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East_Anglican
Guest
What do you mean by a crutch?
I’ve recently started reading Thomas Aquinas. I don’t agree with everything he siad but believe he said a lot of thingds that are very relevant for us today.
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I’ve recently started reading Thomas Aquinas. I don’t agree with everything he siad but believe he said a lot of thingds that are very relevant for us today.
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East_Anglican
Guest
It is a timeless classic.
If I had to recomend reading Thoma A Kempis or Martin Luther, I’d recommend Thomas A Kempis becuase most of what Luther said is completely irrelevant now.
What a good Protestant I am.
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East_Anglican
Guest
It would depend on your definition of Catholic. I shall talk more on this later in this post.
Israel and Judah where never devided in Gods eyes and neither is The New Testament Church.
Most of what Martin Luther said is rather irrelevant now.
Correct.
Thomas Moore was the only lawyer in England that left the legal proffesion with less money than he went in to it with. The idea of the honest lawyer sounds crazy.
Her was a great theologian
Thomas Moore rightfully stood his ground and stuck to his guns. Henry VIII faith was debatable while Moores is obvious.
Moores cannonisation was justified.
Henry VIII had beheaded one of the most intelligent people in Europe at the time who once was a good adviser.
Henry VIII was an idiot.
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c659smith
Guest
So how do you relate Kempis and his writing of the Blessed Sacrament?It is a timeless classic.
If I had to recommend reading Thoma A Kempis or Martin Luther, I’d recommend Thomas A Kempis because most of what Luther said is completely irrelevant now.
What a good Protestant I am.
Eucharistic Adoration?
Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity?
I am confused by your picking and choosing of what you agree and disagree with.
Tell me what is it that you protest with or should I say disagree with concerning the Catholic Church especially since you like the doctors and writers within the Catholic Church.
Surely you do not agree with King Henry the 8th and his withdrawal from the Catholic Church.
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c659smith
Guest
Saint Thomas wrote and spoke of one Church and not several. Saint Thomas also was not alive during the protests and the divisions that happened in the later centuries.
Again you have said alot of what you agree with but nothing of what you disagree with of the Catholic Church.
Another area is what do you think gave these players that left the Catholic Church the right or divine revealtion to do so?
If something is not going your way than work for change not division.
Imagine every time a family had a disagreement we left the home never to reconcile.
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East_Anglican
Guest
I disagree with this eucharistic adoration unles I don’t understand it of course.
The bread and wine are the body and blood of Christ.
I think Purgatory is my biggest problem along with certian Marialogical doctrines.
I believe The Saints pray for us but am not sure if we should ask them to.
The original reformers did not want schism. Certain doctrines were being abused and The Pope was wealding authority where he shouldn’t have been. Henry VIII claimed the split was because the Pope was wealding authority where he shouldn’t have been but we know the real reason was that he wanted a devorce.
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East_Anglican
Guest
I believe in one Church the Anglican church is part of The Church but not The Church on its own.
Some left and some were excomunicated.
The most tragic thing about the schisms is now we have Arian, Gnostic, Pelagian and Nestorian heresies springing up all over the place and we can’t defeat them because everyones authotrity is questioned by everyone else.
We want reunification on our own terms unfortunately.
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c659smith
Guest
If someone is in heaven are they alive or dead?
For if we believe in what Christ said those that believe in me shall have eternal life then we are asking for prayers from those that are alive and with Christ for they are not dead.
Would you ask your congregation to pray for you should you need it? Of course you would for that are alive in Christ as are the Saints.
purgatory–means to purge–correct?
Everything in heaven must be perfect as God is Perfection.
We as Human Beings have a desire to sin and combat sin everyday,even though we may die in Christ and faith.
With that being said we must have our souls purged to rid ourselves and our souls of such desires otherwise we would be an imperfect being in a place where there is only perfection. (a contradiction) An area where our robes will be made white.
The Eucharist
Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: “‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.’ The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’” (John 6:51–52).
Many left and Jesus did not say wait it’s only a symbol but let them leave and asked the Apostles are you going to leave also?
His listeners were stupefied because now they understood Jesus literally—and correctly. He again repeated his words, but with even greater emphasis, and introduced the statement about drinking his blood: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him” (John 6:53–56).
even Paul writes,
“Therefore whoever eats the bread and drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. . . . For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself” (1 Cor. 11:27, 29). “To answer for the body and blood” of someone meant to be guilty of a crime as serious as homicide. How could eating mere bread and wine “unworthily” be so serious? Paul’s comment makes sense only if the bread and wine became the real body and blood of Christ.
Lastly I agree Religious men and men can do grievous and sinful things for they are man.
However in saying all this it has not changed the Catholic Church in it’s Sacred teachings, Traditions, and Sacred Scripture but has only helped to define them. Infallibility is not the man but the Church(Jesus)
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flameburns623
Guest
S
SIA
Guest
You are obviously lost, I will pray for you.
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c659smith
Guest
Again a lame response by a protestant to biblical scripture.
Why do you not try to support your claims with the scripture I have given.
I am not lost, but take your lame response as a problem within your faith.
Is the bible correct when stating love is greater than faith?
Is love greater than faith?
If love is greater than how can we be saved by faith alone?
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mathematician
Guest
From the Oxford Concise Dictionary of the Christian Church:
“The ‘Protestatio’, from which the word derives, was a statement issued by five reforming princes and fourteen cities at the Diet of Speyer in 1529. Outnumbered by the Catholic powers who wanted to halt the reforming movement, the signatories believed that to keep silent would touch ‘God’s honour and…the eternal life of our souls’. The term Protestant originally applied only to Lutherans, the Calvinists being described as ‘Reformed’. It thus originally had a more positive sense than its modern anti-Roman flavour would suggest.”
“The ‘Protestatio’, from which the word derives, was a statement issued by five reforming princes and fourteen cities at the Diet of Speyer in 1529. Outnumbered by the Catholic powers who wanted to halt the reforming movement, the signatories believed that to keep silent would touch ‘God’s honour and…the eternal life of our souls’. The term Protestant originally applied only to Lutherans, the Calvinists being described as ‘Reformed’. It thus originally had a more positive sense than its modern anti-Roman flavour would suggest.”
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Benu2007
Guest
Nobody should bother calling themselves Catholics or Protestants. If you’ve made Christ your Lord and Saviour, and that means actually living for Him, then you will be saved. So much time is spent over absolutely pointless arguements that mean nothing such as the Eucharist or the Perpetual Virginity or Pennance. These have nothing to do with God. We should be focussed on serving God. Living our lives for Him, It pointless to get caught up in debates like this when we should be living for God not attacking one another. Read 2 Timothy 23-24.
Most Protestants today don’t even think about being called a protestant. They’re not protesting against anything, they’re living to please God. Protestantism came about because of extreme corruption in the Church. The Pope was not a Christian. He was in it for the money. He came up with the Indulgences. This is where people could buy the right to partake in a particular sin such as sleeping with a prostitute. The bible was not allowed to be written in any language other than Latin which most people could not speak - people who did make English translations had a price put on their head. People did not know that it is by faith in Christ alone that saves them. If this kind of stuff occurred today then any God fearing person would protest. Many who did were killed. Luther was excomunicated, he didn’t leave - he was kicked out. So he went around preaching the truth. Salvation through faith alone. We don’t have to belong to the Catholic Church to be saved. We just need Christ and to actually live our lives for Him by turning away from our sin nature, that is our own sinful desires. When we live for our sin nature we are not saved and are on our way to hell. When we make Christ our Lord we live for Him and so we are saved. Nothing to do with Catholicism or Protestantism.
Most Protestants today don’t even think about being called a protestant. They’re not protesting against anything, they’re living to please God. Protestantism came about because of extreme corruption in the Church. The Pope was not a Christian. He was in it for the money. He came up with the Indulgences. This is where people could buy the right to partake in a particular sin such as sleeping with a prostitute. The bible was not allowed to be written in any language other than Latin which most people could not speak - people who did make English translations had a price put on their head. People did not know that it is by faith in Christ alone that saves them. If this kind of stuff occurred today then any God fearing person would protest. Many who did were killed. Luther was excomunicated, he didn’t leave - he was kicked out. So he went around preaching the truth. Salvation through faith alone. We don’t have to belong to the Catholic Church to be saved. We just need Christ and to actually live our lives for Him by turning away from our sin nature, that is our own sinful desires. When we live for our sin nature we are not saved and are on our way to hell. When we make Christ our Lord we live for Him and so we are saved. Nothing to do with Catholicism or Protestantism.
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GregoryPalamas
Guest
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c659smith
Guest
Then exlain to me the below scriptures, sorry but you need the Catholic Church.
Notice nothing symbolic here.
Body,Blood, Soul, and Divinity.
The Eucharist
Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: “‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.’ The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’” (John 6:51–52).
Many left and Jesus did not say wait it’s only a symbol but let them leave and asked the Apostles are you going to leave also?
His listeners were stupefied because now they understood Jesus literally—and correctly. He again repeated his words, but with even greater emphasis, and introduced the statement about drinking his blood: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him” (John 6:53–56).
even Paul writes,
“Therefore whoever eats the bread and drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. . . . For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself” (1 Cor. 11:27, 29). “To answer for the body and blood” of someone meant to be guilty of a crime as serious as homicide. How could eating mere bread and wine “unworthily” be so serious? Paul’s comment makes sense only if the bread and wine became the real body and blood of Christ.
I doubt I will get an proper answer though.
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Benu2007
Guest
To GregoryPalamas.
Please begin somewhere on where i am apparently confused if there so many then it would have been easy to give me at least one. What I said is simply that we have to live for God.
To c659smith
In John 6:47 Jesus says “I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in Me has eternal life.” So it’s by belief in Him that we have eternal life. He says that he is the bread of life because it’s by Him that you recieve eternal life. Think about it. In this passage Jesus if is saying that unless you partake of the Eucharist you don’t have eternal life then how could he have said to the man on the cross beside Him in Luke 23:43 that he would be with Him in Paradise. There is nothing about the criminal partaking in communion. He simply repented and ask Christ to remember him. This is how we are saved. Sadly, man has come along and put all these little rules in that we must do in order to receive eternal life and it takes away the freedom we have in Chirst.
The reason why the people found it a hard concept to understand was because Jesus was saying that it was by belief in Him and not human effort John 6:63. The Jews had the law and for them to receive eternal life it was all about keeping the law by their own effort. They found it hard when somone told them that they simply had to believe.
If you read in John chapter 4 Jesus talks about living water that He will give for people to drink so that they will have eternal life and never be thirsty again. Tell where is this living water that we have to drink? He was speaking symbolicly there of those who believe in Himself just like He was in chapter 6.
In the book of Acts when people were saved because they believed it says how they were baptised straight away. This was to show their faith (not because you are saved in the act of baptism). If partaking in the Eucharist was that important then why didn’t the apostles get people to partake in it when they were saved?
In the Corinthians passage that you pointed out. The problem was that the people weren’t remembering Christ when they ate. Some were coming just so they could have a feed 1 Corithians 11:21. If you read the passage properly you’ll see that communion is about remembering Christ’s sacrifice. His blood that He spilt for us. Tell me do you examine your life when you partake in the Eucharist? Do you give honour to Christ? Corithians 11:28-29. Or do you just stand there and wait for the priest to say the words and then go up and receive it? Communion is about remembering God.
Tell me why you said I need to be a Catholic? Are you saying I’m not saved? I believe Jesus Christ to be my Lord and Saviour. I live for Him and want to please Him. I’ve turned away from trying to satisfy my on sinful desires. Please read Galations 5 and Colossians 2-3. There are many other passages that talk about this. Please this is why I’m posting, because people try and live by rules, it’s not just Catholics either, and it hinders people from really living for God. There are Catholics I know who don’t go on about the Eucharist and other nonsense like Perpeptual Virginity etc. For them it’s all about living for God.
Please also answer my question in my original post about why the reformation happened in the first place? Do you think it was necessary that it did happen?
Thank you
Please begin somewhere on where i am apparently confused if there so many then it would have been easy to give me at least one. What I said is simply that we have to live for God.
To c659smith
In John 6:47 Jesus says “I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in Me has eternal life.” So it’s by belief in Him that we have eternal life. He says that he is the bread of life because it’s by Him that you recieve eternal life. Think about it. In this passage Jesus if is saying that unless you partake of the Eucharist you don’t have eternal life then how could he have said to the man on the cross beside Him in Luke 23:43 that he would be with Him in Paradise. There is nothing about the criminal partaking in communion. He simply repented and ask Christ to remember him. This is how we are saved. Sadly, man has come along and put all these little rules in that we must do in order to receive eternal life and it takes away the freedom we have in Chirst.
The reason why the people found it a hard concept to understand was because Jesus was saying that it was by belief in Him and not human effort John 6:63. The Jews had the law and for them to receive eternal life it was all about keeping the law by their own effort. They found it hard when somone told them that they simply had to believe.
If you read in John chapter 4 Jesus talks about living water that He will give for people to drink so that they will have eternal life and never be thirsty again. Tell where is this living water that we have to drink? He was speaking symbolicly there of those who believe in Himself just like He was in chapter 6.
In the book of Acts when people were saved because they believed it says how they were baptised straight away. This was to show their faith (not because you are saved in the act of baptism). If partaking in the Eucharist was that important then why didn’t the apostles get people to partake in it when they were saved?
In the Corinthians passage that you pointed out. The problem was that the people weren’t remembering Christ when they ate. Some were coming just so they could have a feed 1 Corithians 11:21. If you read the passage properly you’ll see that communion is about remembering Christ’s sacrifice. His blood that He spilt for us. Tell me do you examine your life when you partake in the Eucharist? Do you give honour to Christ? Corithians 11:28-29. Or do you just stand there and wait for the priest to say the words and then go up and receive it? Communion is about remembering God.
Tell me why you said I need to be a Catholic? Are you saying I’m not saved? I believe Jesus Christ to be my Lord and Saviour. I live for Him and want to please Him. I’ve turned away from trying to satisfy my on sinful desires. Please read Galations 5 and Colossians 2-3. There are many other passages that talk about this. Please this is why I’m posting, because people try and live by rules, it’s not just Catholics either, and it hinders people from really living for God. There are Catholics I know who don’t go on about the Eucharist and other nonsense like Perpeptual Virginity etc. For them it’s all about living for God.
Please also answer my question in my original post about why the reformation happened in the first place? Do you think it was necessary that it did happen?
Thank you
C
c659smith
Guest
In John 6:47 Jesus says “I tell you the truth, anyone who believes in Me has eternal life.”
Answer: Now what did the start of the passage say and how did the passage end.
He says that he is the bread of life because it’s by Him that you recieve eternal life.
Answer: You are not using scripture here but what you want it to mean and you know it. here is scripture******
Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: “‘I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh.’ The Jews then disputed among themselves, saying, ‘How can this man give us his flesh to eat?’” (John 6:51–52).
Living water is Baptism “In the name of the Father, Son,and Holy Ghost” I think I saw this is scripture somewhere how about you.
You do also have baptism by Blood and fire but I will take the water for now thank you.
I follow the Mass very closely and take in deeply the words and contemplate each and every time what Jesus has given me. When I receive Jesus into my body He is in me and I in Him. If you only knew at times it brings me to tears. I have been to many a non Catholic service and without receiving Christ through in the Eucharist I go away unfulfilled.
Now do not think about what others have told you what this means and do not put your opinion in what the below scripture says. Then after reading it tell me what it says?
Truly, truly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in you; he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him" (John 6:53–56).
this is why you need to be Catholic
Do you receive the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ?
Do you follow what Jesus explicity tells you to do?
Again Paul below writes and explicity speaks of the Eucharist. The Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.
Do not think about others opinions, Do not place your opinion there.
What does Paul say about receiving the Eucharist while in sin?
“Therefore whoever eats the bread and drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. . . . For any one who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself” (1 Cor. 11:27, 29). “To answer for the body and blood” of someone meant to be guilty of a crime as serious as homicide. How could eating mere bread and wine “unworthily” be so serious? Paul’s comment makes sense only if the bread and wine became the real body and blood of Christ.
THE REFORMAATION
No I do not think it was necessary and it occurred because man being a selfish and wanting immediate satisfaction of the flesh followed some evil and sometimes mis-guideed souls.
They protested because of a man or for themselves not the church and the church still stands as Christ has promised.
Martin Luther, King Henry the eight and so on.
What did it accomplish but divide and help the devil complete his works.
For a house divided aganist itself will fall. (Hey that’s scripture)
For the Catholic Church it was good as those that divide are no longer there, but for the so called reformers,
well the protestant churches still continues to divide by leaps and bounds.
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Benu2007
Guest
You’ve neglected to answer some of my questions.
Concerning John chapter 4. Jesus talks about us drinking living water, not being emersed in it. Therefore He is not talking about baptism.
The whole point of Christ coming was to die for our sins. He was the sacrifice for us. There’s nothing we can do but put our faith in Him. So many places in the Bible say this. Very few talk about communion or baptism by comparison. I am not saying that they are not important, but they’re not essencial for eternal life.
The reason why it was bad for people to partake in communion in an unworthy many was because it represents the convenant between us and God. We’re coming before Him to remember Him. It is not a joke or a time to muck around, it is serious.
But my whole point of this is that so much time is wasted on this kind of philosophical stuff that the real point is missed. God wants our hearts and lives. We are to live for Him and put Him first in everything. I realise you’re a Christian and Christ means something to you but so many others truly believe that because they’ve been baptised as a Catholic and have partaken in the Eucharist that they are saved. But they don’t live their lives for God.
The reason why there is so much division amongst Protestant Churches is that they all read the Bible. People have different interpretations on certain matters but for the most part they’re all in agreement. And you can’t say that there aren’t different ideaologies amongst Catholics. Many have differing opinions too.
- The man on the cross beside Jesus did not recieve the Eucharist yet Jesus said he would be with Him in Paradise that day. How could this be?
- You didn’t read Galations 5 or Collosians 3-4. I’ll add Romans 3:21-31, In particular note verse 22 which says “we are made right with God by placing our faith in Jesus Christ. And this is true for anyone who believes no matter who we are” we are saved by faith not by partaking in the Eucharist. You wouldn’t even know about the bread and wine turning into Christ’s actual body if it weren’t for the fact you’d heard it from the Catholic Church.
- Was it good that the pope said that people could pay him money to sin? Also you wouldn’t even be reading the bible today if it weren’t for the reformation because back then it was ilegal for it to be in any other language than Latin. Is that good?
Concerning John chapter 4. Jesus talks about us drinking living water, not being emersed in it. Therefore He is not talking about baptism.
The whole point of Christ coming was to die for our sins. He was the sacrifice for us. There’s nothing we can do but put our faith in Him. So many places in the Bible say this. Very few talk about communion or baptism by comparison. I am not saying that they are not important, but they’re not essencial for eternal life.
The reason why it was bad for people to partake in communion in an unworthy many was because it represents the convenant between us and God. We’re coming before Him to remember Him. It is not a joke or a time to muck around, it is serious.
But my whole point of this is that so much time is wasted on this kind of philosophical stuff that the real point is missed. God wants our hearts and lives. We are to live for Him and put Him first in everything. I realise you’re a Christian and Christ means something to you but so many others truly believe that because they’ve been baptised as a Catholic and have partaken in the Eucharist that they are saved. But they don’t live their lives for God.
The reason why there is so much division amongst Protestant Churches is that they all read the Bible. People have different interpretations on certain matters but for the most part they’re all in agreement. And you can’t say that there aren’t different ideaologies amongst Catholics. Many have differing opinions too.
P
panoikei
Guest
I would have simply saved that that is an interesting question coming from an apostate. You see we would have thought all of them were not saved and headed for eternal damnation. Oh…once folks learn what we used to believe, they love Catholics more.
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Benu2007
Guest
Panoikei
Why are you calling me an apostate. I believed in God and made Him my Lord long before I even knew about Catholocism. I didn’t turn from anything. I simply accepted the truth as said in the Bible. I wasn’t perfect then and I’m still not perfect now. However I’ve put my sin nature behind me and Christ infront of me. He is my Lord. This is why I am saved. Any other reason to be saved is heresy.
People go out and they make following God into a religion where you must do this and that, silly little rituals that mean nothing. Emphesis is placed on things not important at all when it should be placed on God. Or do you disagree that the emphesis should be placed on God?
Why are you calling me an apostate. I believed in God and made Him my Lord long before I even knew about Catholocism. I didn’t turn from anything. I simply accepted the truth as said in the Bible. I wasn’t perfect then and I’m still not perfect now. However I’ve put my sin nature behind me and Christ infront of me. He is my Lord. This is why I am saved. Any other reason to be saved is heresy.
People go out and they make following God into a religion where you must do this and that, silly little rituals that mean nothing. Emphesis is placed on things not important at all when it should be placed on God. Or do you disagree that the emphesis should be placed on God?
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