Weddings we shouldn't attend?

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It is scandal. And applies to marrying without approval of the Church where at least one is Catholic.

Catholic Doors wrote:

By attending such a marriage, you are giving your seal of approval to the Catholic who is getting married, silently saying that what he is about to do is okay. By attending such a marriage, you become guilty of his sin. One can sin many ways as is seen below:
(1) By counsel (if you advised him to go ahead with the marriage);
(2) By command;
(3) By consent (if you agreed it is alright);
(4) By provocation;
(5) By praise or flattery;
(6) By concealment;
(7) By partaking (if you attended);
(8) By silence (if you said nothing about the rejection of his faith);
(9) By defense of the ill done (by defending his action).
What if you say something about the rejection of faith, but still attend(because it’s family, and you have to. Otherwise, it would cause huge problems)? Would that still be a sin?
I plan on having a Star Wars wedding myself, or a Planet of the Apes wedding, or Lord of the Rings. I think it will be up to my future wife to decide which one is best for us.
Since apparently getting married by a sea captain isn’t a sacramental wedding. I think the rest of these are ok

Cheers! 👍
Good luck with that! 😃
Yeah, good luck with that! 😃
 
What if you say something about the rejection of faith, but still attend(because it’s family, and you have to. Otherwise, it would cause huge problems)? Would that still be a sin?

Yeah, good luck with that! 😃
The difficulty with scandal is that is may be given intentionally or unintentionally. It really depends upon how weak the scandalized are. It does not help to confirm a fallen-away Catholic in a union not approved by the Catholic Church.
 
It does not help to confirm a fallen-away Catholic in a union not approved by the Catholic Church.
Right. So I suppose I’m in a situation that I really should speak with a priest about? (I’ve been busy lately, so I haven’t been able to call him yet)
 
If you can’t attend a wedding of a very close friend or family member because it is not valid in the eyes of the Catholic church, and attending would be showing “support”…then it also stands to reason that you should not interact with this friend or loved one in any way at all…because that, also, shows support of who they are and how they are living their life.

In other words, if you cannot attend the wedding of your divorced brother who is remarrying, but did not get his first marriage annulled…then it also seems wrong to invite your brother over for Christmas dinner with his second wife and their children…or for you to go to their home for Thanksgiving. Etc, etc, etc.
In doing so, you are still showing support for them as a couple.

If you are going to have a relationship with them as a married couple, and intend to love them and interact with them as family, then go to the wedding!

If you are going to “shun” who they are and the ceremony in which they marry the person they love, you might as well shun them forever. Not going to their wedding is pretty much making that statement.
That’s a really good point. Thanks!
 
Right. So I suppose I’m in a situation that I really should speak with a priest about? (I’ve been busy lately, so I haven’t been able to call him yet)
Sounds like a good idea. It does take time to understand it.

There are people that give scandal. For example, to contribute to a bachelor party with strippers, invite an alcoholic to a party with alcohol, take somebody to get an abortion or to be sterilized, etc.
 
I presume that there would be a formal invitation to attend the wedding and a request
to respond (RSVP). At that time it would be appropriate to respectfully decline the invitation with an explanation that in conformity with Church teaching, you may not attend. If that
person came from a Catholic tradition, they should be able to understand that it is your conscious decision. The Good News is that salvation is available through conformity with the will of God as opposed to “Yipee, Jesus came. He loves everybody. Good luck.”
By attending, you are promoting the same mediocrity as’’ everyone receives a trophy for showing up at the game’’.
 
There are people that give scandal. For example, to contribute to a bachelor party with strippers, invite an alcoholic to a party with alcohol, take somebody to get an abortion or to be sterilized, etc.
So supporting a non-valid marriage is essentially the same as taking someone to get an abortion?
I presume that there would be a formal invitation to attend the wedding and a request
to respond (RSVP). At that time it would be appropriate to respectfully decline the invitation with an explanation that in conformity with Church teaching, you may not attend. If that
person came from a Catholic tradition, they should be able to understand that it is your conscious decision. The Good News is that salvation is available through conformity with the will of God as opposed to “Yipee, Jesus came. He loves everybody. Good luck.”
By attending, you are promoting the same mediocrity as’’ everyone receives a trophy for showing up at the game’’.
If my sibling was homosexual, then there would be no way I could bring myself to attend the wedding. But since he was married before and is technically committing adultery, it’s still wrong. I just don’t want to destroy our relationship. That makes sense, right?
 
So supporting a non-valid marriage is essentially the same as taking someone to get an abortion?

If my sibling was homosexual, then there would be no way I could bring myself to attend the wedding. But since he was married before and is technically committing adultery, it’s still wrong. I just don’t want to destroy our relationship. That makes sense, right?
The non-valid marriage is called an invalid attempt, it is non-existent for a Catholic. If the Catholic is ignorant then it would not be a mortal sin, even though it is a grave matter.

Our setting of a bad example is our own sin, and when the scandal involves a grave matter, it may be mortal sin.

A study of St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica, on the topic of scandal yields:

Accidental active scandal:
  • is venial when a venial sin scandalizes
  • is venial when only the appearance of evil scandalizes, where there is insufficient reason to act and to permit the fault of another
  • is mortal if mortal sin scandalizes another to mortal sin
  • is mortal if one will not forgo for the sake of the scandalized that which is sinful neither in itself nor in appearance, because he has such contempt for his neighbor’s spiritual welfare

    Direct active scandal:
  • Intention of a venial sin leading another into venial sin is then a venial sin.
  • Intention of a mortal sin leading another into mortal or venial sin is then a mortal sin.
newadvent.org/summa/3043.htm#article6
 
The non-valid marriage is called an invalid attempt, it is non-existent for a Catholic. If the Catholic is ignorant then it would not be a mortal sin, even though it is a grave matter.

Our setting of a bad example is our own sin, and when the scandal involves a grave matter, it may be mortal sin.

A study of St. Thomas Aquinas, Summa Theologica, on the topic of scandal yields:

Accidental active scandal:
  • is venial when a venial sin scandalizes
  • is venial when only the appearance of evil scandalizes, where there is insufficient reason to act and to permit the fault of another
  • is mortal if mortal sin scandalizes another to mortal sin
  • is mortal if one will not forgo for the sake of the scandalized that which is sinful neither in itself nor in appearance, because he has such contempt for his neighbor’s spiritual welfare

    Direct active scandal:
  • Intention of a venial sin leading another into venial sin is then a venial sin.
  • Intention of a mortal sin leading another into mortal or venial sin is then a mortal sin.
newadvent.org/summa/3043.htm#article6
I have a son who is gay. If he were getting married I am his mother, I will attend. I don’t see myself having a central role or standing up with him but I would certainly attend. If he decided he wanted to join the church, amend his life I would want that relationship to be there. I attend Mass daily but do not live in the community where I go to Church. I have never had a case where I’ve run into a Church member at a wedding. Knowing my son, he would never have the wedding in the town where the Church is located (too rural for him) so scandal would not be an option and I certainly wouldn’t announce it at my parish.
 
What you are saying is if your son announced that he was going to committ suicide
and that he would like you to go to the top of the cliff with him so that someone would be at his side when he died, you would be willing, or that he would like you to pick a spot where he could committ suicide out of the view of anybody you knew, you would be willing.
What you have essentially said is that you are expected to understand your son, however you do not expect him to understand you. One more thought: Love your neighbor as yourself means you must love yourself first, before you are able to love your neighbor. God loves you so much, that He expects you to love yourself. Looking sideways at His natural laws is lacking in love for yourself.
 
If you can’t attend a wedding of a very close friend or family member because it is not valid in the eyes of the Catholic church, and attending would be showing “support”…then it also stands to reason that you should not interact with this friend or loved one in any way at all…because that, also, shows support of who they are and how they are living their life.

In other words, if you cannot attend the wedding of your divorced brother who is remarrying, but did not get his first marriage annulled…then it also seems wrong to invite your brother over for Christmas dinner with his second wife and their children…or for you to go to their home for Thanksgiving. Etc, etc, etc.
In doing so, you are still showing support for them as a couple.

If you are going to have a relationship with them as a married couple, and intend to love them and interact with them as family, then go to the wedding!

If you are going to “shun” who they are and the ceremony in which they marry the person they love, you might as well shun them forever. Not going to their wedding is pretty much making that statement.
This argument doesn’t work for several reasons. The biggest of which of course is that going over to a person’s house for Christmas Dinner, or having conversation with a person is not a Sacrament.

Marriage on the other hand is a Sacrament.

The biggest problem with attending any invalid attempt at matrimony is that it is a form of Sacrilege. For a Catholic to knowingly support the Sacrilege of one of the Sacraments is potentially grave matter.

It is comparable to looking on approvingly as a friend or relative tosses the Eucharist into a dumpster while not saying anything in protest or attempting to stop them.
 
I plan on having a Star Wars wedding myself, or a Planet of the Apes wedding, or Lord of the Rings. I think it will be up to my future wife to decide which one is best for us.
Since apparently getting married by a sea captain isn’t a sacramental wedding. I think the rest of these are ok

Cheers! 👍
Well I did see a Star Trek wedding at the Las Vegas Hilton about eight years ago. They have a section of the casino with a Star Trek theme, but this was over the top.
 
This argument doesn’t work for several reasons. The biggest of which of course is that going over to a person’s house for Christmas Dinner, or having conversation with a person is not a Sacrament.

Marriage on the other hand is a Sacrament.

The biggest problem with attending any invalid attempt at matrimony is that it is a form of Sacrilege. For a Catholic to knowingly support the Sacrilege of one of the Sacraments is potentially grave matter.

It is comparable to looking on approvingly as a friend or relative tosses the Eucharist into a dumpster while not saying anything in protest or attempting to stop them.
Exactly.
 
This argument doesn’t work for several reasons. The biggest of which of course is that going over to a person’s house for Christmas Dinner, or having conversation with a person is not a Sacrament.

Marriage on the other hand is a Sacrament.

The biggest problem with attending any invalid attempt at matrimony is that it is a form of Sacrilege. For a Catholic to knowingly support the Sacrilege of one of the Sacraments is potentially grave matter.

It is comparable to looking on approvingly as a friend or relative tosses the Eucharist into a dumpster while not saying anything in protest or attempting to stop them.
OK let me make this clear. I’m a 50 year old granny and I’ve raised three sons. You are NOT supporting anything by simply attending unless you SAY you are supporting it. I have seen hundreds of weddings and almost every wedding has those people who say, “I don’t give them 6 months” and yet…they are attending.

My oldest son died in a horrific accident. That event colored and shaped my other two sons in many ways. My middle son went through hell on earth. He ended up making some very bad choices. He hooked up with a drug addicted topless dancer and they were getting married. What was I to do? His dad and I talked until we were blue in the face about not marrying her. They were already living together and had bought a really expensive house. I don’t condemn this woman at all, she was horribly damaged but the idea of my son (who was 8 years younger than her) making this decision tore me apart.

Yes I attended the wedding. I wanted my son to know that no matter what he did I would be beside him and I ESPECIALLY will stand beside my children when they do something like this because when it all falls apart, I want them to know they can come to me. To sever the ties of my biological children from me is NOT what I would do. He knew that I didn’t approve but I was not going to refuse to attend. In a lovely little twist…they never filed the marriage license with the court, it was done by a justice of the peace, and…she took off after the “beautiful wedding” was over and my son came to me and I welcomed him with open arms.

My youngest son is gay. If he got “married” I would know that it’s not valid in my heart but, again, I will sit there and let him know that if he needs me, I am there.

Grown children make mistakes, sometimes HUGE mistakes. If parents can be off to the side (after endless conversation–believe me) and say, “I don’t agree with this but I love you and I’m here because I love you” then when it all falls down they know they can come to you.

My son’s friend shot himself in the head because his family “wrote him off” when he married a gal. I don’t know the whole situation but when she left him high and dry he felt he had “let his parents down” and shot himself in the head. That is a forever decision with eternal consequences. I don’t want to see my children feeling that they could never come to me and say, “You were right, I screwed up. I need you mom” and not be there. I will attend, but I do not give my blessing. BIG DIFFERENCE. Key is that you try to steer them right so that they understand where you are, but you don’t slam the door in case they wake up and want to change.

It’s easy to rant and rave about how you would “show them” how holy you are. But I lost a son in 1996 in a horrific car wreck. You never know the horror of lonely until you see if on a tombstone. It’s final then…at least in this life. Watch your actions, you may come to regret them. I know that God understands I’m trying to win my sons. You don’t win them by being an arrogant, better-than-thou ***.

I have attended many weddings that I KNEW were doomed, but you never know how God can work. So why not sit there and pray? They will remember you were there and they may call you and say, “So many people refused to come to my wedding but you were there. I know you didn’t agree with what I did, but I need help.” Don’t you want to keep that door open? In the case of my children that is what I did and it worked. It really worked. My son is doing MUCH better and realizes the horrible mistake he made. Thankfully since the license was never filed he was never legally or religiously married. A civil wedding with no license is not valid legally or religiously. He is not Catholic, by the way. I’m a convert and my boys are Christian but fallen away. I am loving them to God and praying for them.

That’s my 2 cents, now time to go get a refill on my coffee.

God bless you all,

Lorrie
 
Right. So I suppose I’m in a situation that I really should speak with a priest about? (I’ve been busy lately, so I haven’t been able to call him yet)
This is the best way to go in ANY circumstance involving an invalid wedding ceremony. It comes down to seeking the counsel of a priest and/or spiritual advisor because it certainly can be a case by case situation if a Catholic should attend a certain wedding or not. Its not a black and white decision. No one can say with absolute certainty that its a decision that a Catholic should attend all weddings regardless of the invalidity or that they should never attend an invalid wedding ceremony. There are certainly times not attending an invalid marriage would be advised by one’s priest and vice versa. There are many factors to consider in each situation to arrive at the decision. Its a decision that shouldn’t be based just on one’s feelings, what one thinks Jesus would do, etc. etc. Its about seeking counsel and discerning what is best for all involved in the situation. I’ve been advised by my priest to attend and NOT attend an invalid wedding when the situation has popped up in my family. Its not a decision that should be made on one’s own or based on what others would do.
 
God bless you all,

Lorrie
When my ex-husband was alive, my mom an evangelical , told me that if I ever remarried, she could not attend the wedding.

I totally understood that.

That didn’t mean that she didn’t love me. It meant that in her belief system, remarriage is sinful. I should and did understand that.

When her best friend remarried, she didn’t attend the wedding, but they remained friends and her friend understood that she could count on her for anything, besides that.

If I had a gay child who was having a marriage ceremony, I would tell her that I love her but I cannot condone the behavior. I wouldn’t treat her differently after the marriage, she would still get all the love that she was used to getting from me.

Would I visit her at her house? Sure. Would I allow her and her “wife” to sleep together in the same bed if they were visiting my home? No. My gay child hopefully would know me enough to not even try that.

Everyone is different and we all make our own decisions, but I just want to point out that not attending an invalid wedding doesn’t necessarily mean you mess up your relationship with your child.
 
When my ex-husband was alive, my mom an evangelical , told me that if I ever remarried, she could not attend the wedding.

I totally understood that.

That didn’t mean that she didn’t love me. It meant that in her belief system, remarriage is sinful. I should and did understand that.

When her best friend remarried, she didn’t attend the wedding, but they remained friends and her friend understood that she could count on her for anything, besides that.

If I had a gay child who was having a marriage ceremony, I would tell her that I love her but I cannot condone the behavior. I wouldn’t treat her differently after the marriage, she would still get all the love that she was used to getting from me.

Would I visit her at her house? Sure. Would I allow her and her “wife” to sleep together in the same bed if they were visiting my home? No. My gay child hopefully would know me enough to not even try that.

Everyone is different and we all make our own decisions, but I just want to point out that not attending an invalid wedding doesn’t necessarily mean you mess up your relationship with your child.
👍
 
Daddy Girl, you wrote: As for the sacriment part–I have questions:

If someone is getting married in the Catholic church, but you know they are technically sinning (having sex before marriage or using ABC, for example) is that also an “invalid attempt at matrimony” and a sacrilege…and therefore potentially a grave matter if one attends?

And if the wedding the OP specifically wants to attend is not in the Catholic church, is not a Catholic ceremony, and neither groom nor bride are practicing Catholics, is it still considered invalid and a sacrilege?
A1. No, it is not necessary to be in a state of grace to validly receive the sacrament. The Eucharist could not be received in a Matrimonial Mass. The priest may demand a private wedding if the couple are not both in a state of grace, and would likely only allow it in hope that the couple would return to the sacraments.

A2. It is called an invalid attempt at matrimony for a Catholic (by baptism or conversion to Catholic) although non-practicing: matrimony is non-existent. This can scandalize, as well as subsequent cohabitation.

Regarding sacrilege, Father Edward McNamara, professor of liturgy at the Regina Apostolorum university wrote:Marriage, just like confirmation, Eucharist, holy orders and, whenever possible, anointing of the sick, require the state of grace for their fruitful reception.

With respect to validity, however, someone who is married while in a state of mortal sin may be validly married (as they would be validly confirmed, ordained, or validly celebrate Mass). But he/she would not receive the grace proper to this sacrament and indeed commits a further grave sin of sacrilege and renders the sacrament objectively illicit.
ewtn.com/library/liturgy/zlitur230.htm

It can be sinful to do something that scandalizes through an action which is not sinful for you. In that case it is forgone. A biblical example is (Douay-Rheims-Challoner):
Code:
                [[9]](http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=53&ch=8&l=9#x) But take heed lest perhaps this your liberty become a stumblingblock to the weak.                     [[10]](http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=53&ch=8&l=10#x)  For if a man see him that hath knowledge sit at meat in the idol's  temple, shall not his conscience, being weak, be emboldened to eat those  things which are sacrificed to idols?                                          [[11]](http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=53&ch=8&l=11#x) And through thy knowledge shall the weak brother perish, for whom Christ hath died?                     [[12]](http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=53&ch=8&l=12#x) Now when you sin thus against the brethren, and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.                     [[13]](http://www.drbo.org/x/d?b=drb&bk=53&ch=8&l=13#x) Wherefore, if meat scandalize my brother, I will never eat flesh, lest I should scandalize my brother.                     
                 [13] If meat scandalize: That is, if my eating cause my brother to sin.
 
Thanks for the replies, everyone! I really appreciate your help!
This is the best way to go in ANY circumstance involving an invalid wedding ceremony. It comes down to seeking the counsel of a priest and/or spiritual advisor because it certainly can be a case by case situation if a Catholic should attend a certain wedding or not. Its not a black and white decision. No one can say with absolute certainty that its a decision that a Catholic should attend all weddings regardless of the invalidity or that they should never attend an invalid wedding ceremony. There are certainly times not attending an invalid marriage would be advised by one’s priest and vice versa. There are many factors to consider in each situation to arrive at the decision. Its a decision that shouldn’t be based just on one’s feelings, what one thinks Jesus would do, etc. etc. Its about seeking counsel and discerning what is best for all involved in the situation. I’ve been advised by my priest to attend and NOT attend an invalid wedding when the situation has popped up in my family. Its not a decision that should be made on one’s own or based on what others would do.
I’m going to speak with my priest about all this.
Hey Irish Gal…

YOU TOTALLY ROCK!!!
In so many ways!!!
To me, you would be the true definition of what people call “Christian”.
Big, big hug to you.
I totally agree! You really do rock, Lorrie! God Bless! 🙂
 
OK let me make this clear. I’m a 50 year old granny and I’ve raised three sons. You are NOT supporting anything by simply attending unless you SAY you are supporting it. I have seen hundreds of weddings and almost every wedding has those people who say, “I don’t give them 6 months” and yet…they are attending.

My oldest son died in a horrific accident. That event colored and shaped my other two sons in many ways. My middle son went through hell on earth. He ended up making some very bad choices. He hooked up with a drug addicted topless dancer and they were getting married. What was I to do? His dad and I talked until we were blue in the face about not marrying her. They were already living together and had bought a really expensive house. I don’t condemn this woman at all, she was horribly damaged but the idea of my son (who was 8 years younger than her) making this decision tore me apart.

Yes I attended the wedding. I wanted my son to know that no matter what he did I would be beside him and I ESPECIALLY will stand beside my children when they do something like this because when it all falls apart, I want them to know they can come to me. To sever the ties of my biological children from me is NOT what I would do. He knew that I didn’t approve but I was not going to refuse to attend. In a lovely little twist…they never filed the marriage license with the court, it was done by a justice of the peace, and…she took off after the “beautiful wedding” was over and my son came to me and I welcomed him with open arms.

My youngest son is gay. If he got “married” I would know that it’s not valid in my heart but, again, I will sit there and let him know that if he needs me, I am there.

Grown children make mistakes, sometimes HUGE mistakes. If parents can be off to the side (after endless conversation–believe me) and say, “I don’t agree with this but I love you and I’m here because I love you” then when it all falls down they know they can come to you.

My son’s friend shot himself in the head because his family “wrote him off” when he married a gal. I don’t know the whole situation but when she left him high and dry he felt he had “let his parents down” and shot himself in the head. That is a forever decision with eternal consequences. I don’t want to see my children feeling that they could never come to me and say, “You were right, I screwed up. I need you mom” and not be there. I will attend, but I do not give my blessing. BIG DIFFERENCE. Key is that you try to steer them right so that they understand where you are, but you don’t slam the door in case they wake up and want to change.

It’s easy to rant and rave about how you would “show them” how holy you are. But I lost a son in 1996 in a horrific car wreck. You never know the horror of lonely until you see if on a tombstone. It’s final then…at least in this life. Watch your actions, you may come to regret them. I know that God understands I’m trying to win my sons. You don’t win them by being an arrogant, better-than-thou ***.

I have attended many weddings that I KNEW were doomed, but you never know how God can work. So why not sit there and pray? They will remember you were there and they may call you and say, “So many people refused to come to my wedding but you were there. I know you didn’t agree with what I did, but I need help.” Don’t you want to keep that door open? In the case of my children that is what I did and it worked. It really worked. My son is doing MUCH better and realizes the horrible mistake he made. Thankfully since the license was never filed he was never legally or religiously married. A civil wedding with no license is not valid legally or religiously. He is not Catholic, by the way. I’m a convert and my boys are Christian but fallen away. I am loving them to God and praying for them.

That’s my 2 cents, now time to go get a refill on my coffee.

God bless you all,

Lorrie
I am sorry for the loss of your friend’s son, you are in my prayers. I am glad also to hear that your son is doing better than he was.

I am far from being holy nor have I stated that I am going to show someone how holy I am nor am I holier than anyone else here, I am a sinner in need of God’s grace.

Not attending an act of Sacrilege no matter who it is comitted by I think is one of the most loving things a person can do. A civil ceremony btw is not necessarily sacriligeous in any way. True love holds concern for a person’s soul above all else.

I would never stop speaking to someone or reject them as a friend or family member because of their choices. That doesn’t mean I will be there when they actually commit the act, just like I wouldn’t take an alcoholic out to a bar for a round of drinks. Being there as a guest is support in my book. The Church teaching on the subject seems consistent with this from everything I have read.

Attending a wedding that a person “knows is doomed” (which really is impossible btw) is not the same as attending a “marriage” that you know to be invalid, especially the Sacrilege of a homosexual “marriage”. Either Christ’s words were true about marriage or they were not. If they are then we must obey Him.

Sometimes the truth is hard and may come off as harsh to people, but I won’t “love” someone into losing their salvation, no matter if they were my own sibling, parent, or child. I just won’t do it. I believe that this is consistent with Church teaching.

It has nothing to do about my or any else’s personal holiness or lack there of. It has to do with the Holiness of the Sacraments, and God’s precious Grace and how he grants it to us through them.
 
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