What are the reasons I should (or shouldn't) become Catholic?

[AgnosTheist]

Little old ladies convert to other religions??? The numbers must be miniscule. Anyway, how does this relate to the idea that you’re WRONG, yes, you are WRONG, about unity being due to the clarity of the instruction manual.

I used Islam and the Koran as an example. That abominable book is light years in clarity compared to the bible. And so muslims are far less fragmented even without an authoritative governing body like the Vatican.

 

[qui_est_ce]

I used Islam and the Koran as an example. That abominable book is light years in clarity compared to the bible. And so muslims are far less fragmented even without an authoritative governing body like the Vatican.

You can’t be serious. Actually, I guess you might be right, Muslims are united. United in that they kill each other for the same ideas. I doubt it’s the Koran itself that makes them this way. Many Muslims are functionally illiterate and depend on what their Imams tell them what is in the Koran. And the Imams from the same sects fight with each other.

I disagree with your argument:
Koran=clear
Muslims=united
Therefore they are united because the Koran is clear.

 

[Olivermax]

Alright, here goes…

Agnos to God!

Agnos to God!

Are you there?

Im listening!

hmmm nothing…

Asj Him sincerely to reveal Himself to you. If he speaks to your soul, will you listen?

 

[Sixtus]

You think the little old ladies saying their Rosaries care about Theology? They listen to Scripture at mass, and let the Theologian help them understand when he gives his homily.

 

[qui_est_ce]

AgnosTheist;2661361:

Alright, here goes…

Agnos to God!

Agnos to God!

Are you there?

Im listening!

hmmm nothing…

Asj Him sincerely to reveal Himself to you. If he speaks to your soul, will you listen?

God DID speak to Agnos this week-end. Agnos promised to shut up and listen. Today Agnos came back and said God told him (Agnos) to practice the Golden Rule.

Ok, I am too stupid to be able to quote multiple posts, but his admission is on this thread today. God DID speak to Agnos. Agnos just isn’t ready to accept that he really believes in Catholcism and the Bible, but he does!

 

[qui_est_ce]

Wow, see what happens when you listen? Keep listening, you’ll learn more.

As in “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.” — Jesus (c. 5 B.C. - A.D. 32 ) in the Gospels, Matthew 7:12, Matthew 22:39, Luke 6:31, Luke 10:27

“Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself: I am the lord.” — Torah Leviticus 19:18

“When an alien lives with you in your land, do not mistreat him. The alien living with you must be treated as one of your native-born. Love him as yourself, for you were aliens in Egypt. I am the lord your God.” — Torah Leviticus 19:33-34

Here is what Agnos admitted to.

 

[TheOpenTheist]

The worst thing about hanging around Catholics is their focus on the 4 Gospels and their lack of focus and attention to Paul’s epistles.

This is the worst thing because God gave the apostle Paul the “house rules of the grace of God” for us to follow (Eph 3:2) and you won’t find those “house rules” in the 4 Gospels since those writings deal with everything that happened BEFORE Christ gave Paul our “house rules” to follow and live by.

Basicly, if you become Catholic and hang around them a lot be sure to spend more time on Paul’s epistles to make up for the misfocus on the 4 Gospels that you would be subjected to at a typical mass.

 

[jmcrae]

The worst thing about hanging around Catholics is their focus on the 4 Gospels and their lack of focus and attention to Paul’s epistles.

This is the worst thing because God gave the apostle Paul the “house rules of the grace of God” for us to follow (Eph 3:2) and you won’t find those “house rules” in the 4 Gospels since those writings deal with everything that happened BEFORE Christ gave Paul our “house rules” to follow and live by.

Basicly, if you become Catholic and hang around them a lot be sure to spend more time on Paul’s epistles to make up for the misfocus on the 4 Gospels that you would be subjected to at a typical mass.

Um - so, what are you trying to say? Did St. Paul receive some kind of private locutions from Jesus, telling him how to run the Church? (And if so, why St. Paul? Why not the original Apostles?)

 

[TheOpenTheist]

Um - so, what are you trying to say? Did St. Paul receive some kind of private locutions from Jesus, telling him how to run the Church? (And if so, why St. Paul? Why not the original Apostles?)

Yes, the apostle Paul received from the risen Christ revelation that had not been revealed to anyone (including Peter and the other apostles) before it was revealed to Him. He mentions this several times.

Romans 16:25 Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began

1 Corinthians 2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, the hidden [wisdom] which God ordained before the ages for our glory

Ephesians 3:1-9 Ephesians 3:1 For this reason I, Paul, the prisoner of Christ Jesus for you Gentiles – 2 if indeed you have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which was given to me for you, 3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel, 7 of which I became a minister according to the gift of the grace of God given to me by the effective working of His power. 8 To me, who am less than the least of all the saints, this grace was given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ, 9 and to make all see what [is] the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the ages has been hidden in God who created all things through Jesus Christ;

Colossians 1:25-27 of which I became a minister according to the stewardship from God which was given to me for you, to fulfill the word of God, 26 the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints. 27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

 

[jmcrae]

Ah. You practice the heresy of Gnosticism (salvation based on mysterious, hidden knowledge), or something very like it.

Welcome to the Forum.

 

[Verisimilitude]

The worst thing about hanging around Catholics is their focus on the 4 Gospels and their lack of focus and attention to Paul’s epistles.

This is the worst thing because God gave the apostle Paul the “house rules of the grace of God” for us to follow (Eph 3:2) and you won’t find those “house rules” in the 4 Gospels since those writings deal with everything that happened BEFORE Christ gave Paul our “house rules” to follow and live by.

Luke 10:26-28 (New King James Version)
26 He said to him, “What is written in the law? What is your reading of it?”
27 So he answered and said, “ ‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind,’[a] and ‘your neighbor as yourself.’”**
28 And He said to him, “You have answered rightly; do this and you will live.”
[SIGN]Ooop! Gospel reference from a Catholic :doh2: [/SIGN]

Basicly, if you become Catholic and hang around them a lot be sure to spend more time on Paul’s epistles to make up for the misfocus on the 4 Gospels that you would be subjected to at a typical mass.

When was the last time you went to Mass?
I found this interesting.
III. THEOLOGY OF ST. PAUL
A. Paul and Christ

St. Paul was the right man for the job and rightly holds the honor the Church has recognized. St. Paul was never Pope of the Church and St. Paul was not Christ.

The Gospels rightly deserve the higher position.**

 

[po18guy]

anything that has a new testament in it. well muslims have been living in the west in the last 50 years, and theres still no fragmentation on core beliefs.
my friend, its not leadership that unites a point of view, its the clarity of the instruction manual.

Au contraire, mon frere! The bible, either Testament, must be read and studied in context. If you chop it up and read sound bites, you will be confused. There was a different audience for each book. Grab your bible and go to a Catholic (NOT non-denominational!!!) bible study-just to learn how it must be studied, and the historical context in which it was written. You will be amazed as your confusion evaporates like fog on a bathroom mirror when you use a hair dryer on it.

Islam in the U.S. is not a good example. Look to the rest of the world. You have seen the bloodbaths between the Sunni and Shiia Muslims? Each is grasping the Quran as they kill the other. Islam is broken up into sects and these are just two of them. It is not the monolith that you think it is. In the U.S., it is constrained by a government of laws founded on Judeo-Christian principles. Watch the feet: Muslims are not flocking to Muslim nations, they are leaving them. You know where they are going? To the U.S. and Europe where you can be Sunni and not killed by the Shiia, or vice versa.

But, keep asking, please. We all benefit from the dialog.

 

[Theist]

Au contraire, mon frere! The bible, either Testament, must be read and studied in context. If you chop it up and read sound bites, you will be confused. There was a different audience for each book. Grab your bible and go to a Catholic (NOT non-denominational!!!) bible study-just to learn how it must be studied, and the historical context in which it was written. You will be amazed as your confusion evaporates like fog on a bathroom mirror when you use a hair dryer on it.

“in-context” is another way of saying “someone’s interpretation”, which is the same thing as “someone’s opinion”. Since different people will have “different opinions” which one will you believe?

And why should I believe the same one you do?

 

[jmcrae]

“in-context” is another way of saying “someone’s interpretation”, which is the same thing as “someone’s opinion”. Since different people will have “different opinions” which one will you believe?

And why should I believe the same one you do?

How about because it’s the original?

 

[po18guy]

The worst thing about hanging around Catholics is their focus on the 4 Gospels and their lack of focus and attention to Paul’s epistles.

This is the worst thing because God gave the apostle Paul the “house rules of the grace of God” for us to follow (Eph 3:2) and you won’t find those “house rules” in the 4 Gospels since those writings deal with everything that happened BEFORE Christ gave Paul our “house rules” to follow and live by.

Basicly, if you become Catholic and hang around them a lot be sure to spend more time on Paul’s epistles to make up for the misfocus on the 4 Gospels that you would be subjected to at a typical mass.

Suspended, huh? Those wascally modewators!

1. Blessed as he was, Paul was not one of the twelve.
2. What about John? He was the “beloved disciple” -Christ gave His blessed Mother Mary to him.

We most certainly will follow Paul-just as soon as you believe all of what he wrote-not just your favorite verses. How can you say this while disregarding 1 Corinthians 11:17-34. If the Lord’s supper is just bread and wine, you cannot drink judgment unto yourself. “…do not persist in your unbelief, but believe” (John 20:27).

Praying for you (wherever you are).

 

[po18guy]

“in-context” is another way of saying “someone’s interpretation”, which is the same thing as “someone’s opinion”. Since different people will have “different opinions” which one will you believe?

And why should I believe the same one you do?

My fellow Christian, “out of context” comments have started wars. They mis-lead. They are not accurate when you remove the time frame, location, intent of the writer, target audience, etc, that they were intended for. Now, I’ll allow that your faith may have grown up on “out of context” scripture, but you have not received the full truth. The Catholic church teaches the entire bible, not just selected verses or books that fit separatist theology.

As for “interpretation”, I choose the early church fathers, who suffered unto death for the faith, rather than a slick, young preacher telling me that God wants me to be successful.

Please keep asking questions and probing. You will be lead by the Holy Spirit to the fullness of truth. It is closer than you think. We are not neophytes, and our faith was not handed on to us by them.

 

[Mark_Leakos]

In response to the original post in this thread: Why should one join the Catholic Church? (paraphrased)

One needs to ask what their goal is. For example, one could ask why they should join a particular gym. They would need to settle in their own minds the reason they wanted to join any gym. If it was to gain social prestige then they might join the gym with the most expensive membership in the swankiest hotel. If their goal was to get physically fit then they might join a gym that had a lengthy reputation for producing fit members even from rather unfit new members. Remember though that any gym you join you will find some members are there only to “put in an appearance” while others are there to work hard to improve. O.K. enough with the gym example.
If you want to use the church as a source of power that will help you to achieve incredible material wealth then don’t join the Catholic church, there are other churches that promise to do that for you. If your wish is to grow spiritually and learn to be perfect (as Christ bid us to be- Matt. 5:45) then the Catholic church would be a good choice. (In my opinion the best choice, otherwise I would go elsewhere). Is the Catholic church perfect? No, because even if it were perfect before I joined, once I joined the church it would no longer be perfect because I’m not perfect.

Anyway, as it says in the prologue of the Catechism of the Catholic Church “…all the works of perfect Christian virtue spring from love and have no objective than to arrive at love.”
Have a good journey.

 

[CB_Catholic]

The worst thing about hanging around Catholics is their focus on the 4 Gospels and their lack of focus and attention to Paul’s epistles.

This is the worst thing because God gave the apostle Paul the “house rules of the grace of God” for us to follow (Eph 3:2) and you won’t find those “house rules” in the 4 Gospels since those writings deal with everything that happened BEFORE Christ gave Paul our “house rules” to follow and live by.

Basicly, if you become Catholic and hang around them a lot be sure to spend more time on Paul’s epistles to make up for the misfocus on the 4 Gospels that you would be subjected to at a typical mass.

Umm… is it Christianity or Paulianity we subscribe to?

Everything Paul writes about is Christ-centered, as it should be, and his foundation was the Gospel of Jesus Christ. He gave up his life for the Gospel. Jesus is the source and foundation of our Faith, and the Gospels are His story. Why would we not put them first? St. Paul did. Without the Gospels, we have no Epistles, and no Christianity.

You seem to be missing something here… It is Jesus, not Paul, who gave us the “house rules to follow and live by”.

 

[AgnosTheist]

Islam in the U.S. is not a good example. Look to the rest of the world. You have seen the bloodbaths between the Sunni and Shiia Muslims? Each is grasping the Quran as they kill the other. Islam is broken up into sects and these are just two of them.

1. Sunni & Shia strife is purely political and not doctrinal.
2. Islam’s sects are extremely few compared to the many thousands of Christianity.
3. Islam’s sects are still united in their core beliefs. That there is only one God and Mohammad is his prophet. To follow the pillars of Islam. That Jesus is just a prophet. And that the Trinity is wrong.

THEIR INSTRUCTION MANUAL IS VERY CLEAR.

Au contraire, mon frere! The bible, either Testament, must be read and studied in context. If you chop it up and read sound bites, you will be confused.

Thats what every christian sect are claiming. And look, you are still divided in core doctrinal beliefs.

 

[AgnosTheist]

You can’t be serious. Actually, I guess you might be right, Muslims are united. United in that they kill each other for the same ideas. I doubt it’s the Koran itself that makes them this way. Many Muslims are functionally illiterate and depend on what their Imams tell them what is in the Koran. And the Imams from the same sects fight with each other.

I disagree with your argument:
Koran=clear
Muslims=united
Therefore they are united because the Koran is clear.

United in doctrinal beliefs. Disunited in political affiliations. You still disagree?