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STT
Guest
Actually this question came to my mind when I was listening to an online course about Buddhism. Buddhist could have a sense of unity with outside world during meditation. People could have out of body experience (I had once). There is this interesting talk which a woman has a stroke and lose her sense of self. This woman could not distinguish between objects and her body.
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Aloysium
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:twocents:
Hello there, you on the other side. See this screen: it is the screen, the photons eminating from it to your retina, your retina and the optic nerve that connects to midbrain structures to the occipital lobe, and all sorts of feedback tracts, into where you are processing these latterns into words, etc. Physically speaking, you are one with the universe, reading what I am writing though space and time. What separates things, this complex node of matter from its surroundings is the rational mind. In the moment, limitless itself, it cleaves the flow of time into past-present-future. We are separate relational beings, relating to everything else and created by Realtionality itself, perfect Love - the Triune Godhead.
Hello there, you on the other side. See this screen: it is the screen, the photons eminating from it to your retina, your retina and the optic nerve that connects to midbrain structures to the occipital lobe, and all sorts of feedback tracts, into where you are processing these latterns into words, etc. Physically speaking, you are one with the universe, reading what I am writing though space and time. What separates things, this complex node of matter from its surroundings is the rational mind. In the moment, limitless itself, it cleaves the flow of time into past-present-future. We are separate relational beings, relating to everything else and created by Realtionality itself, perfect Love - the Triune Godhead.
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STT
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Thanks, this I know.
Have you ever had out of body experience? I had once. It was at night and I went outside for a cigarette. When I was done I felt so light so I raised my arms and I felt that I am in sky. I then contract myself and I could see inside and outside as tall as a three stories building. How could you possibly explain this if we are completely separated from the rest of universe?
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GEddie
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There is certainly a continuous interaction between Body and the physical world; every minute of life, Body absorbs oxygen through the lungs, vents carbonic acid to the air, and dumps heat through the skin, among other processes.
But the solid of which the mind is aware or can move is circumscribed by the skin, which divides it from the world per se. We can use our mind to directly move our feet, but not the rocks or earth under them; We feel life through our skin, but cannot feel “the world” where it does not touch our skin.
ICXC NIKA
But the solid of which the mind is aware or can move is circumscribed by the skin, which divides it from the world per se. We can use our mind to directly move our feet, but not the rocks or earth under them; We feel life through our skin, but cannot feel “the world” where it does not touch our skin.
ICXC NIKA
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STT
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Then how do you explain out of body experience?
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Gorgias
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Yes, but that’s not what you’re claiming. You’re claiming that all particles interact with all other particles.
Moreover, the claim isn’t that there are merely ‘interactions’, but interactions that impinge on persons, such that we can’t define a ‘person’ due to these impingements. That argument just doesn’t hold up to reason. Essentially, you’re saying that, if I walk past a telephone pole, I’m not the same guy I was any longer, since there was an ‘interaction’ with the telephone pole.
You’ve changed the playing field. Electromagnetic interactions aren’t “particles entering into and exiting from your body” in a way that changes personhood. After all, if I lose one electron, do I become a different person? Of course not…
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Aloysium
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I can’t say I have. I’ve spoken to people who have. I understand you were able to view your body from the outside, looking down on yourself from three stories above. I don’t know what to make of it. it was obviously a very special moment. Hmm. I could make a joke about the cigarette you were smoking, but that would be to discount what you say. II makes me nervous that I cannot adequately explain to myself what you are describing. However, I can make myself imagine what it might feel like, sort of like a wakeful dream. Flying dreams are fun. It would appear there are many doors of perception.
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abucs
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Hello STT, i would like to know more about your Out Of Body Experience and i think it is well within the scope of this thread.
What did you see during your OOBE? How much control did you have? Was there any bodily sensations like weight or pain? Were there any special thoughts that came into your mind during the time? How did the experience end? What did you do straight afterwards?
I have a friend who used to be an atheist until he had a similar experience to yours. That experience has caused him to re-examine the world around him and change his previous thinking.
Regards.
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inocente
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It’s an illusion - livescience.com/50683-out-of-body-illusion.html
There are trillions of particles in each neuron. Read up on signal-to-noise.
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Tomdstone
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Many people have had hallucinations.
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STT
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There is things to be explained. Your experience of how you are changes then certainly an explanation of how this happens is needed. Buddhist also could reach to state of unity during meditation where there is no boundary between them and universe.
This is related to subject of this thread. It could be the result of how we interact with the rest of universe. It could be your spirit how leaves your body.
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STT
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The interaction is long range for Coulomb force between charged particles.
That is the question. If you are the same guy when you are walking close to a telephone pole then what separate you from the rest of universe?Moreover, the claim isn’t that there are merely ‘interactions’, but interactions that impinge on persons, such that we can’t define a ‘person’ due to these impingements. That argument just doesn’t hold up to reason. Essentially, you’re saying that, if I walk past a telephone pole, I’m not the same guy I was any longer, since there was an ‘interaction’ with the telephone pole.
I didn’t say that charged particles enter and exist a body. I said that charged particle interact through long range Coulomb interaction.
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STT
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I could see inside and outside of my body when I was as tall as three stories building.
I have full control on my body.
I was feeling light when I was ascending and feeling heavy when I was descending.
No.
I shacked strongly when I return to normal.
Interesting.
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STT
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Then Aquinas vision of heaven was a hallucination too.
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STT
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Everything that we experience has to do something with brain. Whether the experience is merely produced by brain is subject of discussion.
So what? We know that charged particles interact by long range Coulomb interaction.
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Gorgias
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You’re changing the playing field again. First, you claimed that all particles interact with all other particles (which might actually give rise to the assertion you’re making), but now you’re attempting to validate your assertion by simply saying that “particles interact with each other”. The latter statement doesn’t prove the former.
Worse yet, you point to Coulomb’s law. You see that r[sup]2[/sup] term in the denominator, don’t you? As distance increases, the force goes to zero. This doesn’t help prove your point. A miniscule amount of attraction or repulsion between me and a galaxy a googleplex light-years away does not infringe on my person.
And now, yet another way to change the playing field. The ‘evidence’ you provided (Coulomb’s law) doesn’t speak to “particles entering into and exiting” the body. Yet, as others have pointed out, materialism doesn’t posit a ‘me’, so how can we answer that question?
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STT
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By long I meant that all particle interact with each other. Moreover, r[sup]2[/sup] term only means that the force tend to zero but never becomes zero.You’re changing the playing field again. First, you claimed that all particles interact with all other particles (which might actually give rise to the assertion you’re making), but now you’re attempting to validate your assertion by simply saying that “particles interact with each other”. The latter statement doesn’t prove the former.
Worse yet, you point to Coulomb’s law. You see that r[sup]2[/sup] term in the denominator, don’t you? As distance increases, the force goes to zero. This doesn’t help prove your point. A miniscule amount of attraction or repulsion between me and a galaxy a googleplex light-years away does not infringe on my person.
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Aloysium
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Speaking about particles and their interactions, just some random thoughts: One may wish to consider the possibility that particles come together unifying into a greater whole. That would be why when isolated, an electron, appearing as a particle, may possibly turn up, the probability being extremely low mind you, at the other end of the galaxy from its nucleus. It’s being having been “given” to the larger whole, the galaxy, it was a wave in that larger whole, and not exhibiting the particle nature it would have in isolation. The electron is a component of a unity, that is an atom, which is a component in a larger molecule, which would in turn have surrendered its independent being as part of a planet, solar system and galaxy. The rational mind may cleave these components from the whole which they constitute, through the technological and sensory processes that are present as a result of its attachment to a particular time and space. Our being here transforms what is here even to the subatomic. Clearly we do that with a click of a mouse. Just a thought. As to the air that enters our lungs and becomes part of us as a living person. Yeah, it does that.
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