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Flor
Guest
The entire World is now focused on the unfolding news of Priest’s sexual abuse and Bishop’s cover ups. What should Pope Francis do to change the Culture of Debauchery, and what has caused it in the first place ?
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Lee1
Guest
The cause, mans concupiscence provides the tinder gladly lit by the devil.
Im sure our cries of disgust and condemnation will help with the firewalls necessary for containment.
Im sure our cries of disgust and condemnation will help with the firewalls necessary for containment.
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poche
Guest
The cause in the first place is not willing to live the chastity that one promised to live.
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Flor
Guest
Sin, lack of chastity, the Devil - all are part of it. But I am looking for reasons beyond these. Because many of the Priests, and Bishops, surely started out with good hearts and intended to serve God with their entire lives. Something must have happened, a defining moment when they turned into a monster.
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OmnesBonum
Guest
The priesthood is to be held in the greatest honor, and we must not believe every story that is told about the clergy especially: Against a priest receive not accusation: but under two or three witnesses. Them that sin (by making accusations against priests), reprove before all: that the rest also may have fear. (1 Timothy 5:19-20)
See also: Chicago archdiocese wins claim against false sex abuse allegations | America Magazine
Also see the fruits that this revenge movement has grown: Priest attacked in church; assailant cited abuse scandal | National Catholic Reporter
www.theguardian.com
A member of the clergy who did commit a sin (any sin) is explained by the fact that all humans are sinners, and the more someone is united with God (who is goodness) the more they will be pulled to evil.
Sin of church members or clergy also is a proof of the true church:
See also: Chicago archdiocese wins claim against false sex abuse allegations | America Magazine
Also see the fruits that this revenge movement has grown: Priest attacked in church; assailant cited abuse scandal | National Catholic Reporter
Ireland votes by landslide to legalise abortion
Leo Varadkar vows legal terminations by end of year after huge vote for change
www.theguardian.com
Also, remember that most claimed “incidents” happened not now, but many years or decades in the past.
A member of the clergy who did commit a sin (any sin) is explained by the fact that all humans are sinners, and the more someone is united with God (who is goodness) the more they will be pulled to evil.
Sin of church members or clergy also is a proof of the true church:
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ConfusedLucy
Guest
I think more accountability and less covering up
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JackMcCoy
Guest
The cause? Some people fall victim to the devil.
There are no easier answers about what can be done.
I believe those who have victimized others should pay the price for their treachery.
Is their a culture of debauchery? I think there are a lot of priests who abused other people and some higher ups who covered it up. All should pay a price now. It is between them and God as to what they pay in the after life.
I do wonder sometimes if the Church should consider giving priests the option to marry. I also wonder if women should not be given the option to pursue the priesthood.
We need good men and good women to serve.
There are no easier answers about what can be done.
I believe those who have victimized others should pay the price for their treachery.
Is their a culture of debauchery? I think there are a lot of priests who abused other people and some higher ups who covered it up. All should pay a price now. It is between them and God as to what they pay in the after life.
I do wonder sometimes if the Church should consider giving priests the option to marry. I also wonder if women should not be given the option to pursue the priesthood.
We need good men and good women to serve.
I believe it is one of many cyclical evils that Satan and circumstances took advantage of.
For circumstances I do not pretend to know, there have been problems in some of the seminaries which lead to a culture of looking the other way beyond the seminaries. Children (and adults) have been taught to avoid “telling on each other” for trivial matters which leads to hesitation and reluctance to expose serious matters.
We have come to understand scandal to mean losing face for the Church.
For circumstances I do not pretend to know, there have been problems in some of the seminaries which lead to a culture of looking the other way beyond the seminaries. Children (and adults) have been taught to avoid “telling on each other” for trivial matters which leads to hesitation and reluctance to expose serious matters.
We have come to understand scandal to mean losing face for the Church.
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Limoncello4021
Guest
Pride, lust, greed. Pretty much all of the seven deadly sins.
Lack of sincere and deep prayer.
Evil companions.
Lack of serious and consistent examining of conscience and confession.
Force of habit.
Lack of sincere and deep prayer.
Evil companions.
Lack of serious and consistent examining of conscience and confession.
Force of habit.
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Seagull
Guest
I have been doing some research into Saint John Vianney -
The Patron Saint of all Parish priests.
Reading books - listening to lectures - movies - DVD items -
My answer would be - the lack of prayer.
‘Lazy good for nothing Priest pray only for one hour a day’ - says Father Rippenger.
A good priest prays 4 hours a day.
And you know how long you pray for - whoever is reading this.
Well, Saint John Vianney - battled with The Devil - all his priesthood life !
He said - if he had known - all the battles - that would ensue - with demonic forces -
before entering - into that town - Ars, France -
he would of died - right there - on the spot.
The Patron Saint of all Parish priests.
Reading books - listening to lectures - movies - DVD items -
My answer would be - the lack of prayer.
‘Lazy good for nothing Priest pray only for one hour a day’ - says Father Rippenger.
A good priest prays 4 hours a day.
And you know how long you pray for - whoever is reading this.
Well, Saint John Vianney - battled with The Devil - all his priesthood life !
He said - if he had known - all the battles - that would ensue - with demonic forces -
before entering - into that town - Ars, France -
he would of died - right there - on the spot.
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StarMapp
Guest
Seems out of character for him to say this.
In light of the work load in some parishes which includes driving to the sick, hospitals, etc., and some taking care of two parishes, I would find 4 hours a long time, and I love prayer. Hospitals by the time you get your ticket and parking area and then found the right elevator, may take a long time to find the individual. Just a thought. The late AB Sheen, if I’m not mistaken said he prayed an hour a day.
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otrrl
Guest
Monster. good word. I used that word myself the other day.
There are three aspects of the current sex abuse scandal.
The Church did not previously discourage homosexuals from entering the seminary. Homosexuality is characterized SOMETIMES by social immaturity, wherein the predator is focusing on children or others who cannot fight back, for whatever reason.
Clericalism is the evil P. Francis says needs to be eliminated in the Church – the abuse of POWER. Priests and bishops abused PEOPLE sexually and FINANCIALLY. Please don’t overlook the BILLIONS that are reported to have been paid to abuse victims. Those who weren’t abused sexually were abused financially.
The bishops lied to U.S Catholics in Dallas in 2002. They exempted themselves from the sexual abuse protocol because they TOLD US that they didn’t have the power to control other bishops, Baloney.
They should have called out the offending bishops and priests FOR THE SAKE OF THE CHURCH. There was nothing stopping them from doing so.
FURTHER, recall that Jesus said, render to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s. What did the bishops owe to “Caesar?” THERE WAS NOTHING that prevented them from making civil complaints about priests and bishops who were suspected of sexual abuse. BY NOT REPORTING TO CIVIL AUTHORITIES, the other bishops became ACCOMPLICES AFTER THE FACT to those crimes.
homosexuality, clericalism (abuse of power),silence, financial payoffs, cronyism (not turning in their buddy bishop), irresponsibility in not screening candidates for the priesthood – it just goes on and on.
There are three aspects of the current sex abuse scandal.
The Church did not previously discourage homosexuals from entering the seminary. Homosexuality is characterized SOMETIMES by social immaturity, wherein the predator is focusing on children or others who cannot fight back, for whatever reason.
Clericalism is the evil P. Francis says needs to be eliminated in the Church – the abuse of POWER. Priests and bishops abused PEOPLE sexually and FINANCIALLY. Please don’t overlook the BILLIONS that are reported to have been paid to abuse victims. Those who weren’t abused sexually were abused financially.
The bishops lied to U.S Catholics in Dallas in 2002. They exempted themselves from the sexual abuse protocol because they TOLD US that they didn’t have the power to control other bishops, Baloney.
They should have called out the offending bishops and priests FOR THE SAKE OF THE CHURCH. There was nothing stopping them from doing so.
FURTHER, recall that Jesus said, render to Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s. What did the bishops owe to “Caesar?” THERE WAS NOTHING that prevented them from making civil complaints about priests and bishops who were suspected of sexual abuse. BY NOT REPORTING TO CIVIL AUTHORITIES, the other bishops became ACCOMPLICES AFTER THE FACT to those crimes.
homosexuality, clericalism (abuse of power),silence, financial payoffs, cronyism (not turning in their buddy bishop), irresponsibility in not screening candidates for the priesthood – it just goes on and on.
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Gab123
Guest
What’s probably worse is the debauchery among the laity, most of whom don’t go to mass, don’t follow Church teaching on sexuality, aren’t open to life, and live in sin. And then one wonders why there’s a priest shortage? And then the many who think themselves faithful spending more time criticizing, pointing fingers and accusing, rather than actually doing anything spiritually constructive. It’s not any individual’s fault or responsibility-- it’s everybody’s fault and responsibility. At Fatima the BVM didn’t ask for protests, pointing of fingers and shaking of heads, but rather prayer, sacrifice, reparation and faithfulness to the daily Rosary. Satan is all about causing division and hatred, and it’s what we are seeing in the Church today among Catholics: division. Catholics demanding that the pope resign takes the cake. Prayer and fasting is what Scripture calls for…
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QwertyGirl
Guest
For many years and many generations, the priesthood has been a great hiding place for troubled men. Unfortunately, many of these men no doubt knew something was wrong with them. Either they weren’t able to articulate it so they didn’t really know what the problem was, or they did know and (with the best of intentions) thought the priesthood would be a good way to ignore issues and make them go away. They would enter the priesthood, do their best, but the issue didn’t go away. They eventually act out. The Church protected them, and a vicious cycle was born.
My heart really goes out to the majority of priests who don’t fall into the category of priests referenced above. These must be very difficult times for them, indeed. Hopefully, the Church will turn the corner and figure this out. The biggest problem is secrecy and hiding. Sunshine is th best disinfectant.
I will also note that, as an adult, when I learned of the two priests in our parish who had been abusing kids for years, me and my siblings weren’t surprised. Even as little kids, we knew thse guys were creepy. We didn’t know why we thought that, or what it meant, but we definitely knew something was “off” about them. Surley we weren’t the only ones. Not sure how that should be handled…there are probably people with the “creep factor” who aren’t really creepy, but who are just different.
My heart really goes out to the majority of priests who don’t fall into the category of priests referenced above. These must be very difficult times for them, indeed. Hopefully, the Church will turn the corner and figure this out. The biggest problem is secrecy and hiding. Sunshine is th best disinfectant.
I will also note that, as an adult, when I learned of the two priests in our parish who had been abusing kids for years, me and my siblings weren’t surprised. Even as little kids, we knew thse guys were creepy. We didn’t know why we thought that, or what it meant, but we definitely knew something was “off” about them. Surley we weren’t the only ones. Not sure how that should be handled…there are probably people with the “creep factor” who aren’t really creepy, but who are just different.
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MaryT777
Guest
Unfortunately when I was in Nursing School at the University in the 80’s the thought at the time was that pedophilia could be “treated” or “cured” by various therapies. It wasn’t until a few years later the recidivism rate among pedophiles was so high that thought was no longer the norm.
The Catholic Church relied on this research and sent ANYONE to therapy charged with pedophilia, priests included.
Regretfully the Church failed when a priest offended again and was just shuffled off to another parish.
The Catholic Church relied on this research and sent ANYONE to therapy charged with pedophilia, priests included.
Regretfully the Church failed when a priest offended again and was just shuffled off to another parish.
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BlueMaxx
Guest
What is the cause?
Short answer…Original Sin…
Short answer…Original Sin…
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Seagull
Guest
If your truly interested in that quote - I can track it down - it’s on YouTube - and private mail you with the clip - etc -
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AlNg
Guest
There are several contributing factors. In IMHO, it would help to require all priests to marry, although allowing some exceptions. I don’t think that this would be a total cure, but I think it would help to alleviate things. And of course, the many other things mentioned should be put in place. Such as stricter regulations for entering the seminary, and stricter enforcement of seminary chastity rules and stricter oversight of bishops who fail to turn offenders over to the police.
That would be my humble (name removed by moderator)ut and contribution to this question.
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Lee1
Guest
I didn’t know that, thank you.
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