what does one say to an agnostic?

[JRKH]

when they say: “I think it is stupid to base your whole being in something so much that you don’t live your life the way you actually want to…I also think it is stupid for people to go through life scared of everything that “might” happen to them.”

this is open for both catholics and protestants.

Begin by asking them whether they would kill someone if they felt like it. They will probably answer, “No.”
“Why Not?”
“It’s against the Law. I’d go to jail.”
“Then you cannot live your life as you actually want to can you.”

The above can be modified to fit the situation.

Actually we all, “base our lives on something so much that don’t live our lives the way we actually want to…” The question is what is that something?
Do you go to work at a job you love? Do you go because you want to? Or do you go to a job you don’t like because it pays the bills, or because it pays more money than a job you might enjoy more? Then aren’t you also compromising living your life “The way you actually want to?”

As far as the fear factor goes, I think the Agnostic and Athiest fears than the Christian. For the Christian, worldly things are of little importance. They are just a means to an end.
Money is just a way to care for our families and communities. We trust God to provide us with what we need. I have seen this in my own life so I know.
Our houses don’t need to be the biggest and best, for they are just shelter.
We do not need to be concerned about our posessions because, even if they are taken from us we still have Treasure in Heaven.
Simple food is the best. It nurishes the soul as well as the body.

Fear? With the Lord as my Sheperd what should I fear? If I do have fear it is not because I am a Christian, it is because I am sinner and do not trust in the Lord.

Those who do not believe, on the other hand must fear for their posessions, their livelyhood, their abode and all other things because that is all they have. They have no hope of treasure in heaven because they won’t get there. They have no faith to fall back on or move forward with. They have no one to take their innermost fears to.

The Christian is far more liberated than the Agnostic.

Peace

James

 

[AgnosTheist]

when they say: “I think it is stupid to base your whole being in something so much that you don’t live your life the way you actually want to…I also think it is stupid for people to go through life scared of everything that “might” happen to them.”

Look them in the eye and tell them frankly:

"Look here, over 90% of Catholics dont really care about religion and they live their life the way they want to. We have freedom too."

 

[Vintagecoils]

I agree with you completely. I am pointing out that sometimes the issue is not that the non-believer wants to have an affair etc. but may have a problem with athority (i.e. being told that they cannot have the affair). I think that we do not need to assume that the issue is always based in a desire to live in opposition to God’s law

   Do not non believers accept that we are social beings and will be forced to live in a society that will impose restrictions, on behavior and such in order to maintain the cohesiveness desired for that particular society?  Maybe you don't want the affair today but if your society see how affairs and children born out of wedlock or any other social behavior is a detriment to the cohesive productive support of the community they will impose laws and restrictions.

What society model can you show that not only continued but was productive and supportive of the people that had no religion and no rules but what ever an individual wanted to do?
I have to ask, if the religious foundation is not the absolute authority by which a community creates their foundation, exactly who is going to determine what will and won’t be accepted?. All can not be accepted less you have anarchy. All will not agree for the sake of “harmony”.

Please explain this.

 

[ralphinal]

Do not non believers accept that we are social beings and will be forced to live in a society that will impose restrictions, on behavior and such in order to maintain the cohesiveness desired for that particular society? Maybe you don’t want the affair today but if your society see how affairs and children born out of wedlock or any other social behavior is a detriment to the cohesive productive support of the community they will impose laws and restrictions.
What society model can you show that not only continued but was productive and supportive of the people that had no religion and no rules but what ever an individual wanted to do?
I have to ask, if the religious foundation is not the absolute authority by which a community creates their foundation, exactly who is going to determine what will and won’t be accepted?. All can not be accepted less you have anarchy. All will not agree for the sake of “harmony”.

Please explain this.

Well, I could enter the Swat Pushkin Tribe here, but I won’t. Anyway, most non-religious people have no issue with government. Their problem is with a God that cannot be proven to them to their satisfaction imposing laws, or, even worse, someone elses God that cannot be proven to their satisfaction imposing laws upon them. My point was that we should not assume that people do not beleive in God because they want to have sex with frogs or some other sin. There are lots of people who follow all of the Ten Commandments except for the ones related to God.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

My point was that we should not assume that people do not beleive in God because they want to have sex with frogs or some other sin. There are lots of people who follow all of the Ten Commandments except for the ones related to God.

Definetely, and those that follow the 10 have the buck stop hard at the Name of Jesus. After all one cant go too far.

 

[tomarin]

when they say: "I think it is stupid to base your whole being in something so much that you don’t live your life the way you actually want to.

or, to put it another way, tell them there is a higher freedom found in discipline which provides freedom from lust, from greed, from anxiety and from fear.

 

[PaulDupre]

That is absolutely true. However sometimes such ‘laws’ require religious guys like you to enjorce them upon non-believers like me.

Hi AgnosTheist,

What was the last religious law someone enforced on you? Please be specific.

Thanks,
Paul

 

[DebChris]

“If you don’t commit your life for something in which you believe, you will fall for anything.”
When something is important to us, it is there that we place our energies, not out of mere obligation, but out of desire. It is why a soldier volunteers for combat or a couple choose to marry one another for life. It is why doctors will spend years in school to learn how to save the lives of others. “Where your heart is, so too is your treasure.” What would you do, or sacrifice, to hold onto that treasure?

 

[Frost]

when they say: "I think it is stupid to base your whole being in something so much that you don’t live your life the way you actually want to…

By basing my whole being in God I am living my life the way I actually want to.

I also think it is stupid for people to go through life scared of everything that “might” happen to them."

Aren’t most people scared of something happening to them, atheists as well as Christians? But at least I have Someone who will comfort me, stand by my side and give me everlasting life no matter what happens.

:heaven:

 

[peary]

Why say ANYTHING? They don’t want to hear what you have to say anyway.

 

[Valke2]

when they say: “I think it is stupid to base your whole being in something so much that you don’t live your life the way you actually want to…I also think it is stupid for people to go through life scared of everything that “might” happen to them.”

this is open for both catholics and protestants.

would an agnostic say this? Or is this person an atheist. If’s he’s an agnostic, tell him to sh** or get off the pot. at least an atheist has made a choice.

 

[Frost]

Why say ANYTHING? They don’t want to hear what you have to say anyway.

How do you know?
I’ve spoken to many atheists and agnostics. Some of them are actually very interested, but fear and poor knowledge about Christian faith are clouding their perception. See them for what they are: made in God’s image and loved deeply by Him. Be a follower of Christ and try to help them by listening and then showing them God’s love.

 

[Vintagecoils]

Well, I could enter the Swat Pushkin Tribe here, but I won’t. Anyway, most non-religious people have no issue with government. Their problem is with a God that cannot be proven to them to their satisfaction imposing laws, or, even worse, someone elses God that cannot be proven to their satisfaction imposing laws upon them. My point was that we should not assume that people do not beleive in God because they want to have sex with frogs or some other sin. There are lots of people who follow all of the Ten Commandments except for the ones related to God.

Well for one thing God request for believers to obey him is not he same as what you call having God impose a law on you. Have God imposed a law on You?

Of course I believe that God is the Lord of this universe and his will for believers will prevail. I don’t see where that is any imposition to you since you do not believe.

Now are you saying that my belief in God should some how prevent me from putting my two cents into how I would like things to be in society? Is this not who the government is made from? Us people. . So since you have no problem with government what is your complaint. My belief gives me the foundations by which I make my decisions. So does yours. So depending on where you live and your take on your government then one just has to bear it or over throw it.

You see I still can not understand you view that you are somehow imposed upon by My Lord and Savior?

 

[ralphinal]

Well for one thing God request for believers to obey him is not he same as what you call having God impose a law on you. Have God imposed a law on You?

Of course I believe that God is the Lord of this universe and his will for believers will prevail. I don’t see where that is any imposition to you since you do not believe.

Now are you saying that my belief in God should some how prevent me from putting my two cents into how I would like things to be in society? Is this not who the government is made from? Us people. . So since you have no problem with government what is your complaint. My belief gives me the foundations by which I make my decisions. So does yours. So depending on where you live and your take on your government then one just has to bear it or over throw it.

You see I still can not understand you view that you are somehow imposed upon by My Lord and Savior?

Let me try one more time. First, I am a Catholic, so the agnostic stance is not my own. Second, my point is that when we approach agnostics or atheists with the idea that they do not believe because they want to sin, we end the communication. For example, Bubba is agnostic. Bubba is agnostic because he does not accept the arguement that we present for the existance of God. If I go to Bubba and in word, tone, or deed ask if he denies God because he wants to marry his dog or some such (exagerated for effect), then I have insulted him and ended the opportunity. Some people do not believe because the evidence is not conclusive to them, not because they are opposed to God’s law! We need to remember that when we communicate with them.

 

[DebChris]

How do you know?
I’ve spoken to many atheists and agnostics. Some of them are actually very interested, but fear and poor knowledge about Christian faith are clouding their perception. See them for what they are: made in God’s image and loved deeply by Him. Be a follower of Christ and try to help them by listening and then showing them God’s love.

It is God’s love as lived that attracts followers, not our harping on why they “are sinful and wrong.” Thank you for stating what needed to be said.

 

[Vintagecoils]

Let me try one more time. First, I am a Catholic, so the agnostic stance is not my own. Second, my point is that when we approach agnostics or atheists with the idea that they do not believe because they want to sin, we end the communication. For example, Bubba is agnostic. Bubba is agnostic because he does not accept the arguement that we present for the existance of God. If I go to Bubba and in word, tone, or deed ask if he denies God because he wants to marry his dog or some such (exagerated for effect), then I have insulted him and ended the opportunity. Some people do not believe because the evidence is not conclusive to them, not because they are opposed to God’s law! We need to remember that when we communicate with them.

OK I see it is not you but when you say someone does not believe in God but don’t like being accused of not wanting to obeys Gods law still confuses me. IT sounds like they are wanting there cake and eating it to. They don’t believe in God. So how can they be desireing to obey God’s law.
There is no argument about tone because as a Christian we should not approach any one with a hurtful tone.

I was truelly trying to understand, because agnostics and atheist confuse me with their mis representing things like being imposed and forced to obey something that is meant for believers only. Have you ever heard Christopher Hitchens?. He makes it sounds like he has been insome kind of dictator Christian country.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

I might say:

“It’s great to see you are smart enough to not think of yourself as an atheist! After all, who could know, without a doubt, there is no God?”

I’d then ask what it is that causes the person to doubt. If they are doubts i once had, or doubts i even struggle with now myself, i would tell him this.

If the doubts he has are those for which i have found sound reasons to no longer doubt, i’d briefly explain why i no longer have doubts about it. I’d be careful not to come off as a know-it-all or as insincere, but as someone who is searching for the truth about God just as he is.

 

[ralphinal]

OK I see it is not you but when you say someone does not believe in God but don’t like being accused of not wanting to obeys Gods law still confuses me. IT sounds like they are wanting there cake and eating it to. They don’t believe in God. So how can they be desireing to obey God’s law.
There is no argument about tone because as a Christian we should not approach any one with a hurtful tone.

I was truelly trying to understand, because agnostics and atheist confuse me with their mis representing things like being imposed and forced to obey something that is meant for believers only. Have you ever heard Christopher Hitchens?. He makes it sounds like he has been insome kind of dictator Christian country.

I know what you mean. The first step, like Socates mentioned on the next point (great point) is to establish why they feel that way.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

I know what you mean. The first step, like Socates mentioned on the next point (great point) is to establish why they feel that way.

Agreed.