What do you think of my parish's new church design?

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roadsend said:
Yikes!
The diocese obviously has too much money in order to be wasting it on such as this.
I would look for another place to send my diocesan contribution, perhaps a mission diocese or CRS.
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I give my money to the FSSP.
 
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Beautiful. I love older churches too. I never understand why folks want to design new churches that look like strip malls or gymnasiums. I grew up in artless Freewill Baptist & Presbyterian churches…no thank you. The art, stained glass, statuary, stations, etc. found in older churches lift my mind to God rather than distract me.
 
Peggy_in_Burien said:
Are you telling me that St. Jude and St. Anne are merging??? At long last??? And what will happen to old St. Jude Church, the little quonset hut run by the wonderful Oblates of Mary???

This was my parish while I was stationed at Shaw AFB from 1981 to 1984. I loved this parish dearly. We opened the very first food bank in South Carolina there at St. Jude back in 1982. I was the first secretary and worked there every day.

Thanks for this post. 😃
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Yes, they are merging. I hate it because I love St. Anne. The architecture is great. But hopefully they are going to do the new church up. They are selling both buildings. They’ve already considered just expanding St. Anne to preserve the architecture, but it isn’t feasible.

St. Jude will be closed and sold. The two churches are now one parish run by the Redemptorists. There are no nuns left, unfortunately.
 
YoungTradCath said:
Yes, they are merging. I hate it because I love St. Anne. The architecture is great. But hopefully they are going to do the new church up. They are selling both buildings. They’ve already considered just expanding St. Anne to preserve the architecture, but it isn’t feasible.

St. Jude will be closed and sold. The two churches are now one parish run by the Redemptorists. There are no nuns left, unfortunately.
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😦
 
Deo_Gratias42 said:
If I remember correctly, it was a committee. We didn’t have a bishop at the time the design was chosen.

I abhor the Sanctuary design.
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But as per Canon Law, a bishop must be there to approve the contract. A Diocesan Administrator or whatever can’t do that. So some bishop approved.
 
markomalley said:
Not bad.

But three suggestions:
  1. Where is the choir loft? I did not see one.
  2. Move the baptistry to the back of the nave. That is where it should be, not up near (or in) the sanctuary. Baptism is what joins a person to the Church. The Nave should be where the Faithful gather to witness the paschal mystery. The significance of having a baptistry in the back highlights this fact. Also, if you look at a church in comparison to the Temple, you will see that the narthex corresponds to the Court of the Gentiles, while the Nave corresponds to the inner courts. (The sanctuary corresponds to the Holy, while the Tabernacle corresponds to the Holy of Holies).
  3. I did not see any altar rails defined, nor a rood screen. The sanctuary should be clearly delineated and separated from the Nave (GIRM 295). Altar rails/screens provide that separation far more effectively than mere elevation (which is what is indicated).
And then one question: Did I see a high altar in the back of the sanctuary or was that for a table altar?

http://easycaptures.com/fs/uploaded/652/9043475006.jpg
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  1. There is a choir loft. The second story floor plan wasn’t included in that image.
  2. Maybe. 🤷
  3. I’d love to have either of those, and I will certainly mention them and support myself with the GIRM.
Yes, I am assuming that is a high altar. I am pretty sure that it will come from the old St. Anne church (one of the two closing). It’s over a hundred years old and has inscriptions all over it, and is a generally fantastic piece that isn’t seen in 80% of parish churches nowadays, so I’m very happy to see that it’s being salvaged, since it’s in perfect condition. The baptistry matches it in design and material. They are both marble. Since the high altar also contains the tabernacle, I think the decision to carry it over is fantastic.

BTW, there is stained glass everywhere, which is going to be salvaged from St. Anne church.
 
YoungTradCath said:
Yes, they are merging. I hate it because I love St. Anne. The architecture is great. But hopefully they are going to do the new church up. They are selling both buildings. They’ve already considered just expanding St. Anne to preserve the architecture, but it isn’t feasible.

St. Jude will be closed and sold. The two churches are now one parish run by the Redemptorists. There are no nuns left, unfortunately.
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Please continue to post pictures. I’m sad that St. Anne will be sold. I never actually had the chance to visit that parish. I guess the Oblates have left St. Jude. I don’t remember any nuns at St. Jude, because the school had closed long before I arrived. Have you chosen a name for the new parish, yet? Wasn’t the cemetary named for St. Lawrence?

What about the old high schools–Lincoln and Sumter? I know they were replaced with a new high school in 1983 or 1984, but what has become of the older schools?

Oh, how much I miss Sumter, and St. Jude. My daughter spent her early childhood in Sumter. Her husband recently visited Shaw AFB (he’s a captain) and took pictures of our little duplex in the enlisted housing area. The street was fenced off, as all the little houses were to be torn down and replaced. At least he got one last picture of her first home.

Keep me updated, and maybe you can fill me in sometime on happenings in town. I’m sure if I went back after nearly 30 years, that I wouldn’t recognize it at all.

(wistful sigh…)
 
Peggy_in_Burien said:
Please continue to post pictures. I’m sad that St. Anne will be sold. I never actually had the chance to visit that parish. I guess the Oblates have left St. Jude. I don’t remember any nuns at St. Jude, because the school had closed long before I arrived. Have you chosen a name for the new parish, yet? Wasn’t the cemetary named for St. Lawrence?

What about the old high schools–Lincoln and Sumter? I know they were replaced with a new high school in 1983 or 1984, but what has become of the older schools?

Oh, how much I miss Sumter, and St. Jude. My daughter spent her early childhood in Sumter. Her husband recently visited Shaw AFB (he’s a captain) and took pictures of our little duplex in the enlisted housing area. The street was fenced off, as all the little houses were to be torn down and replaced. At least he got one last picture of her first home.

Keep me updated, and maybe you can fill me in sometime on happenings in town. I’m sure if I went back after nearly 30 years, that I wouldn’t recognize it at all.

(wistful sigh…)
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You can look at both of the churches here: sumterccsc.org/html/churches.html as well as all kinds of other stuff. There were nuns at St. Jude and St. Anne for a long time, but they left, yes. Catholic school closed shop for a while, but now we have a full elementary school (St. Anne School) and high school (St. Francis Xavier). They are small, but they are growing steadily and definitely maintaining numbers.

The new church hasn’t been named yet, no, but I’m thinking it will be called St. Lawrence. There were two polls several years ago, and St. Lawrence won both of them. I am 100% for that. The cemetery is also St. Lawrence, yes.

Lincoln high school doesn’t exist anymore. I have no idea what it is now, some dilapidated building. Sumter High School is still the main school, yes, and it is quite massive now.

All the housing, with the exception of generals’ housing and a small section of other houses, has been destroyed. 500 area is gone. However, a company is currently building 600ish new houses. They built a new commissary in 1994 and they just built a new BX which opened like two weeks ago.

Nothing really happens in town It’s all quite boring. Downtown is as crime-ridden as ever.
 
YoungTradCath said:
But as per Canon Law, a bishop must be there to approve the contract. A Diocesan Administrator or whatever can’t do that. So some bishop approved.
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Then it must have been an Archbishop. Either way, it’s still an eyesore.
 
YoungTradCath said:
? Two churches here will be combined into one, I’d say, within the next five years. One is a gorgeous old brick Gothic with all the trimmings, and the other is a black mission church for African American outreach. Due to the obviously changed social circumstances, and for some other reasons, a new church is in the final late planning stages.

The first design was this: sumterccsc.org/assets/images/ChuchFloorPlan.jpg which I found to be very nasty. Yes, it’s cruciform, but it looks run-of-the-mill and tending to the very modern.

Deo gratias, we’ve matured past that and this: sumterccsc.org/assets/images/ChurchPlan.pdf is the new plan. The outside is this: sumterccsc.org/assets/images/Elevations1.jpg We have a new bishop, His Excellency Guglielmone, and he favors tradition.

The new plan (second) includes many elements from the old church, including stained glass (images of Jesus, St. Anne, some random cardinals in regalia), and the high altar (and tabernacle) and matching baptistery. A separate belfry and even a choir loft and a cry room were also included (in 2011!). The continuation of the arch theme from the old church is also a very nice touch that, frankly, I’m surprised to see. One very subtle thing is that the sanctuary will face towards the East, guarding the fragile liturgical patrimony of the Church.

I’m elated the old plan was scrapped, and I am thoroughly happy with the new one. It could be better in some ways, but I wasnot expecting a design of this caliber, especially in this day and age, what with the dreadful average concrete box that somehow gets to be called a “church” of the Catholic variety. You really have no idea how happy this “mad rad trad” is to see this kind of design for a (for now) OF-only parish.

The community as a whole is rather traditional. There aren’t any EF masses, but there are plenty of old devotions and liturgical actions retained from the “medieval (read: pre-1960s) days.” The only real gripe I have is that the music tends on the mediocre (Gather :mad:), but it is not nearly as bad as I have heard at some churches, and for that I am thankful. We have five Redemptorist priests, and they are, through-and-through, some of the most doctrinally sound priests I have had the pleasure of enduring for a homily (which hasn’t been many, lol). The city itself is rather conservative, in fact, very socially conservative compared to other places in the state. There is a massive military presence which is getting bigger by the year, which is one of the main reasons needed for the expansion.

As far as I know, there are not really any codified concepts yet as to the actual decoration of the interior, but the architect has designed another Catholic church recently of a floor plan very similar to that of our new church, and here are some shots:

monarchpl.com/images/5-rel/5-rel-sp-2.jpg
monarchpl.com/images/5-rel/5-rel-sp-5.jpg
monarchpl.com/images/5-rel/5-rel-sp-7.jpg

I love the altar area. It is absolutely fantastic, and can be used easily to celebrate either Form. I presume that those things on the back wall can be used as side altars, which I like very much. I don’t really care for the commercialized, suburban stucco strip-mallish walls, but those can be easily made better. The floors and pews are quite nice.

The door area is fantastic: monarchpl.com/images/5-rel/5-rel-sp-4.jpg

What do you think about all this? Critiques? I want to get involved with the architecture council or whatever they have.

PS: none of the forums really made much sense, so I went with this one.
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I for the most part like it. The only change I would make would be to recess the altar into a proper sanctuary. This reminds me of the Collegeville Monastery church with the altar in the middle of the choir.

But this is parish and not a monastery.
 
Only minor suggestion would be to encourage the architect/pastor to create an altar/ledge in front of the Tabernacle so both the NO and EF forms of the Mass could be celebrated in the new church.
 
YoungCanRCMale said:
Only minor suggestion would be to encourage the architect/pastor to create an altar/ledge in front of the Tabernacle so both the NO and EF forms of the Mass could be celebrated in the new church.
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The tabernacle will be housed in the high altar from one of the two closing churches, and so the EF will be able to be celebrated in the church. I don’t see why an EF mass couldn’t be celebrated on a “low” altar, for that matter, just facing towards the apse.
 
One thing I have long wondered about is how people can hate one design with coveting another design that is essentially the same? One example is what some call the “church in the round” (a huge and extreme example being the underground church at Lourdes.) It is an extremely logical way in which to design a church yet I hear people screaming about “putting people and not God on display.” That’s just silly. Especially when one considers how similar a “church in the round is” compared to a church (typically a cathedral) with a main nave, two large transepts and a large presbyterium which are typically loved by those who attack “churches in the round.” Maybe such people are just not aware? The Hagia Sophia would have made a tremendous “church in the round.” For all I know, maybe it already did? It almost certainly was not one of those “bowling lane” churches that we once so common.
 
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