We still need forgiveness?

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littlesoul said:
Why not? Because we are are not outside of time? I think my brain is too small to comprehend this stuff lol

ps: I’m on depression medications so…(could explain some of my lack of understanding 😛 )

Is it kind of like, Jesus forgave us once and we keep accepting it and rejecting it over and over?
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Yes, essentially. He offered forgiveness for all sin, throughout all of time, that we would ever commit, and that WE WOULD ATONE FOR. We still have free will, and after we receive forgiveness, we still choose to sin. It is a struggle, a ‘race’ as Paul puts it, that we must get through. Christ died for our sins, but He cannot forgive us if we will not allow it. We have free will.

While Christ’s Passion happened once in history, the grace and mercy transcended time. He died for all sin. Yet He did not die so that we could sin all we want. When we sin, we freely reject His mercy. He always waits for us to return. This is why confession exists: so that, upon choosing to reject Him, we can again choose to return to the covenant.

A good example would be the prodigal son. The son left freely. The father already desired the return of his son, and desperately so, but the son actually had to physically return home to accept the forgiveness. Otherwise he would have died, shut off from his father. So it is with us. Now picture this, except continually throughout our lives. We make the choice to turn away, and we must always make the choice to return, even if He is always ready to take us in. We have to accept it.
 
littlesoul said:
So, Christ dying on the cross, has made us worthy to have our sins forgiven?
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No, Christ dying on the cross has won infinite merits to be applied to sin and graces.

We are free to choose whether we want to accept these merits to be applied for our sins i.e. be forgiven.

We are made worthy of receiving sacraments (like confession through which we obtain the graces through the merits Christ has won) when we are baptized i.e. become God’s children.
 
Eufrosnia said:
I think the above bolded part is causing the confusion. We have NOT been already forgiven for our future sins. The correct statement is that Christ has already merited to forgive the eternal punishment for ALL OUR SINS. His atonement on the cross has infinite merit.

But we have been given the FREE-WILL to decide on whether we want to accept or reject the merits of Christ in atonement for our own sins. We exercise our free-will to accept by going to confession (I assume we are talking about mortal sins here). It is only after confession that our sins are forgiven (in the sense of eternal punishment).
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This is a great way of explaining it! Christ has offered us forgiveness for our sins (paid for by His blood, the perfect Sacrifice). They are not forgiven until we accept His mercy.
 
Cristiano said:
The answer to your last question is yes, you are correct. Medication for depression could somehow affect the promptness of understanding in a conversation; however, it seems to me that you are simply going through what a lot of other people go through when they try to deepen their religious understanding. Your questions are quite acute and sadly I doubt that a lot of cradle Catholics ask them because they really do not care. Do not underestimate your brain it looks to me that right now it is working in the right gear, you simply do not have a lot of experience from dwelling into apologetics. If you were to listen to my first unskilled arguments, probably you would have been tempted to ask “Where is this heretic moron coming from?”
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Thank you 🙂 I think God has blessed me with a wonderful, curious mind which sometimes I get frustrated with because I know other people get frustrated with me 🙂 I need to remember how God has blessed me instead of worrying about what other people sometimes think.
 
Eufrosnia said:
I think the above bolded part is causing the confusion. We have NOT been already forgiven for our future sins. The correct statement is that Christ has already merited to forgive the eternal punishment for ALL OUR SINS. His atonement on the cross has infinite merit.

But we have been given the FREE-WILL to decide on whether we want to accept or reject the merits of Christ in atonement for our own sins. We exercise our free-will to accept by going to confession (I assume we are talking about mortal sins here). It is only after confession that our sins are forgiven (in the sense of eternal punishment).
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You are correct if you say that forgiveness comes from atonement and acceptance. I used the word forgiveness in a non rigorous manner in order to avoid further confusion in addressing kronos and eternity. The point I was trying to make is that God’s mind is eternal thus unchangeable, the only thing that can change is our set of sequential choices in our time, but he already knows and so he has already forgiven or not before all times depending on how we will address his mercy and his justice.
 
So,

Jesus died on the cross for our sins.
We accept His forgiveness
We sin. (We reject His forgiveness)
We go to confession (We again accept His forgiveness)

Is this correct?
 
littlesoul said:
So,

Jesus died on the cross for our sins.
We accept His forgiveness
We sin. (We reject His forgiveness)
We go to confession (We again accept His forgiveness)

Is this correct?
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Yes, that is the bottom line. Just remember that you do not have to be an expert apologist or a theologian to go to heaven, things can be pretty simple as long as love drives you.
 
littlesoul said:
Why not? Because we are are not outside of time? I think my brain is too small to comprehend this stuff lol

ps: I’m on depression medications so…(could explain some of my lack of understanding 😛 )

Is it kind of like, Jesus forgave us once and we keep accepting it and rejecting it over and over?
Click to expand...
Do you sin over and over? I do. It is that fact which confession of sins addresses in meeting each sin, and the forgiveness we require through our actions which have no hpe of ending without Grace of the Eucharist and Absolution. After all what do all heretics share among the diversity of their beliefs, seperation from the Eucharist and Confession. Tells you how important satan knows these sacraments are.
 
littlesoul said:
Seems this should be obvious to me by now, but why again do we still need to confess our sins even though Jesus died for them?
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Because we keep sinning.

1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
 
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