Keep reading scripture, but add catechism, church fathers, and Vatican ii documents to your reading list, and various catholic commentaries.Yes, it was helpfull. I should have read that my self, but I have lost my interest in reading anything except The Bible.
At least I know my grandparents are in Heaven, they were Lutherans.
From our Catechism:We Catholics belong to the largest Christian family there is and I am not in any way trying to skip my faith, but I can’t help thinking about this: what happen to all the people who are Lutherans, Methodists and members of other Christian Churches. I mean, if they live as we do, (or are supposed to) and do God’s will they do not sin. It can not be a sin to belong to some other Christian Church, so what happen when they past away, Heaven, Hell or Purgatory?
However, one cannot charge with the sin of the separation those who at present are born into these communities [that resulted from such separation] and in them are brought up in the faith of Christ, and the Catholic Church accepts them with respect and affection as brothers. . . . All who have been justified by faith in Baptism are incorporated into Christ; they therefore have a right to be called Christians, and with good reason are accepted as brothers in the Lord by the children of the Catholic Church."–818
I don’t understand how you can say that. We all like to think our family and loved ones are in Heaven but none of us know where they are. Only God knows that.Yes, it was helpfull. I should have read that my self, but I have lost my interest in reading anything except The Bible.
At least** I know my grandparents are in Heaven**, they were Lutherans.
I really hope no one canonizes me after my death except by way of the official Catholic Church. I want my friends and relatives to pray for me, assuming me to be in Purgatory, not in Heaven.At least I know my grandparents are in Heaven, they were Lutherans.
Everybody brings a “back story,” a bias, an interpretive framework, to their reading of the bible, and all such back stories are in error, except that of the Catholic Church. If you do not read the bible in the light of the Church, you will come to false conclusions, that is a certainty.Yes, it was helpfull. I should have read that my self, but I have lost my interest in reading anything except The Bible.
OK, this is off topic as well, but I start slowly understand that I am not wanted here. And for all what it is worth, I think God judge us by what we have done, not to which Church we belong to. And I did join this forum because it is supposed to be the best. It still is, but why do you treat me harsh? What have I done wrong, except for being honest. Should her not be moderators who try to prevent theese “I don’t like you” things? I don’t understand this. Who told you that you can judge me and assess my faith? And who gave you the right to assume that my grandparents, among all other loved ones, are spending time in hell because they did belong to the Lutheran Church? Did God give you that right? My grandparents, my children, everyone in our family is and was, babtized, so you can stop offending them for being “pagans” as I can read between the lines. I am utterly dissapointed and not sure what to think.I don’t understand how you can say that. We all like to think our family and loved ones are in Heaven but none of us know where they are. Only God knows that.
The Church does not teach Lutherans go to Heaven.
It teaches there is no salvation outside the Catholic Church, that baptism is necessary for salvation and you must die in a state of grace.
Although not all Catholics go to Heaven it means everyone in Heaven is Catholic be that through sacramental baptism, baptism of blood, baptism of desire (explicit) or baptism of desire (implicit/invincible ignorance). However, the Church does not define which individuals or groups of people might be covered by invincible ignorance because it does not know.
Sorry for not being American. I read The Bible every day with thoughts and love. You have gone to far. I do not like being bullied, I don’t do that to others so I think I can ask for a bit of respect. Why do you hate me? I am a new member, yes, but so is many others. I am honest, but I reckon all of you are. So what is the beef?Everybody brings a “back story,” a bias, an interpretive framework, to their reading of the bible, and all such back stories are in error, except that of the Catholic Church. If you do not read the bible in the light of the Church, you will come to false conclusions, that is a certainty.
Why are you being so defensive with everyone? Nobody said your grandparents were in Hell. What I said was that you do not know where they are. Only God knows. I also said that the Church does does teach that Lutherans go to Heaven. It also does not teach that Methodists, Anglicans or any particular group go to Heaven.OK, this is off topic as well, but I start slowly understand that I am not wanted here. And for all what it is worth, I think God judge us by what we have done, not to which Church we belong to. And I did join this forum because it is supposed to be the best. It still is, but why do you treat me harsh? What have I done wrong, except for being honest. Should her not be moderators who try to prevent theese “I don’t like you” things? I don’t understand this. Who told you that you can judge me and assess my faith? And who gave you the right to assume that my grandparents, among all other loved ones, are spending time in hell because they did belong to the Lutheran Church? Did God give you that right? My grandparents, my children, everyone in our family is and was, babtized, so you can stop offending them for being “pagans” as I can read between the lines. I am utterly dissapointed and not sure what to think.
Lutherans do practice valid Christian Baptism. If your grandparents were Baptized as Lutherans, and managed to avoid mortal sin, then they would surely be saved (though perhaps with a temporary detour through purgatory).At least I know my grandparents are in Heaven, they were Lutherans.
Thank you Don. I am not going anywhere. As long as there is life you fight to save it. I am 100 % Catholic, living and practising my faith, loyal to The RCC. If I do something wrong, correct me, but if honesty is a thing that must be corrected, then what?Dear Lasting faith…I understand why you feel unwanted here. Many of the responses to you are unnecessarily harsh. Even though the the information provided may be ‘factually’ correct according to Catholic teaching, it certainly doesn’t seem to be presented in a loving way. Forgive us for our lack of humility. The Catholic faith has soooo much to offer and sometimes people forget that this isn’t facebook… Stay with us!
Don
Nobody is lost in God’s hands, it is the safest place on earth, and we all are in His hands.Lutherans do practice valid Christian Baptism. If your grandparents were Baptized as Lutherans, and managed to avoid mortal sin, then they would surely be saved (though perhaps with a temporary detour through purgatory).
If they fell into mortal sin, they had no ordinary recourse to salvation. As protestants, they had no recourse to Sacramental Confession (or even Extreme Unction).
This raises the question of whether it is easy or hard for a person of good will and intent to fall into a state of mortal sin. If it is easy, then your grandparents (and my own beloved Methodist grandparents) are likely lost. If it is hard, then your grandparents (and mine) are likely saved.
Guess what! The Church does not teach if it is easy or hard for a person of good will and intent to fall into a state of mortal sin.
Being protestant does not remove them from Grace, but it impedes Grace. Protestants may still validly Baptize, but they have no recourse to post-Baptismal mortal sin.
Defensive? What should I do, roll over and play dead when people mess around with my family? I know that they are with God, and how do I do that? Because they were kind, loving and understanding people.Why are you being so defensive with everyone? Nobody said your grandparents were in Hell. What I said was that you do not know where they are. Only God knows. I also said that the Church does does teach that Lutherans go to Heaven. It also does not teach that Methodists, Anglicans or any particular group go to Heaven.
So you are saying that no one is in hell?Nobody is lost in God’s hands, it is the safest place on earth, and we all are in His hands.
Wow, your reply is exceedingly strange. I don’t hate you, nor am I bullying you, nor do I have any “beef” with you. I am simply stating Catholic teaching to you, as I understand it. You cannot just sit down with the bible and find truth. You must read the bible in the light of the Church, which is to say in the light of all that the Church teaches.Sorry for not being American. I read The Bible every day with thoughts and love. You have gone to far. I do not like being bullied, I don’t do that to others so I think I can ask for a bit of respect. Why do you hate me? I am a new member, yes, but so is many others. I am honest, but I reckon all of you are. So what is the beef?
Did I say that there is no Hell or that it is empty? All I said was that we all safe in God’s hands, and if that is a heresy, well, I have nothing more to add.So you are saying that no one is in hell?
That, I believe, is a heresy.