What is so wrong with the hymn "Gift of Finest Wheat"?

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One song I refuse to sing is Lord of the Dance.
The verse about the devil on your back always hit the time when we were going to receive communion.
But, that is off topic.
 
I think the idea behind the more modern-style hymns is that the whole congregation is supposed to be participating, right? Active conscious participation, and all that. I believe that one thing about “Gift of Finest Wheat” is that it is one of those melodies with a lot of skips, and sometimes people think that the high “D” is a little high for many in the pews. Maybe that’s why some people don’t like it. I think OEW has a lot more tricky skips and rhythmic things in it, though. Older hymns tend to have more step-wise motion, rather than big skips / intervals in the melody.
 
I don’t think there is anything wrong with it. I think in some parishes its over used.
 
As it is written, “There is nothing new under the sun”, I would imagine that people have complained about songs ever since the first song.

Too old, too new, too catchy, too mundane, too direct from the psalms, too changed from the psalms, too (whatever).

Maybe what is “so wrong with the hymn…” is us, we, God’s family, can be a bunch of cantankerous complainers, can’t we?

By the way, I include me in the we since all of us are part of God’s family.

You even have some saying that this one or that one is not a member of God’s family because they don’t believe the right thing, they don’t follow the right way of worshipping, they don’t have the right reverence, they do or don’t (whatever) when it is clearly written that God is supposed to have said, “Let US make man (mankind, not just male) in Our Image and…”.

Like it or not, we are all brothers and sisters to each other in being human and with God becoming One of us in the Incarnation, He became the Brother of ALL of us.
 
Ok, the words bother me in this hymn.
“You satisfy the Hungry Heart with Gift of Finest Wheat,”
First of all, it’s the body of Christ, not just wheat that satisfies and it satisfies spiritually, not from a “hungry heart” sappy persepective.
Then, look at the words
“Do not one cup, one loaf declare Our oneness in the Lord?”
That seems backwards to me. We are able to receive communion because we share the same beliefs. So, the being “in communion” comes first. It isn’t the receiving that creates the oneness. Also, communion is the body and blood of Christ, not the cup and loaf.
Other than that, the song is just sappy sounding.
 
Regarding the other song, “Taste and See”, my problem with that song is that it is used out of context. It is often used as a communion song. But, if you read the bible, you will see that the context is directing people to trust God - experience God’s ways. The bible verse isn’t referring at all to Holy Communion. Also, the word, “taste” in other languages and cultures doesn’t mean the same thing it means in English. It has more of a “try this” connotation.
 
Regarding the other song, “Taste and See”, my problem with that song is that it is used out of context. It is often used as a communion song. But, if you read the bible, you will see that the context is directing people to trust God - experience God’s ways. The bible verse isn’t referring at all to Holy Communion. Also, the word, “taste” in other languages and cultures doesn’t mean the same thing it means in English. It has more of a “try this” connotation.
While it might seem out of context to you, this psalm has long been associated with the Eucharist and is in no way out of place as a communion hymn. In the Byzantine Divine Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts, the pre-communion hymn is "O, taste and see, taste and see that the Lord is good, that the Lord is good. Allelluia, Alleluia, Alleluia. " I don’t know if this is universal Melkite practice, but the Melkite priest would say, as he gave the Eucharist to young children, “Taste and see that the Lord is good.”
 
First of all, it’s the body of Christ, not just wheat that satisfies and it satisfies spiritually,
It is a metaphor.

I realize that we must always be on guard against the watering down of our belief in the real presence, but Christ himself used similar metaphors and the church has always done so.
 
As it is written, “There is nothing new under the sun”, I would imagine that people have complained about songs ever since the first song.

Too old, too new, too catchy, too mundane, too direct from the psalms, too changed from the psalms, too (whatever).

Maybe what is “so wrong with the hymn…” is us, we, God’s family, can be a bunch of cantankerous complainers, can’t we?

By the way, I include me in the we since all of us are part of God’s family.
Permit me to quibble with you just a bit. Among all of the works of art, literature, music, some have stood the test of time and many, many more have not. The ones that survive do so because there is something in them that resonates with the human mind. Some of it is sensory. Some of it conceptual. Some of it meets a “test of symmetry”, that has a resonance we can’t quite explain, like the “golden mean” for example.

One of my favorite movie scenes was in “Amadeus” when old Solieri asked the priest if he remembered a particular tune. The priest listened and said “no, he didn’t”. Solieri said “I wrote that”. Then Solieri asked him if he recognized another. “Oh yes! The priest said and hummed along. Is that yours?” “No” said Solieri, “that is Mozart’s”.

Why are Mozart’s works remembered and still heard while many, many composers have been forgotten? If I were an expert I could answer better than the following, but it is my understanding that there is something about the way Mozart put melodies together that the mind follows, almost anticipating the next notes, but then being pleasantly surprised if there is a variation that still “rings” with what was anticipated, but in a different way, evoking an aesthetic response. There is an “aha! That’s what came next!” to it.

In literature, some survives while most doesn’t. Why is that? Because the ones that survive manage to communicate something that resonates at a very deep level, whether emotionally, philosophically or psychologically or all of them.

When “change” comes to anything (like church music) some good things are written, but most of it is really not worthy of long preservation. And it really is true of church music. Maybe the music director has the congregation sing “song A”. If it really flows and almost makes you want to hum it later, it’s likely something pretty old. It has stood the test of time, and that’s why it’s in a modern hymnal. If we sing 'song B" and it’s hard work in some way…notes too high, too many sudden transitions that don’t seem “necessitated” by what went before, an uninspiring melody, it will inevitably be something written in the 1970s or 1980s, and by a small handful of people that suddenly got commissioned to write a whole boatload of songs. And the result was fairly predictable. Some of it is fairly good, and a whole lot of it isn’t.

100 years from now, will anybody know who Marty Haugen or Dan Shutte or the St. Louis Jesuits were? Hard to know, but one tends to doubt it. But they will know who Mozart is, and they will still sing some of those hymns put to catchy old Irish or Scottish or German melodies. And they will still probably sing some of the Old Protestant “greats” we find in our hymnbooks along with the rest. They have stood the test of time and are worthy of their place. Some newer hymns will too, but not many.

Personally, I think it’s high time the U.S. Catholic hymnals were weeded out. The Church is not a 1970s time capsule dedicated to the preservations of faux folk music. Time to move on.
 
Hey everyone. What is so wrong with they hymn called “Gift of Finest Wheat”. It’s one of my favorites but I’ve heard plenty of complaints about it over the years.

Here it is on Youtube. Lyrics are in the description.

youtube.com/watch?v=DvPCjVWFXJw
I have no problem with the words.

I don’t particularly like the melody. I think it makes much of the Haugen and Haas music seem almost classical in comparison.
 
Gift of Finest Wheat, composed by Robert Kreutz, was the theme song for the 1976 International Eucharistic Congress in Philadelphia.
 
Regarding the other song, “Taste and See”, my problem with that song is that it is used out of context. It is often used as a communion song. But, if you read the bible, you will see that the context is directing people to trust God - experience God’s ways. The bible verse isn’t referring at all to Holy Communion. Also, the word, “taste” in other languages and cultures doesn’t mean the same thing it means in English. It has more of a “try this” connotation.
It has always been used as a communion song, or in Latin, a communion antiphon. It has been a traditional communion antiphon for hundreds of years and is the official Proper for the communion hymn in the Graduale Romanum. I posted it earlier.
Gustate et videte, quoniam suavis est Dominus: beatus vir, qui sperat in eo.
In the psalm, it is seen as a prophecy of what God will leave us.

I trust that the Church fathers that saw fit to include it as a communion antiphon hundreds of years ago knew what they were doing.
 
I just did a quick check; there is a musical setting written in neumes for Gustate et Videte (“Taste and See”, Ps. 33(34)) in the antiphonary of Saint Gall, dating back to the late 9th century.

The association of “Taste and See” with communion clearly isn’t a recent invention. It’s at least 1000 years old.
 
I can live with lyrics that border on the insipid if the melody is good.

It is difficult for me to think of a more boring melody than this hymn. It just wanders around. Some melodies virtually invite you to sing them. Some require that you work hard to make yourself sing them. This one is of the latter sort.
I tend to feel the same way. If the melody is “boring” as you well put it, I always wonder why we just can’t recite it. I don’t want to fall asleep during Mass.

Or have it sung as a Latin chant, if it’s indeed Scriptural-based.
 
I just did a quick check; there is a musical setting written in neumes for Gustate et Videte (“Taste and See”, Ps. 33(34)) in the antiphonary of Saint Gall, dating back to the late 9th century.

The association of “Taste and See” with communion clearly isn’t a recent invention. It’s at least 1000 years old.
Hmm. Learn something new everyday. Thanks for the research.
 
Gift of Finest Wheat, composed by Robert Kreutz, was the theme song for the 1976 International Eucharistic Congress in Philadelphia.
I guess this isn’t too kind of me, but 1976? I think it’s time we put it in the can and archive it. Centuries from now people can open it, play it as part of a cultural study of the late 20th Century. Quite possibly it will aid some scholar in achieving some insight into that era.
Maybe if they wrapped the can in some of the burlap they used for posters in the sanctuary, it would aid in that endeavor.
 
I guess this isn’t too kind of me, but 1976? I think it’s time we put it in the can and archive it. Centuries from now people can open it, play it as part of a cultural study of the late 20th Century. Quite possibly it will aid some scholar in achieving some insight into that era.
Maybe if they wrapped the can in some of the burlap they used for posters in the sanctuary, it would aid in that endeavor.
The words “Gift of Finest Wheat” come from psalm 80(81). Used for the Introit on Trinity Sunday:

“Cibavit eos, ex adipe frumenti, alleluia et de petra melle saturavit eos, alleluia, alleluia, alleluia”, translated in a modern translation (New revised standard version, Catholic edition) to: “I would feed you with the finest of the wheat, and with honey from the rock I would satisfy you.” (not including the alleluias). Also in the Saint Gall antiphonary (9th Century). I can’t speak about the rest of the hymn (haven’t seen the words) but clearly the author was inspired by the palms which of course form the core of the Propers for the mass.

One can quibble about the translation. One can quibble about the rest of the lyrics. One can quibble about the melody. But the psalm verse itself is timeless.
 
While I’ve heard many complaints about other hymns, “Gift of Finest Wheat” is actually one of the few “newer” hymns that rarely (if ever) receive complaints - at least in the the “real” world. But this thread is actually the first time I’ve read of any kind of problem with it.

I don’t mind the hymn. It’s not my favorite, but it has a pleasant-enough melody and most people can sing it. The congregations at the parishes where I sing usually don’t have a problem with it. The only “problem” I heard from my voice students and others in the pews was the tendency to do a lot of scooping with the piece because of how it’s composed. The scooping can make it sound really cheesy, but you can make any melody, even the most beautiful, sound cheesy and trite when you scoop. That can be remedied, though, as I cured that habit with my students. 😛
 
I never found a problem with the hymn. Like some have mentioned, I am not a fan of the jump from the A to the high D in the verses. I always thought that was a little odd. There are plenty of other hymns that we can find way more problematic than this one.
 
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