What do people have against the Jesuits?

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LoreenBernadett

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Hello,
I’m new here to CAF and I’m also a newly baptized Catholic.

In my research and reading on the Catholic faith I’ve seen some very negative things being said about Jesuits and not just from non-Catholics. I’ve also heard negative things from Catholics as well, especially in regard to Pope Francis.

This is something I just can’t wrap my head around. Why would Christians have such negativity toward the society of JESUS? I asked some of my fellow parishioners and they just put their heads down and started mumbling…

Can you all help me make sense of this?

Many thanks and blessings from the Newbie,
Loreen
 
They shouldn’t have a problem if they are Catholic. I mean let’s look at their accomplishments:

-reconverting much of Europe, including but not limited to: reconverting Poland, keeping Spain Catholic, reconverting much of France, reconverting southern and western Germany, and keeping Austria Catholic.

-converting much of Asia and most of the Americas that are Catholic

-spreading devotion to the Sacred Heart of Jesus, the Immaculate Heart of Mary, and the Eucharist, as well as the rosary

-significant scientific contributions

-contributions in economics and law

-enormous theological accomplishments, which, while not always entirely spot on, surely contributed a lot to the Church as a whole (St. Robert Bellarmine, Francisco Suarez)

-Helping the poor

There is much more too.

Perhaps Dominicans are upset that they took the theological spotlight off of them for a couple centuries, and the Franciscans in terms of feeding the hungry. 😃
 
I think when people are upset it’s because in the last 50 or 100 years there have been a fairly high number of Jesuits who had heterodox beliefs. For instance, in Latin America there were a relatively large number of Jesuits in Liberation Theology. So, some people are wary of them for this reason, and the order has unfortunately come to be known for this.

Some people are hoping that Pope Francis will be able to refrom the Jesuits to some extent, to get the order back on track.
 
Like McCall1981 said, it’s not the Society of Jesus, indeed one of the greatest Orders in the history of the Church. I think it is precisely because the Order is so great and has accomplished so much that the devil has gone after its members in such a singular way. Did you know they have a special vow of obedience to the Pope?

What informed and faithful Catholics are concerned about is a sad trend in recent decades, among many of the Order’s members and schools, toward dissent, disobedience, and Modernism in the sense defined by Popes Pius IX (Syllabus of Errors), Pius X (Lamentabili sane; Pascendi dominici gregis), and others. This trend is not, of course, limited to Jesuits, nor have all of them followed it (look at Fr. Mitch Pacwa, for example, Fr. Joseph Fessio, or Fr. Robert Spitzer, all good Jesuits); but many others have been a prominent part of the Modernist-tending movement (take America Magazine, for example).

I think this is partly because of their involvement in theology and especially academia, in which spheres one tends to ask a lot of questions, explore limits, and find new ways of expressing things. These can of course be good things, but there are inherent dangers, as we have seen especially in the U.S. where questioning authority is part of the fabric of our society.
 
The Jesuits get flack from two fronts.
  1. Anti-catholics have historically found Jesuits irresistable due to their profound influence on the Americas and western intellectual life. My favorite is the conspiracy theorists who assert that it was a Jesuit cabal who assassinated Abraham Lincoln! Jesuits were to old-time anti-catholics what Opus Dei is to Dan Brown.
  2. More recently, (late 60’s to early 90’s) an awful lot of Jesuits went loony in theology. Their order seemed to be particularly susceptible to Liberation Theology, a worldview that is essentially Marxism with a thin veneer of christianity applied on top and some of the vocabulary changed. The major error being that LT cops out by using the rich and powerful as scapegoats for all the world’s ill instead of calling EVERYBODY to repentance and forgiveness.
Fortunately, the loony fringe Jesuits attracted nearly ZERO new vocations in the last 25 years, so they are being phased out and orthodox Jesuits are gaining a stronger voice in the order all the time. Hurray!
 
It is that the Jesuits have done such great things when one goes bad, they go baaad. :bigyikes: 😃

Also, do not forget that the first Bishop of the USA was a Jesuit (Bishop John Carroll). 👍
 
I attended Loyola Academy (Jesuit Preparatory School) and then matriculated at the University of Notre Dame (Congregation of the Holy Cross or CSC). My CSC rector often chided me “why didn’t you go to a Catholic high school…?” 😛

As others mentioned, and was my experience, it is because of the challenging nature of the Jesuits in terms of education boundaries. However, we were encouraged to explore those boundaries to the fullest, but not necessarily embrace them. Still remember Fr. Dwyer saying “a little knowledge in the wrong hands is a dangerous thing”
 
The Jesuits get flack from two fronts.
  1. Anti-catholics have historically found Jesuits irresistable due to their profound influence on the Americas and western intellectual life. My favorite is the conspiracy theorists who assert that it was a Jesuit cabal who assassinated Abraham Lincoln! Jesuits were to old-time anti-catholics what Opus Dei is to Dan Brown.
  2. More recently, (late 60’s to early 90’s) an awful lot of Jesuits went loony in theology. Their order seemed to be particularly susceptible to Liberation Theology, a worldview that is essentially Marxism with a thin veneer of christianity applied on top and some of the vocabulary changed. The major error being that LT cops out by using the rich and powerful as scapegoats for all the world’s ill instead of calling EVERYBODY to repentance and forgiveness.
Fortunately, the loony fringe Jesuits attracted nearly ZERO new vocations in the last 25 years, so they are being phased out and orthodox Jesuits are gaining a stronger voice in the order all the time. Hurray!
AMEN:o
 
The Jesuits get flack from two fronts.
  1. Anti-catholics have historically found Jesuits irresistable due to their profound influence on the Americas and western intellectual life. My favorite is the conspiracy theorists who assert that it was a Jesuit cabal who assassinated Abraham Lincoln! Jesuits were to old-time anti-catholics what Opus Dei is to Dan Brown.
  2. More recently, (late 60’s to early 90’s) an awful lot of Jesuits went loony in theology. Their order seemed to be particularly susceptible to Liberation Theology, a worldview that is essentially Marxism with a thin veneer of christianity applied on top and some of the vocabulary changed. The major error being that LT cops out by using the rich and powerful as scapegoats for all the world’s ill instead of calling EVERYBODY to repentance and forgiveness.
Fortunately, the loony fringe Jesuits attracted nearly ZERO new vocations in the last 25 years, so they are being phased out and orthodox Jesuits are gaining a stronger voice in the order all the time. Hurray!
This seems to be the case for more than just the Jesuits. I’ve heard a lot of people say this is going on throughout the Church, I certainly hope so 🙂

The new Bishop of my Diocese (Oakland) is a Jesuit, and he is very orthodox.
 
I suppose among some traditional English Anglicans there may also be residual prejudice related to undercover activity by Jesuits following the English Reformation, back when heresy against the Protestantism and loyalty to Rome was equated with treason - especially under Elizabeth I who wasn’t considered legitimate (by birth or as Queen) by the Pope.

Though much of the traditional, Reformation-based prejudice in England based on disloyalty (rather than issues such as sexual morality) has reduced massively in the last few centuries, except for some residual echoes in historical films.

I guess this - along with undercover activity in other countries where Catholics were persecuted - may be part of the origin the stories of sinister Jesuit conspiracies I guess.
 
My favorite is the conspiracy theorists who assert that it was a Jesuit cabal who assassinated Abraham Lincoln! Jesuits were to old-time anti-catholics what Opus Dei is to Dan Brown.
:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

The Dan Brown thing really got me going. 😃
 
I’d be worried if people weren’t hating on Jesus. He said they would hate us.
 
I think the one of the main reasons was the stand of many of their members on Liberation Theology throughout Central America and the complete desertion of their duties by some in support of said theology.In the case of Nicaragua many actually joing forces with an avowed Communist government which included serving in upper level government positions. By and large the Jesuit leadership refused to do anything about this other than pay lip service to very explicit directives that came from the Vatican concerning the ceasing of such activities.eek:.

In one historic and widely noted incident, one of the Jesuit Priests who occupied a position in the Nicaraguan Cabinet, was told directly, to his face, by Pope John Paul II that he, the Priests had to regularize his situation. He could not be in the position that he held. He refused to leave his post and faced no censure from the Order, as unbelievebla as that may seem. If I am not mistaken, several years later, he left the Jesuits.

There are literally hundreds of similar examples, which included Jesuit Priests actually taking up arms in revolutionary struggles against the governments.

Not a pretty picture at all.
 
Hello,
I’m new here to CAF and I’m also a newly baptized Catholic.

In my research and reading on the Catholic faith I’ve seen some very negative things being said about Jesuits and not just from non-Catholics. I’ve also heard negative things from Catholics as well, especially in regard to Pope Francis.

This is something I just can’t wrap my head around. Why would Christians have such negativity toward the society of JESUS? I asked some of my fellow parishioners and they just put their heads down and started mumbling…

Can you all help me make sense of this?

Many thanks and blessings from the Newbie,
Loreen
  1. Some Protestants feared that the Jesuits, with their intellectual acuity, would expose the heretical teachings for what they were. Protestant anti-Jesuit feeling is a residue of that
  2. Among some Catholics, it’s because only the heterodox Jesuits over the past couple of decades that have earned the media spotlight. No doubt the vast majority (including the editors of America magazine these days, by the way - while they’re not conservative in secular terms, that’s not what the Church expects of them) are faithful to the Magesterium. But that doesn’t make the news, only the trainwrecks seem to.
  3. Why do bad Jesuits go really bad? Well, they’re held up to high academic standards, which naturally means they have great intellectual abilities. Which means when a Jesuit is good, he’s really good, and when a Jesuit is bad, he is really bad.
 
Best Jesuit joke ever:

A Jesuit priest and a Dominican priest are in the waiting room on Judgement Day. They, naturally, bicker about which is the greater order. They agree to approach St. Peter to settle the argument.

St. Peter says “Hmm, that’s a tough one. Let’s think it through. What prompted the founding of the Dominican order?”

Dominican: “We were founded to preach against the Albigensian heresy!”

St. P: “And what prompted the founding of the Jesuit order?”

Jesuit: “Our purpose was to strengthen the church through loyalty to the pope and to resist and refute the Protestant heresy.”

St. Peter: “Well, then that’s easy. I haven’t seen an Albigensian come through this room in centuries! Case closed.”

🙂
 
Best Jesuit joke ever:

A Jesuit priest and a Dominican priest are in the waiting room on Judgement Day. They, naturally, bicker about which is the greater order. They agree to approach St. Peter to settle the argument.

St. Peter says “Hmm, that’s a tough one. Let’s think it through. What prompted the founding of the Dominican order?”

Dominican: “We were founded to preach against the Albigensian heresy!”

St. P: “And what prompted the founding of the Jesuit order?”

Jesuit: “Our purpose was to strengthen the church through loyalty to the pope and to resist and refute the Protestant heresy.”

St. Peter: “Well, then that’s easy. I haven’t seen an Albigensian come through this room in centuries! Case closed.”

🙂
That’s a good one.

Here’s mine, I know you’ve heard it:
A man is pining after the new Porsche coupe and decides to pray a novena to ask God for one. His wife stops him and tells him that he had better ask a priest before he does something like that, because it might be a sin. “You’re right honey” he says. “I’ll ask two priests: a Franciscan, because they are very holy, and a Jesuit, because they are very learned.” So he seeks out the Franciscan.

“Father, can you tell me whether I ought to pray a novena for a new Porsche?” he asks. The Franciscan responds “I’m sorry my son, but what’s a Porsche?”

Foiled by this humble priest’s simplicity, he approaches the Jesuit. “Father, can you tell me whether I ought to pray a novena for a new Porsche?” he asks. The Jesuit responds “I’m sorry my son, but what’s a novena?”
 
Hello,
I’m new here to CAF and I’m also a newly baptized Catholic.

In my research and reading on the Catholic faith I’ve seen some very negative things being said about Jesuits and not just from non-Catholics. I’ve also heard negative things from Catholics as well, especially in regard to Pope Francis.

This is something I just can’t wrap my head around. Why would Christians have such negativity toward the society of JESUS? I asked some of my fellow parishioners and they just put their heads down and started mumbling…

Can you all help me make sense of this?

Many thanks and blessings from the Newbie,
Loreen
I,am glad to hear of your newly baptized Catholic, God Bless you. Now I, don,t have a negative addtude toward Jesuits,in fact I treat them with the same resprcted as a priest.
 
I know several Jesuits: I attended Fordham University, Canisius College, the parish where I attend Mass during the week is a Jesuit-run parish, I have done the Spiritual Exercises of St. Ignatius of Loyola, and my former spiritual director, who has gone to his reward, was a Jesuit. All of the ones I have come in contact with have adhered to the teachings of the Magisterium.

They are also incredibly brilliant men, and very skilled in critical thinking, teaching, and, particularly in the case of instructors, do not tolerate mediocre efforts. The first Jesuit professor I had was in my freshman year at Fordham, for musical theory. I had done well academically in high school, and was considered a good writer. When my first paper was returned to me, it was covered with so much red ink that one would have thought the instructor had bled on it! I learned pretty fast that you couldn’t pad papers, you couldn’t fluff your way through a course, but if you took a course from a Jesuit professor, you would learn that content so well you’d be able to recite it in your dreams.

True, back in the sixties and seventies, there were quite a few of them, particularly in Latin America, who really carried liberation theology to an extreme, some of them actually taking up arms with rebel causes (although some of the governments they rebelled against needed to be severely reformed, lest we forget that matter.) Then there was the case of Daniel Berrigan, SJ, during the Vietnam war protests. These were extremely high profile cases, and by no means included every Jesuit.

Most Jesuit priests are schooled in other areas of endeavor as well as their priestly formation. You’ll find them in just about every area of human activity, particularly the sciences, the literary arts, and even in the performing arts. Their formation includes a lot of what we laypeople would call service activity, and on-the-job training, meaning working pastorally with people in many settings. A Jesuit in formation who is studying, for example, ministry to the sick, will most likely be working for awhile as an orderly in a hospital or nursing home. He might be working as a high school teacher. Those are just a couple of examples.

My personal theory as to why some Catholics have an anti-Jesuit bent is this: Most people are very intimidated by talent, whether that is intellectual talent, or otherwise. The people with the talent that others find so intimidating will naturally draw flack. That’s simply human behavior.

Trust me, in the parish I attend during the week (near my place of employment,) the priests mince no words about sin, about deviation from the mission of the Kingdom of Heaven, and about failure to stretch one’s efforts for the greater glory of God in their homilies. No fluffy theology there! You’re also not going to get a “say three Hail Marys” as a penance in confession: You’re not going to get “yelled at,” but you are going to get some real “Dutch uncle” counsel and a penance that forces you to think. That parish is the only one I know of in my diocese that has daily (except Sunday) confession times, daily Exposition of the Blessed Sacrament, and several daily Masses. Yes, they do First Friday and First Saturday devotions, as well as an ongoing Sacred Heart novena and an ongoing novena to the North American martyrs. The lunchtime and quitting time Masses are fairly well attended; I’ve never been there when there were fewer than a hundred people there. Exposition goes on all day except during Mass, and there are always at least twenty-five or so people in the church during Exposition.

They do not do the EF Mass, which is partly why I think that some who are attracted to that form are miffed about that fact.

That parish is a downtown parish, in a previously depressed area, and managed to stay alive during the lean years. Over the past eight years several hospitals in the immediate area have expanded, and expanded their research and scientific facilities as well. So the area is growing, and so is the parish. I’m very thankful about this.
 
Hello,
I’m new here to CAF and I’m also a newly baptized Catholic.

In my research and reading on the Catholic faith I’ve seen some very negative things being said about Jesuits and not just from non-Catholics. I’ve also heard negative things from Catholics as well, especially in regard to Pope Francis.

This is something I just can’t wrap my head around. Why would Christians have such negativity toward the society of JESUS? I asked some of my fellow parishioners and they just put their heads down and started mumbling…

Can you all help me make sense of this?

Many thanks and blessings from the Newbie,
Loreen
For what it’s worth… I do not have anything against the Jesuits. In fact, I have always been drawn to Ignatian spirituality. I believe the order is as good an order as we have. Further, I think the good that the Jesuits do is a testament to the Society and the salvation of many. They are criticized for thinking and questioning and seeking truth.
 
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