What do you think about Christian Zionism?

[matt1985]

haaretz.com/hasen/spages/772882.html

Earlier this year, the Vatican’s envoy in the Holy Land and bishops from three other churches launched a rare attack on the Christian Zionist movement, accusing it of promoting “racial exclusivity and perpetual war.”

“The Christian Zionist program provides a world view where the Gospel is identified with the ideology of empire, colonialism and militarism,” a declaration read.

“This is the city God has chosen to be the capital of the Jewish people and it will remain the capital of the Jewish people,” the recorded message said. In response, the crowd applauded and shouted in Hebrew: “The nation of Israel lives!”

I do not agree with Christian Zionism. No where did Jesus tell his followers to fight over the Holy Land. The Christian Zionists do not seem to preach a message of peace. They should work with the Israelis and Palestianians to find solutions instead of just supporting one side.

 

[Athanasiy]

The end does not justify the means.
One may not do evil so that good may result from it.

( Cathechism.)

 

[Lev23]

The end does not justify the means.
One may not do evil so that good may result from it.

( Cathechism.)

So what is this “evil” you refer to?

 

[bengal_fan]

So what is this “evil” you refer to?

causing continual division within the Holy Land that will lead to war thinking that will be the catalyst to bring Christ back. that would be the evil hoping it results in good. we are called to be peacemakers not war makers.

 

[Mannyfit75]

causing continual division within the Holy Land that will lead to war thinking that will be the catalyst to bring Christ back. that would be the evil hoping it results in good. we are called to be peacemakers not war makers.

Thou shall not tempt the Lord, your God.

This is tempting God to force his Second Coming upon us, is one of the greatest sin. We can’t tempt God to have come here now. It is the Father’s Will, who determines when he will come.

 

[Lev23]

causing continual division within the Holy Land that will lead to war thinking that will be the catalyst to bring Christ back. that would be the evil hoping it results in good. we are called to be peacemakers not war makers.

This is the biggest the lie the anti-Israel crowd throws around today. Every Christian Zionist is made to look like money loving, war mongering, the 2nd coming of Messiah pushing maniacs.

The first thing is to make Israel out to be a “racist state”. Jews have come back there to live from all over the world. African Jews, Oriental Jews, Middle Eastern Jews, etc., etc. Then there is the lie that these Jews are not the Jews of the bible that are supposed to come back there. I heard someone who went to Israel at least 2 times a year say, “Go to Galilee, you will hear some speak Spanish, some Greek, but when scripture is brought up, they talk in Hebrew.” These people for thousands of years spoke the same language, worship the same God, celebrated the same feasts, even when they were booted out of their land.

Then the secular and anti-christian element is veneered upon the image of Israel. Never mentioned are those Israeli Christians living inside Israel doing what they can to give their brethern their Messiah despite some secular and ultra-orthodox opposition.

Once Israel is firmly presented as a secular, war mongering racist state that gets its financing from rich Christian Zionists and the US government, then the chrage that Christian Zionists are using evil for good can be made.

 

[Lev23]

Thou shall not tempt the Lord, your God.

This is tempting God to force his Second Coming upon us, is one of the greatest sin. We can’t tempt God to have come here now. It is the Father’s Will, who determines when he will come.

I’m sure this charge or similar to was made to the Apostles when Jesus came the first time. They showed from scriptures that Jesus was the prophesied messiah. Now this is one Man, the Lamb of God they were saying came to Israel.

Fast forward to today, in our generation, one of the greatest ethnic miracles happened. Over 4 million Jews came back to their land, more than any other time in their history. Prophecy speaks of this. So how can any Christian turn their backs to this amazing development? Ezekials dry bones vision even says most will come back in unbelief, but never again to be uprooted from their land and they will be ruled by one King, which Christians know will be Jesus. This is a prophecy God is fulfilling by himself. Most Christian Zionists know there is no “rushing” of endtimes events. God will fufill everything in his own time.

But at the present time, Christian Zionists do not join the crowd that works against everything what God is doing over there. In fact, the mideast problem would be solved in an instant if all countries(Israel to) took God’s Word serious.

So we have 1 man, Jesus, the Lamb of God that came to Israel, to fulfill prophecy spoke of him. We can easily say most Israel did not see any prophetic importance in Jesus.

Today, we have millions of Jews coming back to a tiny sliver of land, Israel, in which this is spoken of prophetically. Now the whole world, some Christians and Jews themselves, see no prophetic importance of such an event and it means nothing to them at all.

**So the question is, which group do you think has less spiritual discernment-those who ignored the first coming of Messiah or those ignoring all the millions that are coming back to the land given to their forefathers by the God of Israel?

Another question, which is tempting the Lord’s hand to fulfill end-times prophecy faster-those who recognize his prophecy and do nothing to hinder it, or those that ignore it or work against it in their own way?**

 

[Lev23]

Then one the most disgusting things the enemy and unbelievers do to the innocent palestinean children is to teach them how to hate Israel with all its heart. From kids songs, to schoolbooks, to TV shows, they are called to hate the Jews from the bottom of their hearts. Money that is supposed to go to these common people for government and infrastructure are used for weapons to terrorize these same people and against Israel.

At the same time, Israel is being duped to give more land “back” to groups that will do nothing more than use it as the next step to totally wipe out Israel. Which is spoken of prophetically. Waiting in the wings are these poor children taught to hate and kill. The walls that stop flying bullets into Jewish areas and hinder suicide bombers are being critized by the world as an attempt to keep out Palestineans. But yet there are Palestinean citizens that live in Israel. Then there are the checkpoints. Yes, a pain in the rear, but are these things the root of the problem? What do you think America would do if either Canada or Mexico trained their kids from birth hate and teach that killing Americans is an honorable thing. Don’t you think the guards at the border checkpoints would be on edge and possibly hostile with those wanting to cross back and forth?

 

[Lev23]

Want to read about true Christian Zionist?

You might of heard him, Walid Shoebat, who used to be a Palestinean terroist.

Guess who challenged his thinking on Israel and the Jews? His wife, who is a Catholic and used to be a nun.

You can also see some of his testimony on streaming video for free here. Just look for “Walid Shoebat”.

 

[Mannyfit75]

I’m sure this charge or similar to was made to the Apostles when Jesus came the first time. They showed from scriptures that Jesus was the prophesied messiah. Now this is one Man, the Lamb of God they were saying came to Israel.

Fast forward to today, in our generation, one of the greatest ethnic miracles happened. Over 4 million Jews came back to their land, more than any other time in their history. Prophecy speaks of this. So how can any Christian turn their backs to this amazing development? Ezekials dry bones vision even says most will come back in unbelief, but never again to be uprooted from their land and they will be ruled by one King, which Christians know will be Jesus. This is a prophecy God is fulfilling by himself. Most Christian Zionists know there is no “rushing” of endtimes events. God will fufill everything in his own time.

But at the present time, Christian Zionists do not join the crowd that works against everything what God is doing over there. In fact, the mideast problem would be solved in an instant if all countries(Israel to) took God’s Word serious.

So we have 1 man, Jesus, the Lamb of God that came to Israel, to fulfill prophecy spoke of him. We can easily say most Israel did not see any prophetic importance in Jesus.

Today, we have millions of Jews coming back to a tiny sliver of land, Israel, in which this is spoken of prophetically. Now the whole world, some Christians and Jews themselves, see no prophetic importance of such an event and it means nothing to them at all.

**So the question is, which group do you think has less spiritual discernment-those who ignored the first coming of Messiah or those ignoring all the millions that are coming back to the land given to their forefathers by the God of Israel?

Another question, which is tempting the Lord’s hand to fulfill end-times prophecy faster-those who recognize his prophecy and do nothing to hinder it, or those that ignore it or work against it in their own way?**

So said anything less spiritual? I am merely saying that no one should be so obsessive of End Times prophecies. I believe that any Christian must himself prepare for his Second Coming by living out his Commandment just as Jesus taught us.

 

[Lev23]

So said anything less spiritual? I am merely saying that no one should be so obsessive of End Times prophecies. I believe that any Christian must himself prepare for his Second Coming by living out his Commandment just as Jesus taught us.

“Obsessive of end-times prophecy” is another phrase coined for Christian Zionists. Again, I can see the Apostles labeled this in their time. After all, most thought the the true Messiah would come only once to reign and restore the kingdom to Israel fully. They didn’t appreciate or were ignorant of his coming as the Lamb of God the first time.

Hundreds of years pass with the teaching that the people of Israel will never be regathered and “God owes the nothing”(whatever that means). But yet, it happens.

 

[Lev23]

I believe that any Christian must himself prepare for his Second Coming by living out his Commandment just as Jesus taught us.

You can relax now, Christian Zionists do this to.

 

[Mannyfit75]

“Obsessive of end-times prophecy” is another phrase coined for Christian Zionists. Again, I can see the Apostles labeled this in their time. After all, most thought the the true Messiah would come only once to reign and restore the kingdom to Israel fully. The didn’t appreciate or were ignorant of his coming as the Lamb of God the first time.

Hundreds of years pass with the teaching that the people of Israel will never be regathered and “God owes the nothing”(whatever that means). But yet, it happens.

I’m not denying Jesus’ Second Coming. That is pretty clear. I just find Christian Zionist and Catholics obsessed with “private revelations” of Mary as a little to excessive for me, especially if they deal with End Times.

Christians have better things to do that worry about the state of Israel in the End Times. Jesus will judge them accordingly like he does everyone else.

 

[Lev23]

I’m not denying Jesus’ Second Coming. That is pretty clear. I just find Christian Zionist and Catholics obsessed with “private revelations” of Mary as a little to excessive for me, especially if they deal with End Times.

Christians have better things to do that worry about the state of Israel in the End Times. Jesus will judge them accordingly like he does everyone else.

Christian Zionists worry about the state of Israel NOW. They need Jesus to. And the fact that Christian Zionists believe God has regathered Israel again to the land makes for great opportunitiy to give them their Messiah, Jesus-now.

Compare the mission-work of Christian Zionism today to some vanilla theological belief that in the end-times, “some Jews” would be converted to Christianity.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

What do you think about Christian Zionism? - **A rotten idea **

 

[Mannyfit75]

Christian Zionists worry about the state of Israel NOW. They need Jesus to. And the fact that Christian Zionists believe God has regathered Israel again to the land makes for great opportunitiy to give them their Messiah, Jesus-now.

Compare the mission-work of Christian Zionism today to some vanilla theological belief that in the end-times, “some Jews” would be converted to Christianity.

The New Israel is the Church. In Revelation, the Church appear as the Bride of the Lamb. The conversion of the Jews is choice they have to make on their own. Polteryizing them bears no fruit. It is pretty clear they the reject Extreme Evangelical Christians to convert them.

Do I believe Jews will be save? Yes, it is up to them to accept the will of God.

 

[Mannyfit75]

What do you think about Christian Zionism? - **A rotten idea **

It is.

 

[bengal_fan]

Lev,
most Christian zionists are that way because they believe that if they don’t support Israel, they are against God. it’s just not true. Israel is supposed to be set up by the Messiah. the temple is to be rebuilt by the Messiah. not the UN and not by the might of other nations. the problem with this secular (not involving a Messiah) zionist movement is that it has provided no home for the palestinians who had been living there for hundreds of years. God has expanded His family to include all peoples (thank you Jesus) and that includes the palestinians. when Jesus comes back, He will set up the new Jerusalem. this is not done by executive order or by UN might, but by God.

 

[byoby]

The New Israel is the Church. In Revelation, the Church appear as the Bride of the Lamb. The conversion of the Jews is choice they have to make on their own. Polteryizing them bears no fruit. It is pretty clear they the reject Extreme Evangelical Christians to convert them.

Do I believe Jews will be save? Yes, it is up to them to accept the will of God.

Is God a liar?

The Church has not replaced Israel we have only been grafted in.

It is God who converts people, not Evangelical Christians.

The Jews are inside the will of God whether they realize it or not.

 

[byoby]

Lev,
most Christian zionists are that way because they believe that if they don’t support Israel, they are against God. it’s just not true. Israel is supposed to be set up by the Messiah. the temple is to be rebuilt by the Messiah. not the UN and not by the might of other nations. the problem with this secular (not involving a Messiah) zionist movement is that it has provided no home for the palestinians who had been living there for hundreds of years. God has expanded His family to include all peoples (thank you Jesus) and that includes the palestinians. when Jesus comes back, He will set up the new Jerusalem. this is not done by executive order or by UN might, but by God.

If you do your history, you will realize that the Palestinians were Jews since the time of 70 AD. There was not much of anyone there until Jews started immigrating back prior to 1948, the land was pretty much desolate. The surrounding nations told the Arabs who were there pre-war 1948 to leave because they were going to eliminate Israel, they were not successful. All of the Arabs that chose to stay in Israel before the war in 1948 are now free citizens in a free society. Arabs who choose to live in Israel now are able to partake in all of the freedoms the Jews have. The ones that left have not been taken in by the surrounding countries (Who are much larger and should be wealthier) to be used as political pawns. They still want Israel to be wiped off of the map and use the Palestinian lie to garner support from around the world.

Rome renamed Israel to Palestine after the Jewish rebellion in 70 AD.