What Do Jehovah's Witnesses Believe?

[Ravyn_Guiliani]

Ravyn_Guiliani,

Can I ask what it was that made you leave that cult?

well I doubt if many here would be interested in the details of why I left—and it is a long story—so I will post this link to another site where it is and you all can read it if you want to.

disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?disc=46743;article=2853;title=Searching%20for%20Long%20Lost%20JWs%20and%20Ex-JWs

Ravyn

 

[yessisan]

well I doubt if many here would be interested in the details of why I left—and it is a long story—so I will post this link to another site where it is and you all can read it if you want to.

disc.server.com/discussion.cgi?disc=46743;article=2853;title=Searching%20for%20Long%20Lost%20JWs%20and%20Ex-JWs

Ravyn

I’ll be reading it in a second.

Just a thought, have you gotten in contact with Jeff Schwehm? He has a ministry of Catholic ex-JWs.

jschwehm

He used to be one too… maybe you’d like to join his discussion group and tell your story there!

 

[juno24]

Check here for yourself… that is, if they actually quoted where in the bible it’s supposed to say that.

Thanks, yessisan. It is in Luke 1: 46-48 (the beginning of the Magnificat):

“46 And Mary said: “My soul magnifies Jehovah, 47 and my spirit cannot keep from being overjoyed at God my Savior; 48 because he has looked upon the low position of his slave girl. For, look! from now on all generations will pronounce me happy;”

I don’t know the ancient languages, so someone who does can weigh in, but it seems to me that “happy” and 'blessed" have two entirely different meanings.

 

[BibleSteve]

I wouldn’t get too wrapped up in understanding their “torture stake” vs. “cross.” The New World Translation is notoriously suspect. In fact, academics have found that it’s not based on any solid scholarship.

There are, of course, many critics of the NWT. Here is one book that examines bias in translations. It’s conclusion was that the NWT was actually one of the most accurate translations.

 

[yessisan]

Thanks, yessisan. It is in Luke 1: 46-48 (the beginning of the Magnificat):

“46 And Mary said: “My soul magnifies Jehovah, 47 and my spirit cannot keep from being overjoyed at God my Savior; 48 because he has looked upon the low position of his slave girl. For, look! from now on all generations will pronounce me happy;”

I don’t know the ancient languages, so someone who does can weigh in, but it seems to me that “happy” and 'blessed" have two entirely different meanings.

Thanks Judy, I did find that on the article from the watchtower, and looked it up on their online bible, and that’s what it say… “happy”…

 

[yessisan]

Miserissima;2260889:

I wouldn’t get too wrapped up in understanding their “torture stake” vs. “cross.” The New World Translation is notoriously suspect. In fact, academics have found that it’s not based on any solid scholarship.

There are, of course, many critics of the NWT. Here is one book that examines bias in translations. It’s conclusion was that the NWT was actually one of the most accurate translations.

tetragrammaton.org/truthintrans.htm

Steve

This is a obviously a JW approved site because if you search the NWT on any search engine, it will tell you it is completely wrong.

Just look at this

 

[BibleSteve]

This is a obviously a JW approved site because if you search the NWT on any search engine, it will tell you it is completely wrong.

Obviously a JW approved site?

Neither the book I referenced or the review site had anything to do with JW’s. The book was written by a non-JW professor and the site that reviewed the book was non-JW.

If the criteria for deciding whether something is right or wrong is to simply type the topic into a search engine and see if someone is criticizing, the bar has been set pretty low.

I prefer to read both side of a story before making a conclusion. That is why I’ve read so many anti-JW books.

Steve

 

[yessisan]

Obviously a JW approved site?

Neither the book I referenced or the review site had anything to do with JW’s. The book was written by a non-JW professor and the site that reviewed the book was non-JW.

If the criteria for deciding whether something is right or wrong is to simply type the topic into a search engine and see if someone is criticizing, the bar has been set pretty low.

I prefer to read both side of a story before making a conclusion.

I read it, and I saw it was a “non-JW” who reviewed it, so don’t tell me I don’t know both sides of the story… but that website is a JW site, maybe not an approved one by the WTBS, but the content of it is surely JW. No wonder that article is on there…

An don’t tell me it’s not a JW site because all of it had to do with your bible and your WTBS…

That is why I’ve read so many anti-JW books.

You actually have read anti-JW books? Can I ask which ones? I also don’t mean to go against you or anything or question your faith, but as a JW, aren’t you going against the Watchtower by reading non-JW literature?

 

[dawgfan]

There are, of course, many critics of the NWT. Here is one book that examines bias in translations. It’s conclusion was that the NWT was actually one of the most accurate translations.

tetragrammaton.org/truthintrans.htm

Steve

Care to discuss what Jason David BeDuhn’s conclusion is about the insertion of “jehovah” in the New Testament?

 

[yessisan]

Care to discuss what Jason David BeDuhn’s conclusion is about the insertion of “jehovah” in the New Testament?

To add to dawgfan’s question regarding the insertion of anything in the Bibile, what does Rev. 22: 18-19 say?

 

[dawgfan]

Obviously a JW approved site?

Neither the book I referenced or the review site had anything to do with JW’s. The book was written by a non-JW professor and the site that reviewed the book was non-JW.

If the criteria for deciding whether something is right or wrong is to simply type the topic into a search engine and see if someone is criticizing, the bar has been set pretty low.

I prefer to read both side of a story before making a conclusion. That is why I’ve read so many anti-JW books.

Steve

The writer of the book (Jason David BeDuhn) is not a JW.

I suspect the writer of the review on the website you provided is a JW.

 

[Maggie1951]

I was the best JW they ever had. I was third generation, raised near Brooklyn Headquarters in the company of the ‘Governing Body’, my father was an elder and one of the annointed (who was going to heaven,) I was a pioneer—(missionary) for 15 years, I left at age 34. I literally lost everything and everyone to leave and had death threats for years afterwards from family members. Do not let them mislead you—I was on the deep inside of the cult and it is absolutely Satanic. The average JW does not have a clue what goes on behind the Watchtower walls. It is a dangerous cult and not in the slightest bit Christian. And incidentally, I was not kicked out—I walked away willingly.
A true perspective of the group is found in the book Crisis of Conscience written by Ray Franz—the nephew of the late President of WTBS Fred Franz–he was as inside as you can get and he left and is now the number one enemy. He lives near Atlanta.
Ravyn

No, I was the best! LOL

You are correct in the best book a ‘questioning’ Jehovah’s Witness can read would be ‘Crisis of Conscience’…

Jehovah’s Witnesses deserve credit where credit is due. Many of them are better than they would have been had they not been contacted by Jehovah’s Witnesses. However, once you’re in that mind-set, and if you’re a questioning person, you begin to wonder at some point while sitting in the Kingdom Hall, if what you just heard it ‘right’…BUT you cannot question an elder because if there is a hint that you may be questioning your faith, you could be disfellowshipped.

At any rate, I don’t believe the cross issue is an important one in that they do believe that Jesus was nailed to something. And that’s the important issue. Jesus died so we could be saved from death. He suffered, he died, and he was buried.

Again, if it had not been for my aunt, who was a JW, I probably would not have learned the Bible as well as I did. I just had to relearn it a bit Pillar of Fire Pillar of Truth was excellent in helping me with that. That pointed me to Church Fathers, and in fact, I started taking courses through a Catholic University. I’ve studied the Catholic Faith by reading a lot from Ignatius Press, I have Navarre Bible Commentaries, and a lot of the Catholic Apologetics out there have helped me a lot. At one point, I was in to reading the Liturgy of the Hours, saying the rosary, etc. Again, if you’ve read my introduction in the New Comers section, God has been trying to get my attention for years through various methods.

Maggie

 

[Ahimsa]

Tell Me More, May 22, 2007 · As host of the PBS documentary series Independent Lens, actor Terrence Howard introduces viewers to the film Knocking. It’s a look inside the Jehovah’s Witness religion. He talks candidly to NPR about the film and his personal connection to the faith.

Howard prides himself on choosing roles that speak to him. It is an ethic he has held close to him throughout his career in Hollywood, demonstrated through his performances in films such as Mr. Holland’s Opus, Crash, Lackawanna Blues and, most recently, Pride. His Academy Award nomination for Hustle & Flow helped him become a household name.

With all that glitz, his rise to fame is more familiar than his spiritual journey to most people.

(Terrence Howard was raised Muslim, not JW, by the way.)

 

[BibleSteve]

but that website is a JW site, maybe not an approved one by the WTBS, but the content of it is surely JW. No wonder that article is on there…

An don’t tell me it’s not a JW site because all of it had to do with your bible and your WTBS…

I’ll try this one more time and I’ll leave it alone.

You criticized the NWT as “unscholarly”. I pointed you to a book written by a non-JW University Religious Professor who compared the NWT against 8 other popular translations and concluded in many regards, the NWT was a better translation than most.

I could have simply pointed you at Amazon.com, but I thought an exhaustive review of the book by a non-JW who is critical of JW’s and their NWT would be of interest. That’s why I pointed you to the link at tetragrammaton.org/truthintrans.htm

The author of that site has never been a JW and is critical of many aspects of JW’s and the NWT. Even then, he agrees and disagress with the author of the book. The review/analysis makes for very interesting reading for anyone who’s interested in understanding both sides of the controversy.

Now that should give ample room for discussion around specific aspects of the NWT and its translation choices.

Or, you could ignore the specifics of the analysis and just argue that anyone who says something positive about JW’s and the NWT must be a JW site in disguise.

Steve

 

[yessisan]

I’ll try this one more time and I’ll leave it alone.

You criticized the NWT as “unscholarly”. I pointed you to a book written by a non-JW University Religious Professor who compared the NWT against 8 other popular translations and concluded in many regards, the NWT was a better translation than most.

I could have simply pointed you at Amazon.com, but I thought an exhaustive review of the book by a non-JW who is critical of JW’s and their NWT would be of interest. That’s why I pointed you to the link at tetragrammaton.org/truthintrans.htm

The author of that site has never been a JW and is critical of many aspects of JW’s and the NWT. Even then, he agrees and disagress with the author of the book. The review/analysis makes for very interesting reading for anyone who’s interested in understanding both sides of the controversy.

Now that should give ample room for discussion around specific aspects of the NWT and its translation choices.

Or, you could ignore the specifics of the analysis and just argue that anyone who says something positive about JW’s and the NWT must be a JW site in disguise.

Steve

Whether or not this site is of a JW, it sure sounds like it…

Anywho, I don’t argue with everyone when they say something positive about the JWs. I have never said if someone says something good about the JWs they are JWs in disguise.

I say good things about them and I’m not a JW in disguise. I think most are very honest people. I think they try their best at being “Christians” and most are very, very nice people.

One thing I don’t like about the JWs is that the WTBS doesn’t allow any questioning of the faith. You guys aren’t allowed to think on your own w/o the Watchtower reprimanding you.

By all means, be a JW, but I sure wish JWs were allowed to question the faith so they could learn more about God. I, as a Catholic, am allowed to question my faith, and if I want, I can attend other religious services. If I want, I can search for answers on my own and they can be of non-Catholic origin.

To me, Catholicism makes sense. To you, the Watchtower does. Good for you. I don’t mind it when someone is a JW, what I mind is the constant attack against the Catholic Church. If you were ever present at a Mass, there will never be non-Catholic bashing. The priest never attacks other religions. When my pastor mentions other religions, he just says he prays so that they are saved. Nothing bad is said about JWs or other Christians, or Muslims or Jews… On the other hand, my experience at Kingdom Hall meetings or at assemblies is that the Catholic Church is ALWAYS attacked. But may I ask why? That is all I have against your religion.

Yes, my husband is a JW, and it worries me because he isn’t allowed to celebrate anything, he isn’t allowed to think on his own, he isn’t allowed to go to college, he isn’t allowed to be friends w/non-JWs. I could go on, but I’m pretty sure you get my point. He is a lovely person! He is wonderful, I can’t complain about him (except for some things we’re going through in our marriage). I am worried about him not being able to be happy.

Oh, and another thing I dislike about JWs is that they try to convert everyone they meet. Hey, my husband tried it on me when we first met! I hate to be bohtered by telemarketers on the phone while I’m relaxing at home, that same thing applies to JWs who come knocking on people’s doors. They were not invited! I’m pretty sure many people feel this way. If I were to go knocking on your door to try to evangelize you, you’d kick me out, wouldn’t you? You wouldn’t even take the time that most of us give your JW brothers and sisters, to even listen to a word we had to say. You won’t even do it when you are inside our homes. You don’t even accept any literature from our religion, why should we do that for you?

I can go on and on, but I’ll bore you, so I’ll leave it at that. I don’t want to scare you off or offend you in any way. I just am stating facts that most of you don’t see.

But hey, you guys ARE unique in many ways. My parish is being remodeled, and it’s taking about 10 yrs to gather up the money for it, and it’ll take maybe a yr or 2 to remodel it, compared to you guys, you can tear up a building and rebuild it in 2 wks!!! Kuddos for your community!! You guys are an example of love between Christian brothers, but the one thing that differentiate your religion from a true Christian religion is that we do believe in the blessed Trinity (and I say true because to be a Christian, you have to believe in the Trinity, not just on Christ).

 

[BibleSteve]

Oh, and another thing I dislike about JWs is that they try to convert everyone they meet. Hey, my husband tried it on me when we first met! I hate to be bohtered by telemarketers on the phone while I’m relaxing at home, that same thing applies to JWs who come knocking on people’s doors. They were not invited! I’m pretty sure many people feel this way. If I were to go knocking on your door to try to evangelize you, you’d kick me out, wouldn’t you? You wouldn’t even take the time that most of us give your JW brothers and sisters, to even listen to a word we had to say. You won’t even do it when you are inside our homes. You don’t even accept any literature from our religion, why should we do that for you?

Thank you for the very heartfelt and thoughtful post. I really enjoyed reading it several times.

I’d like to comment on this small portion of your post. Certainly, JW’s are known worldwide for their preaching work. Many people are unaware of the scope of our activity. With 6.5 Million members actively engaged in this preaching work, we can hand-deliver a tract message to virtually every household on the planet in about 3 weeks. And we do this several times each year in 350 languages. Most of you will likely be receiving a personal invitation to the District Convention “Follow the Christ” shortly.

Jesus commanded his followers to “Go make disciples…” (Matt 28:19, 20) “This good news of the kingdom will be preached throughout the entire inhabited earth…” (Matt 24:14)

Who does this apply to?

Jesus set the example himself and sent his disciples out in pairs to do this preaching work.

How were Jesus and his disciples treated by actively preaching to others? What happened to the Apostle Paul? They were viciously attacked for doing what Jesus asked them to do.

The sad reality is that by following Jesus commands JW’s are treated rudely and viciously by householders of various Christian faiths. We have dogs sicked on us. We have boiling water thrown on us. We are yelled out. We have been stabbed, shot at, even tarred and feathered. I’ve had an adult man yell, scream, and swear at my 12 year old son (reducing him to tears), yelling: “You’re not even Christian, and I am !!! Get off my porch and never come back!!!

Why do we endure this?

We are simply trying to follow Jesus command for us to go preach the Kingdom message following his own example.

Jesus asked us to do this so we do it. It’s not always pleasurable, but we do it out of love for Jesus and love of neighbor.

Steve

 

[BibleSteve]

If I were to go knocking on your door to try to evangelize you, you’d kick me out, wouldn’t you? You wouldn’t even take the time that most of us give your JW brothers and sisters, to even listen to a word we had to say. You won’t even do it when you are inside our homes. You don’t even accept any literature from our religion, why should we do that for you?

Actually, people of other religious faiths rarely knock on my door. It’s really just about JW’s and Mormons.

However, I am always polite and receptive. Anytime the Mormons come to my door, I have a very enjoyable conversation with them questioning them about their beliefs and how they support it with the Bible.

I’d personally love it if more people of religious faith came to my door for discussions.

If I was busy, I’d politely ask them to come back another time.

Steve

 

[yessisan]

Thank you for the very heartfelt and thoughtful post. I really enjoyed reading it several times.

I’d like to comment on this small portion of your post. Certainly, JW’s are known worldwide for their preaching work. Many people are unaware of the scope of our activity. With 6.5 Million members actively engaged in this preaching work, we can hand-deliver a tract message to virtually every household on the planet in about 3 weeks. And we do this several times each year in 350 languages. Most of you will likely be receiving a personal invitation to the District Convention “Follow the Christ” shortly.

Jesus commanded his followers to “Go make disciples…” (Matt 28:19, 20) “This good news of the kingdom will be preached throughout the entire inhabited earth…” (Matt 24:14)

Who does this apply to?

Jesus set the example himself and sent his disciples out in pairs to do this preaching work.

How were Jesus and his disciples treated by actively preaching to others? What happened to the Apostle Paul? They were viciously attacked for doing what Jesus asked them to do.

The sad reality is that by following Jesus commands JW’s are treated rudely and viciously by householders of various Christian faiths. We have dogs sicked on us. We have boiling water thrown on us. We are yelled out. We have been stabbed, shot at, even tarred and feathered. I’ve had an adult man yell, scream, and swear at my 12 year old son (reducing him to tears), yelling: “You’re not even Christian, and I am !!! Get off my porch and never come back!!!

Why do we endure this?

We are simply trying to follow Jesus command for us to go preach the Kingdom message following his own example.

Jesus asked us to do this so we do it. It’s not always pleasurable, but we do it out of love for Jesus and love of neighbor.

Steve

First of, I am really sorry people act that way toward you guys. That is one thing I hate when my husband goes out to preach. I don’t like it when people mistreat him or offend him.

But that’s what makes you guys even more unique. Even though I don’t believe in going door to door, and I hate being bothered in my own home (but then again, I am married to a JW). You guys don’t let things like that come in between you and your relationship with God. I admire the way you guys try to save people, but to us, remember that we think you’re teaching wrong things.

But if you compare Catholics to JWs in the preaching sense, well, that is why we teach catechism, we have programs to teach about Catholicism for children, adolescents and adults.

I have a class of 11 children who I am preparing for their first communion. Catholics don’t believe in the door to door thing because the conversion has to come from one’s heart (in my opinion). God calls upon the non-Catholics and if his call is listened to by those people, then they come to our Church. We don’t have to look for people to convert, the people come to us on their own.

Actually, people of other religious faiths rarely knock on my door. It’s really just about JW’s and Mormons.

However, I am always polite and receptive. Anytime the Mormons come to my door, I have a very enjoyable conversation with them questioning them about their beliefs and how they support it with the Bible.

I’d personally love it if more people of religious faith came to my door for discussions.

If I was busy, I’d politely ask them to come back another time.

Steve

Yeah, I don’t think any other religions have people going from door to door, except JWs and Mormons. And when it comes to those 2 religions I lean more towards the JWs since that religion is closer to our belief system.

I don’t want to be rude to you guys, and I am not rude when a JW knocks on my door, I simply say I am happy being a Catholic, and I do mention to them I am married to a JW, but the last time I had one knocking on my door was about 2.5 months ago. I think because I told them my husband’s a JW, they stopped coming.

Before I did have a pioneer lady and a publisher visit me all the time, but I got to a point where I needed that to stop, so I politely asked the pioneer to stop coming because I will never stop being Catholic.

Thanks for sticking around and not being rude to us. A few JWs have stopped by and been a bit rude, but you have shown us you are different!

 

[Ravyn_Guiliani]

I don’t mind it when someone is a JW, what I mind is the constant attack against the Catholic Church. If you were ever present at a Mass, there will never be non-Catholic bashing. The priest never attacks other religions. When my pastor mentions other religions, he just says he prays so that they are saved. Nothing bad is said about JWs or other Christians, or Muslims or Jews… On the other hand, my experience at Kingdom Hall meetings or at assemblies is that the Catholic Church is ALWAYS attacked. .

just this last Sunday our priest asked three times to pray for Rev.(he used that title himself in referring to him) Jerry Falwell and his family and his ‘church that is now left without their beloved shepherd’. It was alot nicer than Jerry ever had to say about the Catholic Church. (we are only about 20miles from Lynchburg, VA)
Jehovah’s Witnesses hate the Catholic Church. I personally think it is jealousy.
Ravyn

 

[Aprilbaby]

then when you are done reading the propaganda on their official website do a Google and read the reality of what they believe from people who suffered thru it. Here is an objective link—which includes sample chapters of Ray Franz’s book and links for websites like Free Minds run by former JWs who have broken free:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jehovah’s_Witnesses

oh and don’t forget silentlambs.org (makes the Catholic sex scandals look like a bad hair day.)

Ravyn

In all fairness if you do a google search you’ll negative things also you shouldn’t believe everything you read from angry people. Theres always 2 and 3 sides to each stroy.