What do Baptists believe?

[IggyAntiochus]

What Ireally meant to say (thanks stroke) is then right ooposes social security, SSI, medicaid and medicare, the affordable health care act (minus abortion funding) afwdc, anyuthing involving federal funding. Since my stroke made me unable to work, I depend on SSI and medicaid to survive. For those who think SSI and welfare recipients are getting rich, I would like to see tehm survive on the $695 SSI I recieve a month.

I am very sad to hear of your dissablity, it is really tough I know from personal experience. I too was fairly young when I had my stroke, it aged me instantly. When I went in hospital with the stroke I had dark blond hair, When I came to 10 days after I was salt and pepper.

The SBC is nearly unananamously republican, and the republicans oppose financial care for the disabled.

It depends on what you mean by word of God. I don’t believe that God wrote or dictated the bible to human robots.

I don’t belive the bible is without human (name removed by moderator)ut. And I don’t belive that God prevented the human authors from mistakes historical or scientific.

I belive that God inspired the bible, but did not dictate it. I belive that God gave his word to fallible humans.

This is largely the product, unfortunately, of a continuing American confusion between the two kingdoms. It has become the hallmark of American Protestantism to confuse the American kingdom with the kingdom of God. This has been especially prevalent among those who are to the right of the political spectrum. At least, they are the most noted for doing it. In recent years, Christians who are politically left have made the same mistakes.

What both sides miss here is that the Church is not a worldly entity. It is in the world, but not of the world. The world operates on a different premise than the Church. God is Lord of both the secular world and the religious world, but He operates each differently. The state is devoted to God’s law and His justice (Rom. 13). The Church is an entity of the Gospel and is where God operates in His work as the giver of grace and eternal life. When these two become confused, and the state tries to be the church or the church tries to be the state, chaos is the result. The vocations of both are sundered and made ineffective for the purposes with which God instituted them.

Christians are Christians whether right or left. Both receive the same Lord at the altar. Each can be free to robustly debate the political issues of either, but they stop when they enter the doors of the place where Christ and His work as Savior is present among us.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Some articles/commentaries about Fundamentalism and the Southern Baptist Convention:

SBC Suffers Under Toxic Flood of Fundamentalism
mainstreambaptist.blogspot.com/2005/09/sbc-suffers-under-toxic-flood-of.html

BWA Withdrawal Part of Southern Baptist Leaders’ Anti-Baptist Political Agenda
brucegourley.com/fundamentalism/sbcbwa.htm

Are Conservative Southern Baptists Fundamentalists?
sharperiron.org/are-conservative-southern-baptists-fundamentalists

Anna

Be very careful in listening to anything from the mainstream baptists, Anna.

Mr. Prescot is a liberal activist who supports abortion, stem cell research, the LGBT agenda. He and his ilk also deny the inerrancy of the Bible.

The mainstream baptists are just that. Mainstream. Whatever is popular at the moment.
They hide their agenda behind words like “traditional” and “mainstream”.

Calgar,

Actually, I wasn’t siding with either conclusion regarding the question of whether or not Southern Baptists are “fundamentalists.” I simply posted the links to three articles. The third article came to the conclusion they are not.

There has, however, been a very serious conservative swing in the SBC in recent decades as posted earlier.

If you asked Baptists, individually, if they are fundamentalists or even evangelicals; you will probably get different answers.

Peace,
Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

Thanks Anna for puting into comprehensible words what are largely my own thought about the SBC and I am too intelectually incapable of saying myself.

andrewstx,

Well, I didn’t post anything that settles the question regarding whether or not SB’s are fundamentalists. There are different opinions on this issue.

I did post commentaries about the conservative swing that has occurred in the last few decades. I think that conservatism is easy to spot in the SBC.

Anna

 

[Anna_Scott]

Some articles/commentaries about Fundamentalism and the Southern Baptist Convention:

SBC Suffers Under Toxic Flood of Fundamentalism
mainstreambaptist.blogspot.com/2005/09/sbc-suffers-under-toxic-flood-of.html

BWA Withdrawal Part of Southern Baptist Leaders’ Anti-Baptist Political Agenda
brucegourley.com/fundamentalism/sbcbwa.htm

Are Conservative Southern Baptists Fundamentalists?
sharperiron.org/are-conservative-southern-baptists-fundamentalists

Anna

This is also an interesting article:
Seminary president’s report to 2007 Southern Baptist Convention
by Brent Thompson
June 18, 2007
*
. . . One criticism is that the seminary has become fundamentalist.

“One half true,” Patterson said. “When my automobile breaks down, I always want a fundamentalist auto mechanic, not an experimentalist one … But our fundamentalism is a fundamentalism of commitment to the fundamentals of God’s Word and not to legalism, which will kill as sure as liberalism will.” . . . .*

Anna

 

[mark_a]

I can’t speak for the other poster, but in my experience- not at all. Not from anyone and never, ever, ever from the pulpit.

Then you must not be from the south.

 

[nickybr38]

It’s one thing to have a misconception. It’s quite another to teach that misconception to others as truth.

Yeah, if it confuses them you’d think they’d ask a CATHOLIC what’s going on rather then making assumptions based on perception.

I don’t assume Baptists worship their Bible because they always have it on them…

 

[Calgar]

The SBC is nearly unananamously republican, and the republicans oppose financial care for the disabled.

I just want to throw in that I disagree with both of your assertations here.

 

[KathleenGee]

I don’t like using the term, ‘Bible’…but rather Sacred Scriptures because here we reflect on God’s Word in relationship to the people of faith and their ongoing journey to God.

The Bible in itself is not solely the source of God. The Bible cannot take the place of the universal Church that Christ founded.

The Church and Sacred Scripture help us to find God Who Is, and connect Him to us in our beings, the temples of the Holy Spirit.

We displeased God when we are self-righteous, whether we are using the Church or the Bible against others.

Scripture in union with believers…not in itself alone…teaches us about God, the Holy Spirit works through Scriptures in Jesus Christ…and the message of Our Lord is always salvation and redemption.

When the Bible is reduced to book/text form and used in isolation and opposition to other Christians, it is akin to some kind of idol, not bearing forth the message the Word of God is supposed to proclaim.

The Bible becomes an idol when it is used for self-aggrandizement.

Just like the Golden Calf…it was an idol…and a servant to give people what they wanted of the earth, not what God wanted, His will, obedience, fidelity to Him and His covenant.

So idols, really, are extensions of ourselves and self-will.

Christ said people can pray and cast out demons and perform all sorts of miracles, but they cannot enter heaven unless they do the will of God.

And Christ said it was to follow Him, carry one’s cross, and not be assured of one’s salvation…because He is already here among us and how do we serve Him?..feeding, clothing, visiting, loving our neighbor…we love our neighbor in Christ.

 

[andrewstx]

I don’t like using the term, ‘Bible’…but rather Sacred Scriptures because here we reflect on God’s Word in relationship to the people of faith and their ongoing journey to God.

The Bible in itself is not solely the source of God. The Bible cannot take the place of the universal Church that Christ founded.

The Church and Sacred Scripture help us to find God Who Is, and connect Him to us in our beings, the temples of the Holy Spirit.

We displeased God when we are self-righteous, whether we are using the Church or the Bible against others.

Scripture in union with believers…not in itself alone…teaches us about God, the Holy Spirit works through Scriptures in Jesus Christ…and the message of Our Lord is always salvation and redemption.

When the Bible is reduced to book/text form and used in isolation and opposition to other Christians, it is akin to some kind of idol, not bearing forth the message the Word of God is supposed to proclaim.

The Bible becomes an idol when it is used for self-aggrandizement.

Just like the Golden Calf…it was an idol…and a servant to give people what they wanted of the earth, not what God wanted, His will, obedience, fidelity to Him and His covenant.

So idols, really, are extensions of ourselves and self-will.

Christ said people can pray and cast out demons and perform all sorts of miracles, but they cannot enter heaven unless they do the will of God.

And Christ said it was to follow Him, carry one’s cross, and not be assured of one’s salvation…because He is already here among us and how do we serve Him?..feeding, clothing, visiting, loving our neighbor…we love our neighbor in Christ.

where is the “like” button here? I agree.

 

[JustaServant]

I don’t like using the term, ‘Bible’…but rather Sacred Scriptures because here we reflect on God’s Word in relationship to the people of faith and their ongoing journey to God.

The Bible in itself is not solely the source of God. The Bible cannot take the place of the universal Church that Christ founded.

The Church and Sacred Scripture help us to find God Who Is, and connect Him to us in our beings, the temples of the Holy Spirit.

We displeased God when we are self-righteous, whether we are using the Church or the Bible against others.

Scripture in union with believers…not in itself alone…teaches us about God, the Holy Spirit works through Scriptures in Jesus Christ…and the message of Our Lord is always salvation and redemption.

When the Bible is reduced to book/text form and used in isolation and opposition to other Christians, it is akin to some kind of idol, not bearing forth the message the Word of God is supposed to proclaim.

The Bible becomes an idol when it is used for self-aggrandizement.

Just like the Golden Calf…it was an idol…and a servant to give people what they wanted of the earth, not what God wanted, His will, obedience, fidelity to Him and His covenant.

So idols, really, are extensions of ourselves and self-will.

Christ said people can pray and cast out demons and perform all sorts of miracles, but they cannot enter heaven unless they do the will of God.

And Christ said it was to follow Him, carry one’s cross, and not be assured of one’s salvation…because He is already here among us and how do we serve Him?..feeding, clothing, visiting, loving our neighbor…we love our neighbor in Christ.

You mean like “Bible believing church”?
Maybe Catholics should call ourselves a “Jesus believing church”.

 

[Calgar]

I don’t believe that God wrote or dictated the bible to human robots.

I don’t belive the bible is without human (name removed by moderator)ut. And I don’t belive that God prevented the human authors from mistakes historical or scientific.

I belive that God inspired the bible, but did not dictate it. I belive that God gave his word to fallible humans.

This clears things up.

This is an argument put to me recently by a Methodist. She disagrees with several things written in the Bible (things that the SBC and RCC actually agree on). Her way of dealing with her blatant disregard for God’s word is to deny it by saying it’s full of errors whenever it says something she doesn’t like.

 

[KathleenGee]

I approve of the name, ‘Bible’, for a class setting…“Let’s take out our Bibles now and open to…”

The use of Sacred Scriptures is to teach us Truth and Morality Whose source is God, personified in Christ Jesus.

Truth can only be truly explained…not in philosophical/intellectual/literal terms…because then you have the same problem as reducing faith to book form: multiple interpretations, relativism…who is right, who is wrong…

Subsequently the only way to explain what Truth is, is Jesus Christ Himself, the living person, His Divine and Human Nature…and the implications for us of how this understanding of Him is lived out…not reduced to intellectual terms.

Therefore, Jesus came to fulfill the Law…and to bring us into the Covenant of the Blood…which cannot be reduced to book form.

So if one can only find Christ in the Bible, he is already rejecting Christ’s intent on choosing apostles and needs to take a second look at why Christ did not pass out Bibles at the very beginning.

On a deeper level, Sacred Scriptures is indeed Jesus Christ, the Eternal Word Made Flesh.

Our faith in God is incarnational, not book form.

Protestants should take a look at our understanding and profound and diverse implication into the Church of the Incarnation…and then see just how much broader our understanding of Christ’s Divinity and Humanity truly is, and how we are also given more faith…to trust Jesus at work in the Church through its believers and human authority, in spite of our own propensity to sin and failure.

Christ is the Resurrection is every day is new, a chance to begin again.

Our faith in God is great, because we believe the Eucharist is the Word Made Flesh, and that we can see Christ ministering to us through His human ministers, who stand in union with Him. That is why we are really ecclesial deists.

We have the Church, not one man and his unchallenged excesses, as the authentic interpreter through the Holy Spirit of the Word of God.

 

[KathleenGee]

Catholicism can look beyond misspellings and identify the presence of God at work in Scripture.

But there also must be a contextual and progressive understanding of Scripture where all parts relate and connect to each other.

Catholicism is about context.

We believe God is the author of life, of man, Who made man in His image, Who gave us free will and intellect, and to rule over His creation as He said in Genesis.

But the minute how’s…we are open to science.

Interestingly enough, there was a big scandal on how the Catholic Church condemned Galileo. Part of the problem was that another scientist was working on a part in astronomy, sequential knowledge, and that was not proven as truth yet.

Then Galileo wanted to remove a line of Scripture to prove his scientific claims…whose foundation was not yet verified in this other scientific study…

 

[andrewstx]

I just want to throw in that I disagree with both of your assertations here.

That’s your right.

 

[andrewstx]

This clears things up.

This is an argument put to me recently by a Methodist. She disagrees with several things written in the Bible (things that the SBC and RCC actually agree on). Her way of dealing with her blatant disregard for God’s word is to deny it by saying it’s full of errors whenever it says something she doesn’t like.

And yet you claim not to be a fundamentalist

If you look at religion in my headers, you will discover I am neither Latin Catholic, or Methodist, I am Antiochian Orthodox.

But I agree about %100 percent with Catholic teachings, much more than Baptist.

 

[stewstew03]

It’s not a problem for me at all, andrew.

Stewstew and I joke about it because of an old relationship between the Vatican and the SBC.

The SBC used to have a delegation at the Vatican. I’d say 10 or more years ago the SBC left the Vatican because they were too “ecumenical”.

As to the working together part? YES! In this world we live in Christians must work together, or we could be taken apart a piece (did I spell piece right?) at a time.

 

[stewstew03]

Calgar,

Actually, I wasn’t siding with either conclusion regarding the question of whether or not Southern Baptists are “fundamentalists.” I simply posted the links to three articles. The third article came to the conclusion they are not.

There has, however, been a very serious conservative swing in the SBC in recent decades as posted earlier.

If you asked Baptists, individually, if they are fundamentalists or even evangelicals; you will probably get different answers.

Peace,
Anna

I pray that the SBC remains “conservative” over the life of its existence. Not in the political sense, but in the socio-theological sense. The Good Lord knows we do not need any more protestant denominations putting their stamp of approval on important social issues such as homosexual marriage, abortion, divorce, etc. (looking at you Episcopals)…

Fight the good fight SBC!

 

[stewstew03]

Yeah, if it confuses them you’d think they’d ask a CATHOLIC what’s going on rather then making assumptions based on perception.

I don’t assume Baptists worship their Bible because they always have it on them…

 

[guanophore]

If we interpreted the Bible literally, don’t you think we’d do communion a bit differently?

Yes, I do!

But I thought the SBC did interpret the Bible literally, except when to do so sounded too Catholic, then it must mean something else.

The SBC is not a fundamentalist denomination. If the fundamentalists have been taking over for 30 years they aren’t doing that good of a job.

I was involved in a SBC congregation in Ohio that was very fundamentalist. Maybe it varies according to location?

 

[PRmerger]

You mean like “Bible believing church”?
Maybe Catholics should call ourselves a “Jesus believing church”.

If this were Facebook I’d click “Like!”

But as it is, I’m going to take this, if you don’t mind, and add it to my word document of Apologetics “zingers” that I’ve picked up on the CAFs.

Some others that I’ve liked are:

• We can’t be saved without Him, he won’t save us without us.—fhansen
• The Bible is an example of the development of doctrine…it came from Sacred Tradition–pablope
• Contraception is the theory; abortion is the practice–(sadly, I can’t recall the CAF member to give him/her credit)
• The Church does not teach us to let our conscience be our guide, it teaches us to let God be our guide. -(again, I forgot to cite the CAF author on my word document)
• There are no “two people within the CC”. You are projecting your Protestant reality into the CC. There is the teaching of the Church and it is clear to all through the Catechism, encyclicals etc—Philthy (in response to the criticism that Catholics, too, are in disnunity.)
• Not being able to marry or to become romantically involved with someone is not something surprising. It is the norm for every single human being with respect to almost every single other human being.-Jimmy Akin (in response to the objection that homosexuals are being discriminated against because they cannot marry whomever they choose)
• -Scripture was never intended to be a full compendium of the faith. --guanophore
• Grace is not always efficacious but always sufficient.—benedictus2
• Catholics have a corpus (body) on the cross because we are saved by Jesus and not by a cross.—Fr. Serpa (in response to why Catholics have a crucifix and not a cross in their churches)