What do think of the previos Pope's beatification?

[ConstantineTG]

Most of the responses on this thread makes me sad

There is a clear disdain for the authority of the Church, there is no trust at all and personal agendas are brought ahead of submission to the authority of the one whom Peter passed the keys he was given by Christ.

As for the OP, I think this is wonderful. I’m excited about it. I hope there’s some sort of bigger celebration in the Archdiocese so I can join many other Catholics during this event.

 

[tabbey48]

I do not think my issues with this have any relation to having issues with God. My issues with this are related to the actions of the previous Pope. The very public actions. Those actions are certainly debatable. I respect the previous Pope’s obvious love of God. I do not respect some of the ways he publicly manifested that love. No, my issues vare not with God at all, but with the free actions of a man.

Pope John Paul II, like Pope Benedict XVI, clearly demonstrate their love of God and of people inside and outside of the Church. To show respect for the religion of others is not wrong. In fact, when Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI have reached out to others and recognized the worth of their walk with God, imperfect though it may be, they have opened the door for meaningful dialogue. Many of us are Roman Catholic today because they approached with love, not in attack mode.

I look forward to the day when the Church recognizes that Pope John Paul II was and is a saint.

 

[Friar_David_O.Carm]

I do not think my issues with this have any relation to having issues with God. My issues with this are related to the actions of the previous Pope. The very public actions. Those actions are certainly debatable. I respect the previous Pope’s obvious love of God. I do not respect some of the ways he publicly manifested that love. No, my issues vare not with God at all, but with the free actions of a man.

But if God calls him to Heaven and allows miracles to occur that are interceeded for by him then your issue is with God.

A beatification and canonisation are only recognizing the work of God.

So please explain how the Church acknowledging this work of God is bad and how your issue is not with God when you seem to be questioning His calling John Paul II to Heaven.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Pope John Paul II, like Pope Benedict XVI, clearly demonstrate their love of God and of people inside and outside of the Church. To show respect for the religion of others is not wrong. In fact, when Pope John Paul II and Pope Benedict XVI have reached out to others and recognized the worth of their walk with God, imperfect though it may be, they have opened the door for meaningful dialogue. Many of us are Roman Catholic today because they approached with love, not in attack mode.

I look forward to the day when the Church recognizes that Pope John Paul II was and is a saint.

applause

In the first century, the Apostles and all other Christians came into pagan lands and they didn’t burn them at the stake for their beliefs. The lived with them and taught to them and through example brought them to the light of Christ. The interfaith dialogue is just a modern approach to what happened in the early days of our Church. By sharing with non-believers, we approach them with love and by the grace of God may their eyes be opened to the truth. You don’t have to tell others they are wrong to prove you are right. The truth can speak for itself and stand on its own without having to oppose another idea.

 

[DCNBILL]

Wow, there sure are a number of people here who should have been running the Church for all those arduous years that Pope John Paul II slaved away. I am sure that they would have done a much better job. and the humility that they show as well, my my. :yeah_me:

 

[janman55]

The sentiment for JPII seems to be running on more of an emotional level. This cheapens the process and his true contribution to the Church. I love him too but this all seems fast.

That being said I trust Mother Church.

 

[janman55]

applause

In the first century, the Apostles and all other Christians came into pagan lands and they didn’t burn them at the stake for their beliefs. The lived with them and taught to them and through example brought them to the light of Christ. The interfaith dialogue is just a modern approach to what happened in the early days of our Church. By sharing with non-believers, we approach them with love and by the grace of God may their eyes be opened to the truth. You don’t have to tell others they are wrong to prove you are right. The truth can speak for itself and stand on its own without having to oppose another idea.

Kissing the Koran is more (to most people I talk to) than simple respect for someone else’s beliefs. I still cannot adequate defend the action to non-Catholics and others who took offense.

 

[Hunter53]

I disagree with this because it does nothing but show the modernist control over our once glorious church.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Kissing the Koran is more (to most people I talk to) than simple respect for someone else’s beliefs. I still cannot adequate defend the action to non-Catholics and others who took offense.

In the first century, the Greek pagans were told that the supreme unnamed god they worship is Jesus Christ. By convincing the Muslims that Allah is God, the easier it is for them to accept that Jesus is the Son of God and thus come to Christianity, the same way the gentiles became converts back then.

By telling them they are all wrong and their faith is all wrong will just make them defensive, and thus the extremism we see today. No one wants to hear they are wrong, even if they are.

 

[tabbey48]

Kissing the Koran is more (to most people I talk to) than simple respect for someone else’s beliefs. I still cannot adequate defend the action to non-Catholics and others who took offense.

Maybe your hanging with the wrong crowd. The people around me saw that as respect for the religion of others. It did not mean that he was embracing Islam. I think it was a problem for those who already had problems with the Holy Father.

In a world where there is so little civility in public life, perhaps it might have looked like compromise of some kind…It made me respect him more.

 

[Seamus_L]

While I know it will outrage some people here, but John Paul II’s ecumenism was always a big handicap for me when it came to debating Protestants. I felt like saying, let’s just pretend it’s 1910 and Pius X is Pope.

 

[janman55]

I can respect Muslims and not respect the Koran. I am then free to dialogue and work with them on the many things we have in common without compromising my principles nor asking them to compromise theirs… Its honest disagreement.

I can understand kissing a Muslim cleric as a sign of affection/respect. I will never understand kissing the Koran.

 

[kitkatty]

As I just posted on another thread, had I been the “Devil’s Advocate” for the process (as in the olden days), those are the exact things I would bring up as part of my duties and would do so without pulling any punches.

I would then rejoice at being roundly defeated and will happily attend his canonization.

John Paul II was no monster and while he undoubtedly had imprudent missteps and could have done more to fix our liturgy and appoint better bishops, a canonization is an infallible definition that a person is now in heaven. I would see it that a person, despite his faults is now in heaven with God, a testament to God’s mercy. If horrible sinners like St. Augustine and St. Paul could make it, why not Pope John Paul II?

I like the balanced tone of this post, acknowledging the faults but the holiness of the Pope as well. Saints were not perfect people, but people who attained holiness. That JPII loved God and led many into the Church I firmly believe. That he made errors in judgement I strongly suspect,.No one not even Popes are perfect. But God has made the judgement, in His eyes a saint , then in our eyes should he also be one too. I for one am happy God has shown us another glorious example of holiness in our own time.

 

[tabbey48]

While I know it will outrage some people here, but John Paul II’s ecumenism was always a big handicap for me when it came to debating Protestants. I felt like saying, let’s just pretend it’s 1910 and Pius X is Pope.

I think this is part of the problem. It is NOT 1910 and Pius X is NOT the Pope. The world and the Church have moved on.

I know few Protestants who have been won by a Catholic “debating” us. But I know a lot of Protestants who are Roman Catholic today because Roman Catholics loved us and lived faithful Christian lives before us. I was a Protestant Pastor for 40+ years…I am a Roman Catholic today because Pope John Paul II and others reached out to us in love. I had the good fortune to have faithful Catholic Priests, Religious and laity who lived such sweet and hoily lives before me that I was drawn into the Catholic Church. Those who wanted to “debate” me and those who told me that I was going to Hell because I wasn’t a Catholic hindered my conversion for several years.

 

[janman55]

In the first century, the Greek pagans were told that the supreme unnamed god they worship is Jesus Christ. By convincing the Muslims that Allah is God, the easier it is for them to accept that Jesus is the Son of God and thus come to Christianity, the same way the gentiles became converts back then.

By telling them they are all wrong and their faith is all wrong will just make them defensive, and thus the extremism we see today. No one wants to hear they are wrong, even if they are.

Nobody wants to hear they are wrong but proclaiming the Truth is our baptismal call. You really do not have to do much research to seriously question the validity of the Koran. Sometimes the Truth hurts, but its still the Truth.

 

[tabbey48]

Nobody wants to hear they are wrong but proclaiming the Truth is our baptismal call. You really do not have to do much research to seriously question the validity of the Koran. Sometimes the Truth hurts, but its still the Truth.

When you become Pope, don’t kiss the Koran.

But I would bet that you too will do some things in good conscience that will offend others (without meaning to offend them).

 

[ConstantineTG]

Nobody wants to hear they are wrong but proclaiming the Truth is our baptismal call. You really do not have to do much research to seriously question the validity of the Koran. Sometimes the Truth hurts, but its still the Truth.

And how many people would you convert by hurting them with the truth? By showing respect to other faiths, we show them that being Catholic is not about hating the others who got it wrong.

Maybe you do need to do your research to have a deeper understanding why the Pope did what he did and what he hoped to accomplish with it. Instead of just letting emotions run high and make judgments.

 

[klt0901]

I thank God for all that Pope John Paul II has done for the Church and the influence he has had on my life. I think it is great that he will soon be beatified!

 

[momor]

And how many people would you convert by hurting them with the truth? By showing respect to other faiths, we show them that being Catholic is not about hating the others who got it wrong.

Maybe you do need to do your research to have a deeper understanding why the Pope did what he did and what he hoped to accomplish with it. Instead of just letting emotions run high and make judgments.

Isn’t there are strong danger of religious relativism here? There are many good people who have been led astray by moral relativism. It is always important to remember that Biblical Truth is capitalized for a reason - and it is unchanging.

Take St. Thomas More for example. While lots of people thought he should just take the King’s oath and consider it meaningless in his own heart, he knew it was not meaningless to God.

 

[maurin]

But if God calls him to Heaven and allows miracles to occur that are interceeded for by him then your issue is with God.

A beatification and canonisation are only recognizing the work of God.

So please explain how the Church acknowledging this work of God is bad and how your issue is not with God when you seem to be questioning His calling John Paul II to Heaven.

Jesus drove the money changers from the Temple. In other words, he expelled the profane from the Temple. In my opinion–admittedly an unqualified one–John Paul II analogicly welcomed the profane back into the “Temple” at Assisi.

Can one equate this man’s actions with God’s?