What Catholics Have To Believe

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Recently a protestant asked me if, in becoming a Catholic, he would have to believe in purgatory.

Likewise, I wonder if a Catholic ceases to believe in purgatory, would he then be deprived of the sacraments?

Is there an official prouncement on purgatory, other than that found in the Catechism, that requires all Catholics to believe in it?
 
Gilbert Keith:
Recently a protestant asked me if, in becoming a Catholic, he would have to believe in purgatory.
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He would - a lot of things are up for grabs: the reality of a purgatory of some sort, is not among them.​

Likewise, I wonder if a Catholic ceases to believe in purgatory, would he then be deprived of the sacraments?
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Not if he did not manifest his not believing in it.​

Even so, there are many degree and kinds of ceasing to believe in it - it could be that what some people reject, is what the magisterium would reject too: not all presentation of it in sermons (say) are as they should be. A certain book on Hell was withdrawn in the 1800s, not because it expressed disbelief in Hell, but because it presented a sadistic picture of it. And there is no reason think there can’t be equally unsatisfactory pictures of Purgatory. ##
Is there an official prouncement on purgatory, other than that found in the Catechism, that requires all Catholics to believe in it?
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There is:

The Second Council of Lyons (1274)
The Council of Florence (1438-1445)
The Council of Trent (1546-63)
The Creed of Pius IV (1564)
The 1968 Credo of the People of God

How’s that to be going on with 🙂 ? ##
 
Gilbert Keith:
Is there an official prouncement on purgatory, other than that found in the Catechism, that requires all Catholics to believe in it?
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What’s wrong with the Catechism? How much more official can you get? :confused:
 
Thank you all for your help and direction.

God bless,
Carl
 
what he has to believe is enunciated in the Nicene Creed. Those are the elements which will form the basis of his instruction, along with the scripture as contained in the Sunday Lectionary readings. From those foundational doctrines arise all the other doctrines and teachings, but he is not obligated to know and understand all of them in order to enter the Church. He will be taught enough about them to make an “informed consent” when he makes his profession of faith. for the rest, lifelong learning and faith formation is the duty of all Catholics.
 
I don’t know why anyone, Catholic or not, would not see and understand the existence of Purgatory as scriptural, essential, and sensible once that person has been duly informed.
 
I don’t know if this has been said or how well it has been said bit it isn’t so much as what you have to believe but in what you have to accept if presented with appropriately in conjunction with the capability of your level of understanding.

This is why those that are babies and those that have developmental disabilities can be Catholic.
 
I am a Catholic and I do not believe all Catholic doctrine and one of the doctrines that I have dispensed with is Purgatory because I am a college graduate who thinks logically and analytically. And thus I am able to ascertain which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with.

Any Catholic who is a college graduate and who thinks logically and analytically should do what I do and ascertain for themselves which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with. Only someone who is not well educated would follow the illogical doctrines.
 
Hi, Mickey,

quote: Mickey
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mazar
Only someone who is not well educated would follow the illogical doctrines.
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:bigyikes:
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I wonder if that would include Benedict XVI.
I understand he’s read a book or too, also.

Come to think of it, I think I’ve read one or
two myself. 😃

Best to you, Mickey,

reen12
 
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reen12:
Best to you, Mickey
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I am just a lowly pilgrim on a journey. May God have mercy on us all.

Blessings to you reen,
Mickey
 
Sorry to be blunt, but a person who openly denies a defined article of the Catholic faith is a Formal Heretic. The Council of Florence dogmatically teaches that heretics cannot obtain salvation unless they repent.

Out of curiosity, what is so seemingly “illogical” about purgatory?

Love, Jaypeeto2
 
I have come to the logical conclusion that Purgatory exists. It is difficult to figure out an orthodox belief just on a self interpretation. The reason for this is, individually none of us are 2000 years old. I am just over 30 years old, regardless of my education, I don’t think I am remotely qualified to figure it all out on my own.

That is why Jesus founded a Church, and left an understanding of the faith. If the founding fathers of the United States had the foresight to establish a government with a legal body to guide it. Then would God who has infinitely more foresight establish some sort of organization to the belief in Him. Or would He just let us go willy-nilly on our own to make differing interpretations.

Now we are forced to believe everything as Catholics, some just believe because of faith. I needed to look into it a little more since I have little faith and every time I have looked into a matter of faith, the Catholic Church has had very good and logical reasons for what it teaches.

It sometimes takes some looking into, but it sooner or later makes sense.

God Bless
Scylla
 
2 Pet 1:20-21 forbids personal interpretation of the Bible. It is not up to the individual to decide what to believe. We don’t have the authority for that.

From the cheat sheet on EWTN, I found these Bible verses that support Purgatory:

Lk 12:59; 1 Cor 3:15; 1 Pet 1:7; Mt 5:25-26 … temporary agony.
Heb 12:6-11 … God’s painful discipline.
Mt 12:32 … no forgiveness … nor in the age to come.
1 Pet 3:19 … purgatory (limbo?).
Rev 21:27 … nothing unclean shall enter heaven.
Heb 12:23 … souls in heaven are perfect.
Col 1:24; 2 Sam 12:14 … “extra” suffering.
2 Mac 12:43-46 … sacrifice for the dead.
2 Tim 1:15-18 … prayer for Onesiphorus for “that Day.”
1 Jn 5:14-17 … mortal/venial sins
Rev 20:5 The rest of the dead did not come to life until the 1000 years were over
1 Cor 3:12-15

Remember the times that people saw an angel or a manifestation of God, like Moses and the burning bush or the Transfiguration? What did they do? They about died of shock, probably because they felt unworthy of such a divine vision. I think that is how we will be when we get to heaven.
 
John Mazar:
I am a Catholic and I do not believe all Catholic doctrine and one of the doctrines that I have dispensed with is Purgatory because I am a college graduate who thinks logically and analytically. And thus I am able to ascertain which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with.

Any Catholic who is a college graduate and who thinks logically and analytically should do what I do and ascertain for themselves which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with. Only someone who is not well educated would follow the illogical doctrines.
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I guess I’m happy that I’m not well educated. It leaves me free to just be faithful and trust those who have been put in charge of my sprititual care - Priests, Bishops, the Pope. Besides, if I thought I knew better than say, the Pope - it might make me a bit prideful. Doesn’t pride cometh before a fall? Just my thoughts…

God Bless,
CM
 
Hi, carol marie,

quote: carol marie
I guess I’m happy that I’m not well educated. It leaves me free to just be faithful and trust those who have been put in charge of my sprititual care - Priests, Bishops, the Pope. Besides, if I thought I knew better than say, the Pope - it might make me a bit prideful. Doesn’t pride cometh before a fall? Just my thoughts…
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You know who agrees with you? Thomas a Kempis, who
wrote the Imitation of Christ.

To paraphrase and edit a bit:
I’d rather practice humility than know the definition of it.
-Thomas a Kempis

I think the actual quote is:
I’d rather practice compunction than know the definition of it,
but compunction is probably not a well understood concept
in the modern age.🙂

All best wishes, carol marie,
Maureen
 
John Mazar:
I am a Catholic and I do not believe all Catholic doctrine and one of the doctrines that I have dispensed with is Purgatory because I am a college graduate who thinks logically and analytically. And thus I am able to ascertain which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with.

Any Catholic who is a college graduate and who thinks logically and analytically should do what I do and ascertain for themselves which doctrines are logical and should be adhered to and which doctrines are illogical and should be dispensed with. Only someone who is not well educated would follow the illogical doctrines.
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Interesting post. I suppose you don’t adhere to transubstantiation, either. How about the resurrection? Virgin Birth? None of these is logical, yet all are beliefs which are required of Catholics. I bow to the wisdom of the Church, because I have come to realize that not everything in this life/world/universe is logical. Oh, and before you go thinking I am not well educated, I not only have a college education (magna cum laude B.S. in Zoology), I have a doctorate (in medicine).
 
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reen12:
Hi, carol marie,

quote: carol marie

You know who agrees with you? Thomas a Kempis, who
wrote the Imitation of Christ.

To paraphrase and edit a bit:
I’d rather practice humility than know the definition of it.
-Thomas a Kempis

I think the actual quote is:
I’d rather practice compunction than know the definition of it,
but compunction is probably not a well understood concept
in the modern age.🙂

All best wishes, carol marie,
Maureen
Click to expand...
Nice post, reen. I would add that I sometimes think humility is not a well understood concept in the modern age either! 😃
 
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