What is my parish?

[eduardo]

“My” priest and “my” parish are geographically about eight miles away from my house. The closest parish and priest are about 1/4 mile from my house.

I prefer “mine” to the closest. I’ve been to both.

“My” parish looks like it is supposed to . There is something about the external architecture that I love. There is something about the internal “guts” (forgive my irreverence, please) that sings to me on the inside. I like the altar with the rails. I like the confessional booths on either side. I like the old wood look. I even like the cemetary on the side and this beautiful glowing neon sign in the midst of a predominantly muslim neighborhood…

http://www.geocities.com/hojosite/als.jpg

I know that I am new and maybe this stuff should be the least of my concerns, but I also like “my” priest. He doesn’t pull any punches in his sermons/homilies and he is as gentle and yet as forthright as I imagine Christ was during his earthly ministry.

Now on the other hand, the closest church looks… like a protestant church. I know because I’ve spent considerable time in them. There is no crucifix. It appears very modern. They have chairs, not pews. I expected to kneel when I visited there and no one did. Not one.

I spent a lot of time thinking that bread and wine were symbols, now that I accept they are not merely that I want no part of casually watching them confected.

Yes, I know that all of this is superficial. As an evangelical, I have worshipped in a outdoor chapel on logs. I have also worshipped in glass and brass cathedrals. I also know that I am free of “church shopping” now that I have found anchorage in The Church. If tomorrow should mean that I must travel 1000 miles to receive Christ in the sacraments, I will do that. But therein lies my question.

Shouldn’t I be going to the closest parish? Shouldn’t I be serving Christ in THIS neighborhood and being a torchbearer of God in my closest vicinity? Shouldn’t my least concern be what is comfortable for me?

Is it ‘okay’ that I want to go back to where I spent what little of my youth was actually in The Church? To the parish that held my mother’s funeral mass? To the place that feels like home for as long as it can remain open?

What is my parish? Is it a geographical locale or not?

By the way, if I don’t like the answer I get… I’m moving back to the old neighborhood. No better time for buyers in the housing market.

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

“My” priest and “my” parish are geographically about eight miles away from my house. The closest parish and priest are about 1/4 mile from my house.

I prefer “mine” to the closest. I’ve been to both.

“My” parish looks like it is supposed to . There is something about the external architecture that I love. There is something about the internal “guts” (forgive my irreverence, please) that sings to me on the inside. I like the altar with the rails. I like the confessional booths on either side. I like the old wood look. I even like the cemetary on the side and this beautiful glowing neon sign in the midst of a predominantly muslim neighborhood…

http://www.geocities.com/hojosite/als.jpg

I know that I am new and maybe this stuff should be the least of my concerns, but I also like “my” priest. He doesn’t pull any punches in his sermons/homilies and he is as gentle and yet as forthright as I imagine Christ was during his earthly ministry.

Now on the other hand, the closest church looks… like a protestant church. I know because I’ve spent considerable time in them. There is no crucifix. It appears very modern. They have chairs, not pews. I expected to kneel when I visited there and no one did. Not one.

I spent a lot of time thinking that bread and wine were symbols, now that I accept they are not merely that I want no part of casually watching them confected.

Yes, I know that all of this is superficial. As an evangelical, I have worshipped in a outdoor chapel on logs. I have also worshipped in glass and brass cathedrals. I also know that I am free of “church shopping” now that I have found anchorage in The Church. If tomorrow should mean that I must travel 1000 miles to receive Christ in the sacraments, I will do that. But therein lies my question.

Shouldn’t I be going to the closest parish? Shouldn’t I be serving Christ in THIS neighborhood and being a torchbearer of God in my closest vicinity? Shouldn’t my least concern be what is comfortable for me?

Is it ‘okay’ that I want to go back to where I spent what little of my youth was actually in The Church? To the parish that held my mother’s funeral mass? To the place that feels like home for as long as it can remain open?

What is my parish? Is it a geographical locale or not?

By the way, if I don’t like the answer I get… I’m moving back to the old neighborhood. No better time for buyers in the housing market.

Your “parish” is where you live, you attend a church in another parish. You live on a certain street at a certain address, you can state however that you may live there but it’s not “your” neighborhood, you just happen to live in it!

 

[zab]

We have parishioners who live within the boundaries of other parishes but they want to belong to our parish for one reason or another. Some of it has to do with wanting to belong to our parish because they have children going to the only Cathlic grade school in our area which is in our parish. But I think mostly they like our parish because it is traditional in appearance as well as the parishioners have long had a strong devotion to the Blessed Mother and the Holy Eucharist and our pastors have been good and faithful priests who are faithful to the teachings of the church.

Whatever the case, they do get permission from the pastor in their geographical area to join our parish. I don’t know of anyone ever being denied. But that is the proceedure around here.

Sometimes, though, it is good for a person, particularly one who is strong in the faith, to stay within the community nearest them and to pray for their parish family. Sometimes that is how changes come about, because of the faithful members who offer their prayers and sacrifices. But you may not be ready for that yet, having just returned to the faith and you may have a family that would better benefit from the parish where you grew up. It is understandable that you would want to be a parishioner in the church of your youth, where your grandmother’s funeral was. Welcome home! Thanks for sharing the beautiful picture.

 

[jmcrae]

Nowadays, geographical parish boundaries are not enforced, and you can attend Mass and do your volunteer work anywhere you want, within the boundaries of your Diocese.

 

[rick43235]

Nowadays, geographical parish boundaries are not enforced, and you can attend Mass and do your volunteer work anywhere you want, within the boundaries of your Diocese.

This does not apply to me, I’m just curious. What if one lived near the boundary between two dioceses and wanted to belong to a parish that was within he boundary of the other diocese. Any problem?

 

[jmcrae]

This does not apply to me, I’m just curious. What if one lived near the boundary between two dioceses and wanted to belong to a parish that was within he boundary of the other diocese. Any problem?

I think you would need your Bishop’s permission - I don’t know for sure, though. If I were in that situation, I’d contact my Diocescan office for clarification.

The diocese I live in extends over several hundred miles, and I happen to live pretty much smack in the middle of it, so it isn’t likely ever to be an issue, for me.

 

[zab]

Nowadays, geographical parish boundaries are not enforced, and you can attend Mass and do your volunteer work anywhere you want, within the boundaries of your Diocese.

It may not be enforced but our pastor still recommends that the people living out of our geographical area who want to be members of our parish to get permission from the pastor nearest them as a common courtesy. It is good for the pastor to maintain a good relationship with other pastors in the area. Sometimes he needs to ask for their help with things like Penance Services, supporting the Catholic School, and so on.

 

[puzzleannie]

you are a member your territorial parish. you may worship, confess, volunteer etc. at any parish you wish. You do not have to “register” anywhere unless you want a record of your financial contributions. The pastor of your territorial parish is responsible for the care of your soul, including sacraments, so if you wish to marry, baptize your children etc. elsewhere you must get his permission to do so. That is just a routine and many priests do not insist upon it in any case. If you have reason to believe that liturgy in your home parish is illicit please document and report to your bishop.

This does not apply to me, I’m just curious. What if one lived near the boundary between two dioceses and wanted to belong to a parish that was within he boundary of the other diocese. Any problem?

this was our situation in Ohio, on the border of the Cleveland and Youngstown Diocese, we actually worshipped and participated in the life of our geographical parish, but frequently attended and volunteered at parish in next diocese. Also, with permission, took catechetical training in the other diocese, since classes in my own diocese were over an hour away, and these were next door. Kids went to youth group and Lifeteen in the other diocese, since they were not available closer to home. Since we both worked, and kids attended schools in the other diocese many years we actually spent more time at Mass there than at home.

the issue comes with things like sacraments, which do require permission from your own pastor, and getting kids into parish schools, if you cannot prove you support the parish, which may affect admission and tuition.

 

[tee_eff_em]

Can. 107 §1. Through both domicile and quasi-domicile, each person acquires his or her pastor and ordinary.

See the relevant section of the law for further definition of domicile. Usually this is understood to mean each person also acquires a parish (cf. Can. 102, which does not really say so out loud).

This does not mean you cannot frequent and worship at another parish or in the territory of another bishop.

This does not apply to me, I’m just curious. What if one lived near the boundary between two dioceses and wanted to belong to a parish that was within he boundary of the other diocese. Any problem?

I believe the only caveat is that one would remain bound to the decrees and direction of his proper ordinary, even if frequenting participation in a neighboring territory.

For instance, if one’s domicile is in a diocese where the Solemnity of the Ascension is celebrated on Thursday, but frequents a diocese where it is translated to Sunday, I believe one would be bound to assist at Mass, in any Catholic rite, in either diocese, on Thursday or the evening before (The situation might be different for someone understod to be travelling outside of his diocese, however). I could be mistaken in this belief though.

tee

 

[FrDavid96]

“My” priest and “my” parish are geographically about eight miles away from my house. The closest parish and priest are about 1/4 mile from my house.

I prefer “mine” to the closest. I’ve been to both.

“My” parish looks like it is supposed to . There is something about the external architecture that I love. There is something about the internal “guts” (forgive my irreverence, please) that sings to me on the inside. I like the altar with the rails. I like the confessional booths on either side. I like the old wood look. I even like the cemetary on the side and this beautiful glowing neon sign in the midst of a predominantly muslim neighborhood…

I know that I am new and maybe this stuff should be the least of my concerns, but I also like “my” priest. He doesn’t pull any punches in his sermons/homilies and he is as gentle and yet as forthright as I imagine Christ was during his earthly ministry.

Now on the other hand, the closest church looks… like a protestant church. I know because I’ve spent considerable time in them. There is no crucifix. It appears very modern. They have chairs, not pews. I expected to kneel when I visited there and no one did. Not one.

I spent a lot of time thinking that bread and wine were symbols, now that I accept they are not merely that I want no part of casually watching them confected.

Yes, I know that all of this is superficial. As an evangelical, I have worshipped in a outdoor chapel on logs. I have also worshipped in glass and brass cathedrals. I also know that I am free of “church shopping” now that I have found anchorage in The Church. If tomorrow should mean that I must travel 1000 miles to receive Christ in the sacraments, I will do that. But therein lies my question.

Shouldn’t I be going to the closest parish? Shouldn’t I be serving Christ in THIS neighborhood and being a torchbearer of God in my closest vicinity? Shouldn’t my least concern be what is comfortable for me?

Is it ‘okay’ that I want to go back to where I spent what little of my youth was actually in The Church? To the parish that held my mother’s funeral mass? To the place that feels like home for as long as it can remain open?

What is my parish? Is it a geographical locale or not?

By the way, if I don’t like the answer I get… I’m moving back to the old neighborhood. No better time for buyers in the housing market.

Eduardo,
You are automatically a member of which ever parish you happen to live, and this is a matter of geography, not proximity or preference. The comparison I often make is to remind people (living in the US who can relate to this one) that you are a resident of the actual state where you live, no matter what else–the same holds true for a parish. Just as you can’t live in Michigan and consider yourself a resident of Ohio, you can’t live in one parish and consider yourself a member of another.

“Registering” at a given parish is purely practical. You can go to Mass wherever you choose, be on anyone’s mailing list, and can make donations anywhere you choose, but registering does not make one a parishioner (neither does the lack of registration make one a non-parishioner). Unless you’re in a situation of a non-territorial parish (which are quite rare in the US today) your actual place of residence within the territory of a paish is the only thing that matters.

Having said that, to respond to your later questions: there’s nothing wrong with having an emotional attachment to your “family” parish, and nothing wrong with attending there. Your conscience should be clear on that one. But keep in mind that when it comes to anything involving jurisdiction (like the Sacraments) only your official parish counts.

 

[eduardo]

Thanks for all the info.

Do I assume that I am a part of the closest geographical parish or does the archdiocese have an actual map?

 

[jmcrae]

Thanks for all the info.

Do I assume that I am a part of the closest geographical parish or does the archdiocese have an actual map?

Every parish should have a map of its own geographical boundaries, but if not, you can go to the Archdiocese and ask them which parish you live in - they will know.

 

[FrDavid96]

Thanks for all the info.

Do I assume that I am a part of the closest geographical parish or does the archdiocese have an actual map?

It’s not necessarily the closest parish. There might not be a map as such, but there should be something to distinguish the boundaries. It might be a list of zip codes, or it might correspond to something in civil law (like city limits). Instead of contacting the diocese, it would be easier to simply contact the nearest parish and inquire there whether or not you live in the territory–they are in a better position to give you a quick and simple answer.

 

[thomasf]

What do you do in my case, when 3 parishes have ‘boundaries’ that overlap where I live?

I attended all 3 parishes when I came back to the church, and then picked the one I felt most comfortable. That’s where I go to mass, that’s the parish I belong to and that’s where I receive the sacraments. IMO, that’s my parish.

And Eduardo should go to whatever church he’s most comfortable, and not worry about the closer parish.

 

[rick43235]

Unless you’re in a situation of a non-territorial parish (which are quite rare in the US today) your actual place of residence within the territory of a paish is the only thing that matters.

But keep in mind that when it comes to anything involving jurisdiction (like the Sacraments) only your official parish counts.

Actually, a friend of mine finds himself in such a situation. Within the boundaries of the territorial parish in which he resides is a non-territorial parish. He is registered at the non-territorial parish and considers that his spiritual home. In fact, I don’t think he has ever set foot inside the territorial parish church. In his case, which is his “official parish?”

 

[Br.Rich_SFO]

What do you do in my case, when 3 parishes have ‘boundaries’ that overlap where I live?

I attended all 3 parishes when I came back to the church, and then picked the one I felt most comfortable. That’s where I go to mass, that’s the parish I belong to and that’s where I receive the sacraments. IMO, that’s my parish.

And Eduardo should go to whatever church he’s most comfortable, and not worry about the closer parish.

It’s not possible to have ‘boundaries’ that overlap between territorial parishes. It is possible between an ethnic parish and a territorial parish and an ethnic parish or a Latin and an Eastern parish.

 

[A2SciTeach]

Thomas, are you in the area with one or more student parishes along with the charismatic non-territorial parish and the parish designated by boundary? If so, I believe you can register at any of them. Someone please correct me if I’m wrong on this.:ehh:

 

[zab]

It’s not possible to have ‘boundaries’ that overlap between territorial parishes. It is possible between an ethnic parish and a territorial parish and an ethnic parish or a Latin and an Eastern parish.

I don’t know about that. Our parish has some unusual boundaries. Some areas that our parish is responsible for extend to a town that is closer to a neighboring parish.

 

[psr13]

Well, dh and I are starting to go to a church that isn’t in our boundary I’m sure. However, it’s the closest EF. The church that is probably our technical one has a crucifix where Jesus looks like an alien. I won’t step foot in a place that would depict Him as such.

 

[FrDavid96]

Actually, a friend of mine finds himself in such a situation. Within the boundaries of the territorial parish in which he resides is a non-territorial parish. He is registered at the non-territorial parish and considers that his spiritual home. In fact, I don’t think he has ever set foot inside the territorial parish church. In his case, which is his “official parish?”

Rick,
In a case like that, it depends upon whether or not he’s “eligible” for the non-territorial parish. A non-territorial parish serves a given group of people, whatever that group might be (ethnic, spirituality [like Extraordinary form], college, are just a few typical examples). So long as he’s part of that group, he can join either that one or the territorial one. If not, then regardless of where he’s “registered” he’s still a member of the territorial parish.

To all:
It’s important for Catholics to understand this. Catholics cannot simply pick-and-choose which parish they are members. All Catholics are members of the parish in which they actually reside. Personal preference (even if for a very good reason), or proximity to a given parish, or “registration” does not make one a parishioner of that parish.

Oftentimes (not always) a parish will allow someone who isn’t technically a parishioner to register at the parish. While there’s nothing wrong with this in itself, it still has to be understood that membership in a given parish is not something which is chosen by the individual.

I’m a little concerned here that some readers of these posts might come away with the impression (or already have that impression) that because a parish allows you to “register” there, that means you are a parishioner–that is not at all the case.

Registration has nothing (repeat nothing) to do with membership in a parish.

I have come across some examples of overlapping territory, and some examples of “ambiguous” territory. Sometimes, especially in sparsely populated rural areas, the local diocese never actually defined the canonical territory of the parish–especially very old parishes where the territory has simply been “understood” for a long time. These cases are rare and for most readers here, they won’t apply. The original poster lives in Detroit–I highly doubt that the Archdiocese of Detroit does not have specific parish boundaries, especially within the city itself.