What is proper clothing for any Mass?

[Joysong]

Windmill:

I would say that you are letting the Puritanical/Calvinistic PoV affect your statement here (whether you realize it or not). Catholics do not look at the body as incidental and immaterial.

And I would say that you have grossly misunderstood Orion’s statement (whether you realize it or not). In your naivete or ignorance, you assumed he was puritanical; whereas, he was pointing out the same attitude that Jesus so often stressed in the scriptures. There were those who focused on externally washing cups, while neglecting to clean the inside of the cup.

Presenting our bodies adorned modestly or not is immaterial if the heart and mind is not prepared to worship and enter into the liturgy with loving attentiveness. You missed Orion’s point completely.

 

[KathleenElsie]

I would say that you are letting the Puritanical/Calvinistic PoV affect your statement here (whether you realize it or not). Catholics do not look at the body as incidental and immaterial. In fact, our entire sacramental system is based upon the realization that material things do matter…in fact, they help save us. We are not souls trapped in totally depraved bodies (as a Calvinist would say). Our bodies are an essential part of our being. As humans, we are both corporal and spiritual in nature. To deny that the physical plays a part in worship is denying our very nature.

Puritans and strict Calvinists will say that bodies (and anything in the material world) are depraved, and therefore any attempt to bring this physical world in conformity with holiness is vanity because it is unattainable and, therefore, not important to the life of a Christian. They stress the spiritual to the point that the material is a non-issue. The problem is that we are not trying to get away from our bodies, we are trying to sanctify our bodies. When we fast, when we work our bodies in service to the poor, when we adorn our bodies as Temples of the Holy Spirit, we are acknowledging a very Catholic idea: the material world is inextricably bound up in the redemptive work of Christ.

This is the guiding principle behind decorations, sacred music (Gregorian chant, polyphany, etc…), social justice, beautiful architecture, inspiring priestly vestments, etc… You bring the lordship and glory of Jesus Christ to bear on time and space. Not to mention that it is wonderful to look at. The window dressing (cloths etc) brings joy to the beholder and should not create embarrassment for anyone.

So, I’d say that dressing your best is a sign that you have a healthy image of yourself as a body/soul composite being. While you do not overemphasize the physical to the denial of the spiritual dimension, denying the physical and saying the spirit is all that matters will ultimately lead to a desolate view of humanity…not to mention boring.

What you say is so true. If what we wear to important functions were not important then there would be no “fancy” expensive clothing stores.

Clothing is a major form of social expression. It can show all emotions from happy to angry, from respect to disrespect and all that goes in between.

Play cloths at a playground are not disrespectful they are expected. Bathingsuits at the beach are expected as the norm.

Why is anything goes ok in any Catholic Church? IMHO it is not. So my family and many others that we know dress “up” for Mass out of respect for the company we are keeping.

 

[Orionthehunter]

We should come to Mass clothed in gratitude, humility, and contrition.

Gratitude for the 1) the Eucharist, 2) the Life, Passion and Death of our Saviour, 3) our many blessings from our Creator.

Humility for the invitation to be with the I AM.

Contrition for the ways we have disappointed and offended the I AM who loves us.

If we have interiorly clothed ourself with gratitude, humility, and contrition, our exterior clothes will be immaterial.

What you say is so true. If what we wear to important functions were not important then there would be no “fancy” expensive clothing stores.

Clothing is a major form of social expression. It can show all emotions from happy to angry, from respect to disrespect and all that goes in between.

Play cloths at a playground are not disrespectful they are expected. Bathingsuits at the beach are expected as the norm.

Why is anything goes ok in any Catholic Church? IMHO it is not. So my family and many others that we know dress “up” for Mass out of respect for the company we are keeping.

I don’t disagree that we should present ourselves properly to the Mass and that is not what I meant to imply. You are correct that clothing can be an expression of our interior heart.

However, IMO the more properly “interiorly” clothed I am at the Mass the more Christ-like will be the “lenses” that I see my fellow worshippers. Instead of seeing less “properly” exteriorly clothed fellow worshippers as someone to condemn or criticize, I see someone to pray for and/or to reach out to.

In the words of St. Francis, “Always preach the Gospel. Use words when necessary.”

There is another thread discussing the merits of the Billy Joel song “Only the Good Die Young”. One of the line says something to the effect “even though the mother didn’t like me, did she ever say a prayer for me?” There is an old saying “Before talking to a friend about God, talk to God about your friend.” To make it relevant to this thread, “Before talking about another person, talk to God about this person.”

 

[Windmill]

Orion,

I agree with you. We should never let the exterior stifle the interior spirit. Then we become Pharisees. There are many out there who are ritualistic and into, what my pastor calls, “religious games”. I think it can best be summed up in this statement: the exterior can move the interior, the interior can be manifest in the exterior, and don’t presume on another’s interior based on their exterior.

My point about Puritanism is not to sit in condemnation, and I can see that you understand what I was saying. My point is to say that there is this influence out there, and we shouldn’t let it disrupt our view of human nature which is both corporate and spiritual.

Great discussion!

 

[The_Truthinator]

I go to daily Mass, and so my ‘nice’ shirts run out quickly. What’s more, where I live, it’s 95 degrees with a lot of humidity and I usually walk to Mass, anyway. Because of this, I usually find myself in short kakis and a collared shirt (sometimes wrinkled). Today, I wasn’t even expecting to go because of student registration, but surprisingly my mom noticed there was enough time and dropped me off–in basketball shorts, crocs, and a T-shirt. Sometimes we just can’t help such things. I agree it’s modesty and intention that counts, however. Just be glad the people are there, whatever their reason.

 

[paramedicgirl]

If you ever go to an SSPX chapel, this is considered proper dress for Mass. I took this photo of their dress code when I was there in June for my brother’s funeral. Most of our family followed the dress code to a T, even though they don’t attend the SSPX themselves, but there were two low cut dresses in the crowd that were not appropriate. Every woman wore a head covering, even the born again Christians who were there. My sister and I bought three meters of black lace and cut the cloth into head coverings the night before the funeral.

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)

 

[KathleenElsie]

If you ever go to an SSPX chapel, this is considered proper dress for Mass. I took this photo of their dress code when I was there in June for my brother’s funeral. Most of our family followed the dress code to a T, even though they don’t attend the SSPX themselves, but there were two low cut dresses in the crowd that were not appropriate. Every woman wore a head covering, even the born again Christians who were there. My sister and I bought three meters of black lace and cut the cloth into head coverings the night before the funeral.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c156/paramedicgirl/DSC00012-2.jpg

Wish everyone would remember this.

 

[Philothea53]

Wish everyone would remember this.

I sometimes wonder if I could ‘get away with’ posting something like this at my church. Heck, I couldn’t even put up a small flyer about praying at the local abortion mill (with a beautiful picture of our Lady of Guadalupe on it) on first Saturdays. It was taken down weekly. A dress code flyer wouldn’t go over well, I’m sure.

 

[GrandpaD]

I have lived in Italy for 15 years and we always dressed in our best clothes out of respect for our Lord and Savior. Men wore suits and ties and women wore dresses. We are visiting His house and we should be in our best and most modest clothes. Would we go to a job interview wearing the things some people go to Mass wearing? Would we go to a wedding or a funeral wearing our jogging shorts? Think about kneeling before God with your backside showing, not to mention the people behind you. Is that respectful? I don’t think so. It is not a matter of judging, it is a matter of respect for yourself and above all for the Eucharist and for God and Jesus Christ. You have come to worship and you should prepare yourselves to worship, not to go workout after Mass. Also, keeping the Sabbath Day holy is a commandment of God, which means not doing the normal work on Sunday. It means resting, and studying scripture and visiting family and friends and the sick. On Sunday you should be thinking “what would Jesus do?” I doubt He would be working out at the gym or attending fairs or carnivals, or shopping, or doing anything to mar the holiness of the Sabbath Day. This is a special day and our place of worship is a holy place dedicated to the worship of God.
It should be treated as a very special and holy place.

 

[SeekerJen]

If you ever go to an SSPX chapel, this is considered proper dress for Mass. I took this photo of their dress code when I was there in June for my brother’s funeral. Most of our family followed the dress code to a T, even though they don’t attend the SSPX themselves, but there were two low cut dresses in the crowd that were not appropriate. Every woman wore a head covering, even the born again Christians who were there. My sister and I bought three meters of black lace and cut the cloth into head coverings the night before the funeral.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c156/paramedicgirl/DSC00012-2.jpg

Why are slacks considered immodest for women? Also, why is there no dress code for men?

I doubt that modestly cut and properly fitted women’s trousers are likely to be an occasion of sin for the average male (although I could be wrong, guys feel free to chime in). Pair it with a top that is not tightly fitted and a pair of dress shoes, and what’s wrong with that?

 

[Malcolm_McLean]

Why are slacks considered immodest for women? Also, why is there no dress code for men?

I doubt that modestly cut and properly fitted women’s trousers are likely to be an occasion of sin for the average male (although I could be wrong, guys feel free to chime in). Pair it with a top that is not tightly fitted and a pair of dress shoes, and what’s wrong with that?

Real women are not pornography. Looking at real woman who is scantily dressed is a very different experience to seeing the same woman under artificial conditions designed to titillate.
However most men are more interested in the women than in the Blessed Sacrament. Modesty really has to be pretty modest for this not to be the case.

 

[Sister_Marie]

If you truly believe what you wrote about the Great I AM which was beautiful & matches my sentiments THEN your exterior clothing & deportment will match what you believe. How you dress & act directly affects the way you believe, meditate & pray.
If we truly believe that Jesus is Present, body,soul,humanity &divinty in the Blessed Sacrament how could the way we dress for Mass NOT be important. Clean clothes that cover what should be covered. Be aware of the other persons who are also attending Mass. “Will my attire (or lack of) be distracting to them?”
I will even more strongly about the behavior or rather the lack of good behavior both before & after Mass. If you choose not to send time talking to Our Lord who at these sacred moments is now enthroned in our hearts AT LEAST refrain from talking out of respect for those who cherish these precious moments.
Our Lord told Sister Faustina that when He comes to the soul in Holy Communion His hands are full of graces that He wishes to bestow of it. But I am ignored, the soul finds so many other things to be distracted by. I am treated as a dead object."
I attend Mass daily. THere seems not to be quite as many people who appear to forget why they came to Mass. WHY
so that our hearts may touch the Sacred Heart of Jesus. Our own hearts at these moments are entwined. Are melted together as the wax of two burning candles. For the 10 minutes or so that Jesus is actually present in us we experience Heaven. We are actually united to the Holy Trinity. Can you imagine WE TOUCH GOD!!! Maybe if more people really understood what is happening at Mass we wouldn’t have to talk about clothing or behavior. WHERE ARE OUR SHEPERDS? WHere are our priests that need to be our teachers.
I find myself almost in tears at having to attend Mass at my parish. The lack of respect for Our Lord’s Presence, homilies that say nothing, the distraction… Even at the Abbey, which once was a bastion or respect for Our Lord & the Liturgies noise & commotion reign supreme. HOwever, the celebration of the Mass is so beautiful… I finally found a way to handle the after Mass distractions. I preset my MP3 player with Eucharistic songs & tuck away a pair of ear plugs. When everyone is leaving with all of their lack of care for the Lord who would like to spend these precious moments with them > I can sit down, turn on the music, close my eyes & be wrapped in the arms of the Lord.
I don’t know about anyone else but there is no way I would have made it thru life without His daily Presence. I have survived a heart attack, burst anyuerism which required brain surgery, a deseased agll bladder which shut down my liver (thhe second time I was told I probably wouldn’t make it) and then cancer.
All of this happened in ten years. NOw I am in complete leg braces because of my knees. I own a stained glass company which requires I climb ladders & stand for hours on my scaffolding. I go to Mass & borrow the Lord’s knees for the day.
He keeps me going. Oh how I long for the day that our priests would no longer be afraid to actually teach & talk about the Lord.
God bless,
Sister Marie

 

[MrsMW]

The majority of the SSPX priests and the folks that go to the chapels will tell you that it is a sin to wear pants if you are a woman. This is not just for Mass but for going to the market as well. They say it is a sin to wear men’s clothing. My friend who used to be in the SSPX was a volunteer at the girls camp and they all had to wear long skirts even on a hike. The SSPX in europe isn’t under the influence of the puritans so they don’t say some of the stuff that the folks do over here.

As a Byzantine Catholic I have to say that the level of dress is much better than at the rank and file Latin rite Catholic church. Shorts however are not the norm. Anytime your liturgy is well done and pulls the Catholic up to God you will see the majority of people start dressing better.

To the comment that the protestants put us to shame is no longer the case with the rise of non-denominational casual churches. (I am an ex-protestant) Maybe we should look to the Eastern Orthodox and the Mormons for a little inspiration!

 

[SeekerJen]

Real women are not pornography. Looking at real woman who is scantily dressed is a very different experience to seeing the same woman under artificial conditions designed to titillate.
However most men are more interested in the women than in the Blessed Sacrament. Modesty really has to be pretty modest for this not to be the case.

Um…no offense intended, but how does that answer my questions? As a real woman, I understand that I am not pornography and thus do not dress as such. I still do not understand how modestly cut women’s trousers are less modest than a skirt. I would argue that skirts sometimes draw more attention, as I nearly always get stared at and sometimes hit on when I wear a skirt (and no, I don’t wear miniskirts, all of my skirts are at least knee-length and A-line cut or circle skirts). I don’t think that women should not wear skirts, but it should be acknowledged that an attractive woman in a skirt will probably draw as much attention as the same woman in a pair of palazzo style (loose) pants.

I also don’t understand why the modesty strictures are only posted for women. Is it okay for men to wear shorts? How about very snug trousers that display front bulges? Shirts unbuttoned halfway down the chest? Large jewelry? Lots of cologne?

 

[MrsMW]

Um…no offense intended, but how does that answer my questions? As a real woman, I understand that I am not pornography and thus do not dress as such. I still do not understand how modestly cut women’s trousers are less modest than a skirt. I would argue that skirts sometimes draw more attention, as I nearly always get stared at and sometimes hit on when I wear a skirt (and no, I don’t wear miniskirts, all of my skirts are at least knee-length and A-line cut or circle skirts). I don’t think that women should not wear skirts, but it should be acknowledged that an attractive woman in a skirt will probably draw as much attention as the same woman in a pair of palazzo style (loose) pants.

I also don’t understand why the modesty strictures are only posted for women. Is it okay for men to wear shorts? How about very snug trousers that display front bulges? Shirts unbuttoned halfway down the chest? Large jewelry? Lots of cologne?

At the parish near me where they say the Latin Indult Mass the priest has a sign up that tells both men and women to dress properly. He is not the norm.
I have been told the reason they bug women about clothes is that men are visual and women are not. It seems to me that this takes some of the blame off men to control themselves.

 

[SeekerJen]

At the parish near me where they say the Latin Indult Mass the priest has a sign up that tells both men and women to dress properly. He is not the norm.
I have been told the reason they bug women about clothes is that men are visual and women are not. It seems to me that this takes some of the blame off men to control themselves.

Thank goodness for that priest!

I’ve always found the “women are not visual” thing to be rather unsound at best. Recently, I had the misfortune to be walking behind a good-looking man wearing extremely tight trousers. It was extremely hard not to look at his bum. I can’t imagine being a hormonal 14-year-old girl seated behind a man thus-attired through an entire Mass.

 

[MrsMW]

Thank goodness for that priest!

I’ve always found the “women are not visual” thing to be rather unsound at best. Recently, I had the misfortune to be walking behind a good-looking man wearing extremely tight trousers. It was extremely hard not to look at his bum. I can’t imagine being a hormonal 14-year-old girl seated behind a man thus-attired through an entire Mass.

I have found the same thing. I am not turned on by these guys just shocked. It is like someone looking at the accident on the side of the freeway. I can’t believe for a moment that the man was all that comfortable! Yuck!

I know a gay man who says he thinks men who wear pants that tight are gay. Maybe if I had enough guts I would ask the man if he was gay based on his tight clothes! I am sure that the man would be horrified to be called a homosexual!)

 

[NancyS]

OK, I get the women dressing properly, although in today’s world I have no problem wearing dress pants or dresses/skirts to Mass. I do wonder about this covered shoulders issue, which is new to me. My church finest is nice attire but in 95 degree summers, I have very many sleeveless tops (NOT tank tops mind you, dressy silk tops) that are in no way exposing. So what is it with the shoulders that has people upset? Please explain the impurity of shoulders??? Thanks!

 

[laskowski]

It has been 100 degrees in Florida and I went to mass monday morning in levi shorts and of cours a shirt… I think God was happy that I was there.

 

[MrsMW]

OK, I get the women dressing properly, although in today’s world I have no problem wearing dress pants or dresses/skirts to Mass. I do wonder about this covered shoulders issue, which is new to me. My church finest is nice attire but in 95 degree summers, I have very many sleeveless tops (NOT tank tops mind you, dressy silk tops) that are in no way exposing. So what is it with the shoulders that has people upset? Please explain the impurity of shoulders??? Thanks!

I don’t think what you are talking about is bad. I live in southern California and it is over a hundred many days in the summer. I would never wear shorts to church but a nice sleeveless blouse I would.

Some people just get carried away with rules. I think some of it is a backlash against the modern Brittany Spears outfits. They have gone to the extreme against the culture of immodesty.