it? What do you think?” Sometimes being a broken record yourself does not make it easier to have to listen to one. In that case, it is best to take the needle off, turn the knob to “off,” and kick the plug out of the socket. 😃 (You have to laugh, or you will cry…)
 
Last spring I saw a talk with a very big name wearing a purple plaid top, unbuttoned down to his chest with no undershirt, with the sleeves unbuttoned and hanging loose Not rolled up mind, just hanging there. My field will forgive about anything if you can write a good paper.

Seriously, my default work wardrobe is a black skirt of some variety and a niceish dark-toned top, along with dyed black hair. Does tend towards monochrome, which is what my mother complains about - but really my basic wardrobe would be acceptable in a far more conservative industry than I’m actually in. I don’t know of any employer that would care if my wardrobe is lacking in light tones.

x

Yeah with someone like my mother that’s probably the right response. Though I’ve had some luck with the spock stare…quietly look at her with one eyebrow raised. But seriously, with someone like her justifying your position is really only an invitation to discuss it more. And the conversation’s going to end with the dreaded “well you’ll realize I was right when you get older,” no matter what arguments you put forth. I really hate that phrase.
I like the “are we in 5th grade?” stare, too, but Spock works. The main thing is that you are confidently expressing yourself.

If you dress like “Gordon” on the phone commercials, that is your business. You’ll have a harder time finding a job, but if you don’t complain to me, it is not too much to ask for me to leave you alone about it.

I would suggest, however, that you make a mental note not to resist any suggestion someone makes that agrees with your mom, as this would be an entirely natural response on your part. Still, you know that even a blind pig finds an acorn once in awhile.! The less you listen to your mom’s suggestions at all, the better, because it will poison you to considering what might have been good suggestions before they became fodder for “See? I told you so! You listen to So-and-So, but let me say it and you never listen to me…” You don’t need that.

When she says, “You’ll realize I was right…” you can say, "The point is not whether you are right or wrong! Why can’t you get that? The point is that I am sick to death of getting unsolicited opinions from you! The biggest opinion I’m hearing is that you don’t think I have the sense of a rabbit or the fashion sense of a hedgehog!! The only things you ever compliment me about are things that I don’t do any more!! Funny, back when I used to do it, I never heard a word!

"If I had a coloring book, you’d have had to pick it out for me for it to be a good one. Then you’d have to stand there over my shoulder and pick out what colors I should use and where and how hard I should press down and oops, then you’d have to point out where I’d gone over the line and tell me how I’d gone and ruined it, and so on. Then you’d have the gall to act hurt and surprised and tell me how ungrateful I am when I stomped off and didn’t want to ‘color’ with you any more!

“I want you out of my coloring box, Mom. I want you to hold your tongue until I ask for your opinion, because you have given me enough opinions to last me a lifetime!! If you like picking out clothes, great–pick your own clothes! If you have career advice you don’t know what to do with, great–go to school, become a guidance counsellor! Just making my decisions for me! I’ve had it, I’m done with it! No more!!”

Now, you have to judge for yourself whether it will do a bit of good to lay the law down like that. “Do not toss your pearls before swine…”
 
“I don’t want you to think about it, I want you to do something about it.”
“Uhuh that just means you’re blowing me off”
“You said that last time, you’ve had plenty of time to think”
“Mom, we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.”
 
“I don’t want you to think about it, I want you to do something about it.”
“Uhuh that just means you’re blowing me off”
“You said that last time, you’ve had plenty of time to think”
Seems like she always has a come-back. Time to say, 'sorry you get so upset but that’s my answer."
 
This is a situation where I am reading about constant manipulation, guilt-tripping, gas-lighting, emotional abuse, criticisms, and quite possibly, narcissism and/or sociopathy. The mother is pulling out the stops to keep her independent daughter under her thumb.
Agreed. I am pretty horrified by it as well.

It is difficult to see things clearly in such a situation and to do something about it. I hope that Dark Light has begun the process of accepting the reality, which will hopefully soon lead her to emancipate herself mentally and emotionally from her mother.
 
Eh, she’s good on most things. The trouble is, once she latches onto something, it’s near impossible for her to either change her mind or drop it. I’m finally slowly starting to get through to her on clothing after several years, and that really was a pretty ridiculous battle. A mother trying to get her daughter out of longer skirts and into shorts? I thought I’d have to show up in one of the outfits I see on campus!
 
Eh, she’s good on most things. The trouble is, once she latches onto something, it’s near impossible for her to either change her mind or drop it. I’m finally slowly starting to get through to her on clothing after several years, and that really was a pretty ridiculous battle. A mother trying to get her daughter out of longer skirts and into shorts? I thought I’d have to show up in one of the outfits I see on campus!
In that case, you’re dealing with someone who is opinionated and stubborn in her opinions. In the cases I know, the best way to deal with it is by a combination of a sense of humor and, well, ignoring her inappropriate bids to run your life. She won’t like it, but giving yourself permission to handle it this way will make it easier for you. Try counting how many sitcoms are based on a mother or father character who constantly butts in and cannot be pleased, and you will know how much company you are in. Many comics were driven into comedy by their need to cope with the frustrations of their upbringing and family life!! They find their solace in how many in their audience howl in recognition of exactly the same problems. Maybe not everyone has a mom like that, but nearly everyone knows some poor soul who does!! (Again: You gotta laugh, or you’ll cry yourself to death.)

As for trying to please someone who cannot be pleased, you have permission to stop trying. Try to do the right thing instead of her thing. Consult with a trusted third party to guide you away from the Gospel According to Mom and towards reality, meet the standards you identify for how one ought to treat your flavor of difficult mother, and let God handle how badly she handles it. May the angels come to guard you!

If your consultations with a trusted guide lead you to believe that your mother is guilty of more than venial levels of toxicity, that is a problem beyond. Get serious help with that, and do not delay. Every day you don’t is a day of your life wasted.
 
Seriously, my default work wardrobe is a black skirt of some variety and a niceish dark-toned top, along with dyed black hair. Does tend towards monochrome, which is what my mother complains about - but really my basic wardrobe would be acceptable in a far more conservative industry than I’m actually in. I don’t know of any employer that would care if my wardrobe is lacking in light tones.
My sister in law dresses like that for her very well paid government job. 🙂
 
My sister in law dresses like that for her very well paid government job. 🙂
The irony is, for all my mother hates my “immature” style, I actually dress the way I do partly because it does look more mature. If I step into jeans and a t-shirt I get asked what grade I’m in, or worse (“You have it so easy at your age” :rolleyes:).

But seriously, my big problem is she takes unable to drop a subject to a whole new level. Bringing it up over and over again, seeing any sort of argument as rude, treating any sort of deflection as though it were a victory (and thus further ammo), and so forth.
 
The irony is, for all my mother hates my “immature” style, I actually dress the way I do partly because it does look more mature. If I step into jeans and a t-shirt I get asked what grade I’m in, or worse (“You have it so easy at your age” :rolleyes:).

But seriously, my big problem is she takes unable to drop a subject to a whole new level. Bringing it up over and over again, seeing any sort of argument as rude, treating any sort of deflection as though it were a victory (and thus further ammo), and so forth.
Have you ever heard of “perseveration”?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perseveration

projectlearnet.org/tutorials/perseveration.html
 
Do you think it’ll help to speak with another lady (around your mom’s age) and ask her opinion? She may provide some new perspectives. My mom went through an obsessive phase as well and in the end I found out that it was menopause that was causing all the mood swings & emotional outbursts.
 
Do you think it’ll help to speak with another lady (around your mom’s age) and ask her opinion? She may provide some new perspectives. My mom went through an obsessive phase as well and in the end I found out that it was menopause that was causing all the mood swings & emotional outbursts.
Eh, my impression is less that she’s changed and more that she hasn’t changed in the last 15 years. She continues to act as though I were a little girl in need of her correction. The best way I can explain it is that she still acts as though I were a teenager who needed her permission, and getting mad at me for disobeying her. She often in these issues accuses me of contradicting her or talking back or being rebellious, accusations which seem to me more appropriate to a child.

I guess that’s my thing. She may pick her battles rather than going after everything, but she still seems to behave as though she is the one who gets to decide where to let go and where to put her foot down.
 
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