What is it that homosexuals really want?

[mitex]

That was on topic! They all want different things, because they are individuals, just like anyone. They are far more than their sexual identity, as many tend to forget.

I think that it must vary among homosexuals, but I think they just want to be normal. They want to have a wedding, wear wedding rings, go on a honeymoon, and form a bond for life. Many of them probably want children as well, to be members of the PTA and to volunteer as chaperons at the prom when their kids are in high school. They can already do all of these things - but without societal approval or more importantly, government approval. This is what I believe they want - equality. They just don’t see the things they do as sin.

As a celibate homosexual I have things I want. I want to be regarded as a full member of the parish I am in and the opportunity to be considered for the same positions and responsibilities as everyone else (excluding the priesthood obviously). Father James Martin S.J. sounds off on this perfectly here.

I also want to be included in society without stigma, question, or discrimination (no I do not want to get married or have sex). Catholics especially should be sensitive to my needs and questions as I am not only defying the expectations from the gay community to be faithful to the Church and but to my family who are liberal Episcopalians and frown on me joining the Catholic Church and becoming celibate.

I don’t want people to make snide remarks or gossip about my sexual identity I want to be included in their circles as a “normal” human being who has worth, dignity, and value. Do I have “disordered tendencies?” Yes but unless I’m doing something contrary to Church teaching no layman has the right to treat me differently or group me in some category that discards my human value.

So yes despite the fact that I am a rather forward celibate homosexual you still have to accept me for who I am and show the same love due to a fellow Christian.

As I promise to strive to love those who defy my expectations as well!

 

[John21652]

As a celibate homosexual I have things I want. I want to be regarded as a full member of the parish I am in and the opportunity to be considered for the same positions and responsibilities as everyone else (excluding the priesthood obviously). Father James Martin S.J. sounds off on this perfectly here.

I also want to be included in society without stigma, question, or discrimination (no I do not want to get married or have sex). Catholics especially should be sensitive to my needs and questions as I am not only defying the expectations from the gay community to be faithful to the Church and but to my family who are liberal Episcopalians and frown on me joining the Catholic Church and becoming celibate.

I don’t want people to make snide remarks or gossip about my sexual identity I want to be included in their circles as a “normal” human being who has worth, dignity, and value. Do I have “disordered tendencies?” Yes but unless I’m doing something contrary to Church teaching no layman has the right to treat me differently or group me in some category that discards my human value.

So yes despite the fact that I am a rather forward celibate homosexual you still have to accept me for who I am and show the same love due to a fellow Christian.

As I promise to strive to love those who defy my expectations as well!

So, when you walk into your local parish hall, or into Church, are you being discriminated against? What’s stopping you from walking into your local parish and making friends with everyone? I can walk into a parish hall, even one not my own and shake hands and be friendly. Why can’t you?

Unless, of course, you walk in with a big sign around your neck which says “Hey everyone, I’m a celibate gay!”, no one will know your gay and I doubt that anyone will shake your hand and ask “Are you gay?”. So, again I ask, what’s the problem?

 

[mitex]

So, when you walk into your local parish hall, or into Church, are you being discriminated against? What’s stopping you from walking into your local parish and making friends with everyone? I can walk into a parish hall, even one not my own and shake hands and be friendly. Why can’t you?

Unless, of course, you walk in with a big sign around your neck which says “Hey everyone, I’m a celibate gay!”, no one will know your gay and I doubt that anyone will shake your hand and ask “Are you gay?”. So, again I ask, what’s the problem?

No I don’t walk into Church like that lol. I just want to make it a safer environment for people like me.

And I am friendly.

 

[John21652]

No I don’t walk into Church like that lol. I just want to make it a safer environment for people like me.

And I am friendly.

OK, you want to make a Church a safer environment for someone like you.

The logical inference to be made from what you write is that a Church is not a safe environment for someone like you.

Now, please explain why a Church isn’t a safe environment for someone like you.

 

[mitex]

OK, you want to make a Church a safer environment for someone like you.

The logical inference to be made from what you write is that a Church is not a safe environment for someone like you.

Now, please explain why a Church isn’t a safe environment for someone like you.

There’s still a stigma. It depends on each parish really because they’re all in different areas of course and have different demographics.

For example the diocese wanted to use our parish facilities for the HIV/AIDs and Courage Apostolate ministries. The Parish Council had a fit.

Now I don’t necessarily agree with everything Courage says but it when the very Church approved ministry for those who are homosexuals can’t even get space it begs one to wonder whether there is a welcoming environment.

And bullying can be tackled at the Catholic high schools.

Personally I think what needs to be done is an education program on what homosexuality is and what it isn’t. And there’s no uniform approach on how to proceed with that and its inhibited the Evangelization and rehabilitation of homosexuals.

 

[John21652]

There’s still a stigma. It depends on each parish really because they’re all in different areas of course and have different demographics.

For example the diocese wanted to use our parish facilities for the HIV/AIDs and Courage Apostolate ministries. The Parish Council had a fit.

Now I don’t necessarily agree with everything Courage says but it when the very Church approved ministry for those who are homosexuals can’t even get space it begs one to wonder whether there is a welcoming environment.

And bullying can be tackled at the Catholic high schools.

Personally I think what needs to be done is an education program on what homosexuality is and what it isn’t. And there’s no uniform approach on how to proceed with that and its inhibited the Evangelization and rehabilitation of homosexuals.

You didn’t answer my questions.

You wrote you want to make the Church to be a safer environment for people like you.

I asked you how it is that the Church is not a safe environment for someone like you.

You answered “there’s still a stigma”. So, where does the stigma come from? I ask again, do you wear a sign around your neck announcing that your gay? If so, I think the stigma is probably against anyone who goes to Church wearing a sign around their neck. Let’s face it, going to Church with a sign around your neck is pretty weird! If you don’t truly wear a sign around your neck, then where does the stigma come from? And, if someone is stigmatised, how does this make going to Church unsafe?

Now, please, answer the questions. One by one would be good.

 

[LoyalViews]

As a celibate homosexual I have things I want. I want to be regarded as a full member of the parish I am in and the opportunity to be considered for the same positions and responsibilities as everyone else (excluding the priesthood obviously). Father James Martin S.J. sounds off on this perfectly here.

I also want to be included in society without stigma, question, or discrimination (no I do not want to get married or have sex). Catholics especially should be sensitive to my needs and questions as I am not only defying the expectations from the gay community to be faithful to the Church and but to my family who are liberal Episcopalians and frown on me joining the Catholic Church and becoming celibate.

I don’t want people to make snide remarks or gossip about my sexual identity I want to be included in their circles as a “normal” human being who has worth, dignity, and value. Do I have “disordered tendencies?” Yes but unless I’m doing something contrary to Church teaching no layman has the right to treat me differently or group me in some category that discards my human value.

So yes despite the fact that I am a rather forward celibate homosexual you still have to accept me for who I am and show the same love due to a fellow Christian.

As I promise to strive to love those who defy my expectations as well!

I was referring myself to the homosexuals who embrace the “pride” culture. You though aren’t a part of that, you’re a person with the proper understanding of sexuality.

 

[mitex]

I was referring myself to the homosexuals who embrace the “pride” culture. You though aren’t a part of that, you’re a person with the proper understanding of sexuality.

 

[mitex]

You didn’t answer my questions.

You wrote you want to make the Church to be a safer environment for people like you.

I asked you how it is that the Church is not a safe environment for someone like you.

You answered “there’s still a stigma”. So, where does the stigma come from? I ask again, do you wear a sign around your neck announcing that your gay? If so, I think the stigma is probably against anyone who goes to Church wearing a sign around their neck. Let’s face it, going to Church with a sign around your neck is pretty weird! If you don’t truly wear a sign around your neck, then where does the stigma come from? And, if someone is stigmatised, how does this make going to Church unsafe?

Now, please, answer the questions. One by one would be good.

It’s rather obvious I’m a homosexual/gay/same-sex attracted (to be sensitive to everyone’s terms). Let’s put it this way. I am stereotypical. Connect the dots from there.

People see me and they like to talk. Although I’m working on trying to overhaul the way I dress, act, and appear in public its very difficult and an expensive process. I have to buy more neutral clothing that is more… Less campy and flashy… I have to change my hairstyle.

I’m a target. So yes I do have a sign in some respects. And that leads to all the problems.

 

[Allegra]

Probably individual homosexuals really want to live “normal” lives. However, many of the loudest seem to feel that the only way that can happen is if they legally force everyone to acknowledge their lifestyles as normal, healthy, and moral. They seem to want to silence anyone who disagrees.

 

[John21652]

It’s rather obvious I’m a homosexual/gay/same-sex attracted (to be sensitive to everyone’s terms). Let’s put it this way. I am stereotypical. Connect the dots from there.

People see me and they like to talk. Although I’m working on trying to overhaul the way I dress, act, and appear in public its very difficult and an expensive process. I have to buy more neutral clothing that is more… Less campy and flashy… I have to change my hairstyle.

I’m a target. So yes I do have a sign in some respects. And that leads to all the problems.

Ok, now we are getting somewhere.

You do wear a ‘sign’ around your neck.

You say that makes you a ‘target’.

A target for what?

And how is it that a Church is not a safe environment for someone like you?

 

[mitex]

Ok, now we are getting somewhere.

You do wear a ‘sign’ around your neck.

You say that makes you a ‘target’.

A target for what?

And how is it that a Church is not a safe environment for someone like you?

Well one time I heard a mother tell her kids not to sit next to me because I was a “deviant” and another time several people make offhanded comments jokes and comments about the way I walk or speak.

Granted this may be a general joke in general about homosexuals. I admit target is an overreaction. Maybe Im just being paranoid.
It just hurts my feelings.

 

[LoyalViews]

That was on topic! They all want different things, because they are individuals, just like anyone. They are far more than their sexual identity, as many tend to forget.

My answer to the question is that they all want different things. My answer in not off topic just because I refused to throw out a nasty generalization.

I’m sorry, please forgive me. It’s just that I saw your post as that way, I misinterpreted that.

 

[John21652]

Well one time I heard a mother tell her kids not to sit next to me because I was a “deviant” and another time several people make offhanded comments jokes and comments about the way I walk or speak.

Did this demonstrate to you that a Church was not a safe environment for someone like you?

Granted this may be a general joke in general about homosexuals. I admit target is an overreaction. Maybe Im just being paranoid.
It just hurts my feelings.

Are you saying a Church isn’t a safe place for someone like you because you might have your feelings hurt?

 

[mitex]

Did this demonstrate to you that a Church was not a safe environment for someone like you?

Are you saying a Church isn’t a safe place for someone like you because you might have your feelings hurt?

No it did not… I was wrong…

No I was wrong… My apologies…

 

[bscastro]

Thank you for sharing this point of view. Not being homosexual, I have no idea or wouldn’t try to guess what it would be like. I admire your choice to stay faithful and celibate - or more accurately am impressed (perhaps in the celibacy part). In any case, I respect and appreciate your response, which is educational for me. I have several non-Catholic homosexual friends and we’ve agreed not to discuss the issue knowing our views differ, so I never really heard your viewpoint (admittedly, I haven’t actively sought it out).

God bless,
Bryan

As a celibate homosexual I have things I want. I want to be regarded as a full member of the parish I am in and the opportunity to be considered for the same positions and responsibilities as everyone else (excluding the priesthood obviously). Father James Martin S.J. sounds off on this perfectly here.

I also want to be included in society without stigma, question, or discrimination (no I do not want to get married or have sex). Catholics especially should be sensitive to my needs and questions as I am not only defying the expectations from the gay community to be faithful to the Church and but to my family who are liberal Episcopalians and frown on me joining the Catholic Church and becoming celibate.

I don’t want people to make snide remarks or gossip about my sexual identity I want to be included in their circles as a “normal” human being who has worth, dignity, and value. Do I have “disordered tendencies?” Yes but unless I’m doing something contrary to Church teaching no layman has the right to treat me differently or group me in some category that discards my human value.

So yes despite the fact that I am a rather forward celibate homosexual you still have to accept me for who I am and show the same love due to a fellow Christian.

As I promise to strive to love those who defy my expectations as well!

 

[Allegra]

Well one time I heard a mother tell her kids not to sit next to me because I was a “deviant” and another time several people make offhanded comments jokes and comments about the way I walk or speak.

Granted this may be a general joke in general about homosexuals. I admit target is an overreaction. Maybe Im just being paranoid.
It just hurts my feelings.

Someone said this to you in your church!?!?!?

 

[John21652]

No it did not… I was wrong…

No I was wrong… My apologies…

Ok.

So what’s the lesson here?

You were angry and hurt because some mother said to her kids don’t sit next to him because he’s a devaint. Correct?

And you had your feelings hurt when a few made some smart cracks about the way you were dressed. Correct?

And here you are telling us you are a celibate homosexual who just wants to go to Church and be like everyone else. Correct?

The thing is, you are dressing up like a full blown, practicing homosexual, or as a typical ‘gay’. Stop dressing like a typical practicing gay, because, not being one, you are not typical. You are labelling yourself as something you are not. That’s what the gay lobby has done to you. It is they who have labelled you because they have encouraged gays to dress a certain way and to flaunt their homosexuality, their difference, in the faces of society. And society feels threatened and hurt, just like you do. Flaunting it in Church is flaunting something that is not catholic, so that’s worse!

So go buy a pair of jeans and a nice shirt and see what happens. Or even go buy a nice suit to use as your Sunday best. See how you get on then. If you wont, then perhaps you just want to continue to flaunt your gayness, which is the same as labelling yourself, or the same as putting a great big sign around your neck. Imagine if I went to Church and said to people “Hi, my name is John and I’m a practicing heterosexual male”! They’d throw me in the loony bin, wouldn’t they?

 

[DeniseNY]

Are you saying a Church isn’t a safe place for someone like you because you might have your feelings hurt?

Should anyone go to church and have to endure being laughed at because of the way they look, walk, talk, etc…?

I’m just assuming that mitex hasn’t shared with the parishoners at his Church certain things (such as the fact that he’s celibate), but that does not excuse or make right parishoners judging him and making assumptions about him.

 

[DeniseNY]

Well one time I heard a mother tell her kids not to sit next to me because I was a “deviant” and another time several people make offhanded comments jokes and comments about the way I walk or speak.

Granted this may be a general joke in general about homosexuals. I admit target is an overreaction. Maybe Im just being paranoid.
It just hurts my feelings.

I’m sorry this has happened to you.

I’m sure you’ve shared things here (such as the fact that you’re celibate) that the parishoners at your Church don’t know; but, that doesn’t excuse them judging you, nor does it make it right.