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ByzCathCantor
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Let’s say a representative, faithful and practicing Catholic under the age of 50 is asked that question. What would be the most likely response?
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Rich_C
Guest
Bad time for young families with young kids. I know that’s why our 5pm Solemn Mass is so poorly attended compared to the 9am Low or High Mass.
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ByzCathCantor
Guest
I can see that being an issue if an EF Mass is offered, but confused as to how that relates to the question posed.
The underlying question goes to why the EF is not more frequently requested by the faithful.
The point was that many younger Catholics are only familiar with the OF. The attachment to the familiar is certainly a more basic consideration for most folks (human nature being what it is, in that regard).
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pnewton
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Or don’t, and just stick with what the Church teaches. For “real” answers, look to the Church and have a little faith in the Holy Spirit’s leadership.
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curlycool89
Guest
That is certainly a descriptive answer to the question (how things are), but that does not answer the question of “why ought it to be done?”
If someone specifically asks me if there is a “Latin Mass” in our diocese I’ll gladly point them to it (parish and time so far as I can remember it), and that’s about it. I don’t see or feel a need to personally go around actively promoting the EF in any way because it’s simply not my thing.
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Seamus_L
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My point was that, if you have the EF at a particular church, no choir, very little interaction between those attending, no co-ordinating efforts etc, then yes, it doesn’t surprise me when it’s discontinued due to the fact that after a year only 10-15 people are coming. But, when you have an enthusiastic priest with just a few stalwarts to begin and even a small choir,and attendees getting to know each other, it can be a much happier story.
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pnewton
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I would think a better way to address the problem with participation is to not have a weekly EF. I would, if I wanted to get the ball rolling as a priest, start with an occassional celebration of the EF, at some Sunday Feast for the weekend, at all Masses. I would do this once or twice through the year for a while. Then I would see if there was a response that merited a weekly Mass. I think folks would be more open to an occassional Mass like this, and this openness might make a weekly Mass later more accepted and better attended.
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Cat
Guest
Have you read this excellent thread, “The Latin Mass: Why You Can’t Have It” that gives a lot of discussion and reasons why EF is not catching on? The OP posts a link to a great article by a priest who is a Master of Ceremonies.
Here’s the link to that thread:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=712053
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Rich_C
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I think that’s a big part of it. The vast majority my young friends who attend the EF are converts to Catholicism. Both forms were new to them so learning the EF seems like less of an obstacle, I guess.I can see that being an issue if an EF Mass is offered, but confused as to how that relates to the question posed.
The underlying question goes to why the EF is not more frequently requested by the faithful.
The point was that many younger Catholics are only familiar with the OF. The attachment to the familiar is certainly a more basic consideration for most folks (human nature being what it is, in that regard).
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Cat
Guest
There is another rather sad possibility.
Evangelical Protestantism is experience-driven. Christians hop from church to church seeking “to be fed.” They’re always on the hunt for something or someone novel and new and exciting. I used to call this “bandwagon” thinking.
So it’s possible that evangelical Protestants “hop” to the EF Mass because to them, it is very novel, new, and exciting.
I will admit freely that this is one of my reasons for avoiding the EF Mass–there is a part of me that still thinks like an evangelical Protestant and seeks “experiences” rather than Christ Himself, therefore I am almost anal when it comes to deliberately avoiding any religious event that seems like an “experience” to me.
I prefer as simple a Mass as possible, as long as everything is done “with excellence.” I prefer a simple, unadorned nave, familiar music, and my own language with simple phrasing, no poetical turns or high language.
I’m not saying that this is the way all Catholics should be, but for me as an ex-evangelical Protestant, it’s much safer and helps me to avoid the “church hop” and “bandwagon” mentality that seeks experiences rather than Jesus.
Hopefully, these converts will discover that the Mass is not just another “experience.”
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Petersmate
Guest
The black hat guy didn’t get his facts right it was a bad article. Pope B16 knows a lot more about what went on during Vatican II. He is encouraging priests to say the Latin mass for a reason and changes to the Novus Ordo are happening for a reason
If you were a marketing company marketing the Catholic mass you would have to declare that the entertainment business has failed.
The Novus Ordo has been a failure when you look at how mass attendances have slowly dwindled away and the current changes are moving back to more authentic mass. When we finally get back to something closer to the Latin Mass we will see more reverence.
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OraLabora
Guest
So low Mass attendance is caused by the Ordinary Form Mass. Interesting.
How does that explain that the mainstream Protestant denominations also lost attendance in the same period, including the Anglicans with their very traditional Book of Common Prayer, in which their “mass” resembles very much the Tridentine but in the vernacular?
You don’t suppose that mass secularization of Western society in the same period might have had something to do with declining Mass attendance in Western societies (because it is UP in many places in the world…the form of the Mass notwithstanding).
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Rich_C
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Only a few of them were evangelicals.
I think they already know that. Many of them have said that’s why they stopped attending the OF: they felt it catered too much to “experience” rather than focusing on God. Their words, not mine.Hopefully, these converts will discover that the Mass is not just another “experience.”
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Petersmate
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Well the NO protestantised the Catholic faith it was invented to appeal to protestants.
I think protestantism has had the kiss of death ever since they rejected contraception.(and now catholics are protestantised- well 98% of them)
So there you go…the slippery slope.
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pnewton
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First, did you even think you might need to check the rules here before you jumped in and started making wild statements?
The Holy Father described the changes in the Mass as removing the whitewash from a fresco. At no point has he use the word “protestant” as you seem to think acceptable. If you are truly “very Catholic” then why don’t we look to see what the Church teaches. Where can you find in Church teaching that the changes in Mass were protestant in any way?
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LightBound
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clem456
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So, just to clarify… You believe that the Church has “invented” a Mass that has been the direct cause of apostasy? You do not believe the Holy Spirit is guiding the Church?
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Petersmate
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Thank you . I’m not saying anymore about this.
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ProVobis
Guest
I have a friend around Baltimore who was into the 1559 Common Prayer and was quite excited about it at first, but after a month got quite weary of it and that language.
Petersmate did bring up a good point about marketing but one thing a good marketer does is to look past the initial hype and figure out how to sustain the product for the long term. That means, every Sunday, not just Christmas and Easter. I don’t know, maybe we should go back to the basics of why we worship in the first place? Your thoughts?
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clem456
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I worship because, God is present at Mass and worship is justice towards God. It is right and just to give Him thanks and praise.
On a personal level I worship because, to not worship -in unity with the whole Church-, is spiritual death for me.
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I know what spiritual death is, and Jesus through His Church is my antidote.
I finally came to the realization that joy and peace and salvation (spiritual life and well being with God) are found by worshiping -with- the Church and it’s entire people, accepting it as it is, not as I want it.
Obedience, ob-audire, to listen.
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