What dear friend, do you find strange about Catholicism?

[PJM]

=Peter J;13498698]At the risk of being way too predictable, there’s always the CCC.

(Confession: I myself don’t find the CCC as much fun as participating on a discussion forum. )

For those interested enough to attept reading our Catholic Catechism; there is a more recent issue by the USCCB [United Sates Conference of Catholic Bishops] entitled:

“UNITED STATES CATHOLIC CATECHISM FOR ADULTS” which is a MUCH more “user-friendly” volume. It can ordered from their web site. Just GOOGLE “USCCB.com”

God Bless you,
Patrick

 

[PJM]

=Tommy999;13498768]Hi Patrick,
I haven’t been on CAF for awhile and haven’t read through all the pages of replies here, but to answer your question from my perspective I would say that strangeness is in the eye of the beholder. it is a matter of what a person is used to or brought up in that helps determine what is normal or strange, in my view.

For me, having been born and raised in the Presbyterian faith tradition (God’s Frozen People, as some would say), I was used to some rituals, responsive readings, pastors in vestments, etc). So when I visited a Catholic mass I did not find those things strange at all.

However, to those Protestants who were raised in a more evangelical or non-denomination setting, perhaps that would’ve seemed strange to them because there typically aren’t responsive readings in those churches, and pastors wear normal business casual clothing in many places instead of priestly garb.

What I found strange at the mass, mainly because I wasn’t used to it, was the priest spreading incense around the altar, all the kneeling, genuflecting, and that sort of thing that takes place at a Catholic mass, i.e “Catholic Gymnastics”.

Although nobody spoke in Latin at the mass I attended, if they had done that, I probably would’ve been impressed but thought it was strange at the same time because I wouldn’t have understood it. It’s only strange to me if I don’t understand it.

It’s not that the mass was truly strange, but it was strange *to me *because I wasn’t used to it. I could see a Catholic coming to one of my worship services and finding it strange, too, for what it has and for what it doesn’t have. I could also see somebody who’s never ever been to a church in his/her life think that all church services are strange, regardless of the faith tradition.

The more I listen to radio shows like Catholic Answers Live and other informational programs, Catholicism becomes less strange and formidable to me. I hope that helps answer the question from my perspective, anyway. May the Lord bless all that read this and grant you His peace.

Thank you so very much for you’re post. Has Mass become more “common” to you yet?

Might I ask; do you understand and accept the Real Presence of Holy Communion?

God Bless you,
Patrick

 

[PJM]

=spedteacherita;13499332]I don’t know about the saints but I do know from what I’ve read and seen written here on CA that belief in Mary’s immaculate conception and assumption into heaven has been called a dogma, which, as I understand is something that can not be changed.

Here is a link to the CNA that I found info about the dogma:

catholicnewsagency.com/resources/mary/general-information/the-four-marian-dogmas/

Am I misunderstanding this?

God’s blessings

Rita

Hi Rita, the site information is correct. That said was it sufficient for you to understand it?

Mary seems to be for non-Catholics a MAJOR hurdle; and I have written extensively about our beliefs; including the WHY and the HOW we can accept it information.

I’m a former Michigander myself [a UPPER] and we have dear friends on Grand-rapids:thumbsup:.
Please let me know if I can at least try to clarify anything for you

God Bless you,

Patrick

 

[PJM]

=spedteacherita;13499342]I found a copy of the CCC at a local thrift store…it was too much for me! I agree with you about it’s more fun in our forums here.

God bless!!

Rita

Here’s your opportinity to ask questions. So go ahead and share what’s on your mind

God Bless,

Patrick **

 

[PJM]

=benhur;13499700]Hi Pete,

No i have not.

Can you be forgiven without receiving the gospel or rejecting it ?

Blessings

NOT as thee NORM, but that’s between you and a very REAL God:thumbsup:

 

[PJM]

=guanophore;13499919]It is against the rules here to link to antiCatholic sites. In addition, it is not a good idea to post a summary like this with misinformation in it. I recommend you write your own, PJM. Save it to a text file so you can use it whenever you need it.

My friend your either mis -informed, or I’m not comprehending what your saying

 

[PJM]

=guanophore;13499955]

 Summary of process of salvation in Roman Catholicism

by Matt Slick:

ON THIS I disagree: Theologically there is a difference in receive Jesus on or tongues and OR TAKING Jesus in our Hands

This is not true either. Some may be given penance as part of confession/absolution, and all the faithful may elect penitential activities such as fasting and giving alms. Matt presents it this way to make it sound like we are earning our forgiveness by performing actions with “perfect contrition”. On the contrary, since it is unlikely that human beings can have perfect contrition, we have the Sacrament. We all have a tendency to be attached to our sins.

I’m 71 been to Confession a zillion times in many states; ALWAYS was given a “penance” to preform:shrug:

This is also a misrepresentation of the faith. The Catholic Church teaches that Jesus paid the eternal price of our sins. Matt presents this to make it look like Catholics don’t believe this. Nothing “remains” of the sin once a person is absolved. The penitent is fully and finally forgiven of the sinse they confess. What may remain are the temporal consequences of the sin. For example, a Catholic girl may have premarital sex and become pregnant. She may confess her sin, and be absolved, but there is still the pregnancy. Or, a person may commit a robbery, confess, but making restitution still remains?QUOTE]

Friend I THINK [ME!} your position borders on OSAS; and that is not a Catholic belief.

This is also a misleading statement. Not all the consequences of sins are dealt with through indulgences. Any “punishment” is temporal, not eternal, a distinction that Matt does not make. Matt uses the phrase “guilt of the sins already forgiven” to make it appoear that Catholics don’t really believe we are forgiven our sins in confession, and still have to work off the guilt. This is not the case

Your entitled to your opinion? BUT I don’t read it the same way you do.

We are obligated to make reparations/restitution as much as possible, and to conduct ourselves in a manner that is worthy of the grace we have received.

Amen!

This statement is also misleading (only partially true). Certainly the prayers of the Theotokos are powerful, and those of the saints, but all grace and remission of sins/punishment comes from Christ. He does include the word temporal here, but I am not sure he understands what it means.

There are many ways to receive an indulgence, prayer and reading scripture the most common?QUOTE]

No comment necessary.

this statement is misleading as well, since those who have gone on before us in Christ at not dead, but live forever. Furthermore, we don’t know who is in purgatory, and who is not. We can be certain that those who have rejected the grace of God are not in purgatory, so the inference that all the “dead…are in purgatory” is erroneous.

Agree!

God Bless you,
Patrick

[/QUOTE]

 

[PJM]

=Wannano;13500844]In the Matt Slick presentation PJM seemed to have condensed the CCC into simple language. I assumed that it was honorable and truthful since PJM is an informed and practicing Catholic who seems to have much authoratavie (name removed by moderator)ut into these threads.

I will simply state that I felt someone finally in a nutshell put out information that explains the Catholic understanding. To be perfectly honest it gave me the feeling that I did not need to pursue any more understanding if what I read is in fact truth because I saw error in much of what was presented.

Now Guanaphore has responded and pointed out several misreprestations. THANK YOU Guanophore.

I am also startled to find out that Matt Slick is not a Catholic. Why PJM would present his article as a truthful condensation of the CCC blows my mind.

Hopefully someone will be able to show me how I have totally misunderstood this whole thing.

It would seem that I made a MAJOR error!

I’m truly SORRY

 

[Peter_J]

In the Matt Slick presentation PJM seemed to have condensed the CCC into simple language. I assumed that it was honorable and truthful since PJM is an informed and practicing Catholic who seems to have much authoratavie (name removed by moderator)ut into these threads.

I will simply state that I felt someone finally in a nutshell put out information that explains the Catholic understanding. To be perfectly honest it gave me the feeling that I did not need to pursue any more understanding if what I read is in fact truth because I saw error in much of what was presented.

Now Guanaphore has responded and pointed out several misreprestations. THANK YOU Guanophore.

I am also startled to find out that Matt Slick is not a Catholic. Why PJM would present his article as a truthful condensation of the CCC blows my mind.

Hopefully someone will be able to show me how I have totally misunderstood this whole thing.

Which is all fine (heck, I like having you here and speaking your mind). I would only point out that those three citations (Matt Slick, PJM, Guanaphore) don’t mean anything to me (and, conversely, if you cited me it presumably wouldn’t mean anything to the vast majority of Catholics).

Keep in mind that there are over a billion of us.

 

[Peter_J]

P.S. this possibly should have it’s own thread, but here is the online version of the
United States Catholic Catechism for Adults: ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/uscca/#10

 

[Wannano]

P.S. this possibly should have it’s own thread, but here is the online version of the
United States Catholic Catechism for Adults: ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/uscca/#10

The title was inspiring but I am drawing a blank on the content!

 

[blanchardman]

I thought this would be simple to fix. Do you really believe that those Jesus says are “alive forevermore” are dead?

It seemed to me that you got a lot of very relevant replies. I would be happy to carry on if you like.

Thank you: I missed PJM’s reply. I see now that your comment was a follow up. I am ex-catholic. One of the things I quit over was this practice.
In answer to your question: I used dead in reference to one who had cast off this clay vessel.

 

[Wannano]

P.S. this possibly should have it’s own thread, but here is the online version of the
United States Catholic Catechism for Adults: ccc.usccb.org/flipbooks/uscca/#10

All I get is a blank page

 

[Tommy999]

Thank you so very much for you’re post. Has Mass become more “common” to you yet?

Might I ask; do you understand and accept the Real Presence of Holy Communion?

God Bless you,
Patrick

I only went one time, it was over a year ago. My observations were logged in the following post.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=889983

 

[spedteacherita]

Hi Rita, the site information is correct. That said was it sufficient for you to understand it?

Mary seems to be for non-Catholics a MAJOR hurdle; and I have written extensively about our beliefs; including the WHY and the HOW we can accept it information.

I’m a former Michigander myself [a UPPER] and we have dear friends on Grand-rapids:thumbsup:.
Please let me know if I can at least try to clarify anything for you

God Bless you,

Patrick

Hi, Patrick,

Yes, Northern Michigan is God’s Country, but we’re not getting the snow that we usually do this year. Already December 11th and it’s still close to 50 degrees!!

As to my “issues” with the CC, I’ve done a lot of studying over the past year as a member here and I’ve learned a lot. I’ve grown spiritually and have learned quite a bit about the various denominations represented here.

For one, and I’m not dissing Mary’s part in the birth of Jesus, I do not see any of the 1st, 2nd and maybe even the 3rd century Christians praying intercessions from Mary or any saint. Why wait until the mid-1800’s and mid-1900’s to declare the dogmas of Immaculate Conception and the Assumption?

I don’t want to focus on anyone but God - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - and I could not sit in a Mass and pray intercession from anyone but Christ.

I know, as a Lutheran, that Martin Luther still venerated Mary and that’s fine for him, but he did not deem it a dogmatic teaching of our faith. If I’m wrong and someone else can share info that I haven’t read yet, I’ll be happy to read it. My downloaded copies in binders continue to grow as I discuss these things here.

God bless!

Rita

 

[fbl9]

Where are they mandated?

God Bless you,
Patrick

....i ask the blessed ever virgin and all the angels and saints to pray for me...
then we have the lintany of the saints during Mass.

 

[shayneswenson]

Hi, Patrick,

Yes, Northern Michigan is God’s Country, but we’re not getting the snow that we usually do this year. Already December 11th and it’s still close to 50 degrees!!

As to my “issues” with the CC, I’ve done a lot of studying over the past year as a member here and I’ve learned a lot. I’ve grown spiritually and have learned quite a bit about the various denominations represented here.

For one, and I’m not dissing Mary’s part in the birth of Jesus, I do not see any of the 1st, 2nd and maybe even the 3rd century Christians praying intercessions from Mary or any saint. Why wait until the mid-1800’s and mid-1900’s to declare the dogmas of Immaculate Conception and the Assumption?

I don’t want to focus on anyone but God - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - and I could not sit in a Mass and pray intercession from anyone but Christ.

I know, as a Lutheran, that Martin Luther still venerated Mary and that’s fine for him, but he did not deem it a dogmatic teaching of our faith. If I’m wrong and someone else can share info that I haven’t read yet, I’ll be happy to read it. My downloaded copies in binders continue to grow as I discuss these things here.

God bless!

Rita

The Saints, as well as the Theotokos, have been venerated from the very beginning Rita.

 

[spedteacherita]

The Saints, as well as the Theotokos, have been venerated from the very beginning Rita.

Can you give me a reference or point me the direction to research? In my readings I have found nothing and I’d love to read more.

Thanks

Rita

 

[benhur]

Fair enough, but how does that fit with:

I don’t think they do, that is James 5 and the great commission and whoso sins ye remit are different.
Again, can you be forgiven without the gospel first ? Were not sins loosed for three thousand after Peter’s first ‘sermon’ and faith and action in/by that gospel message ?

Blessings

 

[benhur]

The Saints, as well as the Theotokos, have been venerated from the very beginning Rita.

Amen. Veneration is different verb from pray (to), or ask(for), or intercede(for). The former is from the earliest beginning, not the latter, which some would say evolved and not for all, hence the ‘strangeness’ to some.

Blessings