What is the difference in Protestants being "saved" and Catholic salvation?

[multitude]

That would make for a very impoverished spiritual life indeed. Imagine if i was adopted into a family but they never made it clear to me that i was truly a part of that family. I would always be left wondering if i really had a place to come home to. I would always feel on edge. Not a good way to live . Home should be a place where they will always receive me, no matter what. The Bible tells me that" The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. " If one cannot have confidence, then you are not living in victory and you will not truly live an abundant life as Jesus promised it. Jesus said “My sheep know My voice and they follow Me”. King David knew that he was saved and never doubted. That is true humility. But now we have a better covenant than David. A Muslim can never know for sure that he is saved unless he becomes a martyr for Islam. This is a poor deel. I thank God that i can know.

Trouble with the assumption of OSAS is, the corollary is that it just gives a license to do whatever you want, sin however you want. As James had said, faith without works is dead. Of course I’ve been told by Protestants before, “well that’s not really true faith, you were never saved in the first place, you weren’t really Christian”. No true Scotsman fallacy, much?

I would always feel on edge. Not a good way to live.

Jesus never promised comfort in this life. He’ll make it rain on both the just and the unjust.

“I have been saved, I am being saved, and I hope to be saved.”

This is a good summary. Conversion to a Catholic, is continuous, an everyday process.

 

[Starwarsfan2]

From a Lutheran standpoint , we are totally incapable of saving ourselves, Jesus satisfaction for our sins by dying and rising made atonement for sin and he offers salvation . justification is God s grace alone ( unearned resistible favor) manifest in the virgin birth , death on the cross and resurrection of Jesus received through faith alone ( a gift from God created in people’s hearts by the Holy Spirit by the Word and the Sacraments , a passive and personal knowledge of , belief in , acceptance of , and trust in the Gospel , the instrument that receives grace. ) in the atonement of Jesus . one is only justified when they receive the Gospel of Jesus not before . It is Monergistic , forensic , for whosoever will , through the means of grace and resistible .
As for works they are after justification, they are in sanctification, the natural result of faith , there absence would demonstrate that faith is absent , always they have there origin in God , not in human striving , we are commanded to obey the more law , and freely serve Christ and others .
One can lose salvation, but Jesus can save them .
Sactification continues until the second coming of Jesus and the resurrection of all in the future. The unbelieving will be cast into hell for eternity . The saved go into the new Heaven and Earth .
As a sorta off topic , I’m asking for prayers for my family , many of whom aren’t saved , I’m trying to witness to them , but it’s not easy .

 

[eazyduzit]

From a Lutheran standpoint , we are totally incapable of saving ourselves, Jesus satisfaction for our sins by dying and rising made atonement for sin and he offers salvation . justification is God s grace alone ( unearned resistible favor) manifest in the virgin birth , death on the cross and resurrection of Jesus received through faith alone ( a gift from God created in people’s hearts by the Holy Spirit by the Word and the Sacraments , a passive and personal knowledge of , belief in , acceptance of , and trust in the Gospel , the instrument that receives grace. ) in the atonement of Jesus . one is only justified when they receive the Gospel of Jesus not before . It is Monergistic , forensic , for whosoever will , through the means of grace and resistible .
As for works they are after justification, they are in sanctification, the natural result of faith , there absence would demonstrate that faith is absent , always they have there origin in God , not in human striving , we are commanded to obey the more law , and freely serve Christ and others .
One can lose salvation, but Jesus can save them .
Sactification continues until the second coming of Jesus and the resurrection of all in the future. The unbelieving will be cast into hell for eternity . The saved go into the new Heaven and Earth .
As a sorta off topic , I’m asking for prayers for my family , many of whom aren’t saved , I’m trying to witness to them , but it’s not easy .

Interesting how Catholics claim that protestants don’t agree, but this Pentecostal agrees with the Lutheran view as stated here. I agree that it is theoretically possible to lose salvation, but it would be very hard to do so. The Good Shepherd says He never loses any, no matter how far they stray. So i believe. Him.

 

[eazyduzit]

Trouble with the assumption of OSAS is, the corollary is that it just gives a license to do whatever you want, sin however you want. As James had said, faith without works is dead. Of course I’ve been told by Protestants before, “well that’s not really true faith, you were never saved in the first place, you weren’t really Christian”. No true Scotsman fallacy, much?
TRUE SALVATION MAKES ONE MORE SENSITIVE TO SIN, NOT LESS. THE BIBLE SAYS WE ARE RULED BY LOVE, NOT LAW. HOW WAS THE LOST SON IN LUKE 15 DISCIPLINED? WAS IT WITH LAW OR LOVE? DO YOU THINK THAT ENCOURAGED HIM TO SIN MORE OR LESS?

Jesus never promised comfort in this life. He’ll make it rain on both the just and the unjust.
HE PROMISED AN ABUNDANT LIFE TO EVERY BELIEVER. HE PROMISED TO SEND THE COMFORTER, AND MUCH MORE,

This is a good summary. Conversion to a Catholic, is continuous, an everyday process.

I ALSO BELIEVE THAT I AM SAVED (MY SPIRIT) AM BEING SAVED DAILY (MY SOUL) WILL BE SAVED (IN THE BODY AT THE SECOND COMING)

 

[powerofk]

Here’s a few of the main differences:

Catholics believe that only the grace of God can save us. The grace of God pulls us toward the Catholic Church, and to baptism. Through baptism, we die to our previous life and become a new creation in Christ. We are made free from sin, but not free from temptation to sin. Remember, even Jesus was tempted to sin. And we are continually tempted. As such, many times a day, we ask ourselves whether we are going to follow Jesus or choose not to follow Jesus. A decision to follow Jesus isn’t a one-time event - it is a continuing lifetime event. If ever we choose not to follow Jesus, we may repent, ask Jesus for forgiveness (through the Sacrament of Confession), and follow Jesus once more. This means that we are saved through our baptism, but we continue to decide whether we want to remain saved through our continued actions, and will meet our final salvation when we die.

 

[multitude]

TRUE SALVATION MAKES ONE MORE SENSITIVE TO SIN, NOT LESS.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

THE BIBLE SAYS WE ARE RULED BY LOVE, NOT LAW. HOW WAS THE LOST SON IN LUKE 15 DISCIPLINED? WAS IT WITH LAW OR LOVE? DO YOU THINK THAT ENCOURAGED HIM TO SIN MORE OR LESS?

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_dilemma

HE PROMISED AN ABUNDANT LIFE TO EVERY BELIEVER. HE PROMISED TO SEND THE COMFORTER, AND MUCH MORE

Read Matthew 5:43-48

I ALSO BELIEVE THAT I AM SAVED (MY SPIRIT) AM BEING SAVED DAILY (MY SOUL) WILL BE SAVED (IN THE BODY AT THE SECOND COMING)

 

[IGotQuestions]

I ALSO BELIEVE THAT I AM SAVED (MY SPIRIT) AM BEING SAVED DAILY (MY SOUL) WILL BE SAVED (IN THE BODY AT THE SECOND COMING)

Why do you separate the body from the spirit?

 

[JMM1957]

Interesting how Catholics claim that protestants don’t agree, but this Pentecostal agrees with the Lutheran view as stated here. I agree that it is theoretically possible to lose salvation, but it would be very hard to do so. The Good Shepherd says He never loses any, no matter how far they stray. So i believe. Him.

The problem is, there are many who do work hard to do so. Not only is it theoretically possible, but more common than what you seem to think.

And if you are referring to John 6:34-40, Jesus was not saying you cannot lose your salvation, He was saying that if you come to Him he will not reject you. You can accept Him as your Lord and Saviour and He will accept you, but you must continue to live in a way that shows you are serious about your commitment to Him. You can fall away (through unrepentant sin) and not be in God’s favor. No matter how far away we may stray, God will be true to His Word and will accept us back, “IF” we are truly repentant.

 

[zz912]

Interesting how Catholics claim that protestants don’t agree, but this Pentecostal agrees with the Lutheran view as stated here. I agree that it is theoretically possible to lose salvation, but it would be very hard to do so. The Good Shepherd says He never loses any, no matter how far they stray. So i believe. Him.

If it’s only theoretically possible to lose your salvation, why did St. Paul write so many letters to fellow Christians commending them to continue to work out their salvation in fear and trembling? Why write the letters at all? If it’s only theoretical to lose our salvation, why is he adamant about how many different sins can damn us? Why did he say that he was unsure about his own salvation?

 

[zz912]

That would make for a very impoverished spiritual life indeed. Imagine if i was adopted into a family but they never made it clear to me that i was truly a part of that family. I would always be left wondering if i really had a place to come home to. I would always feel on edge. Not a good way to live . Home should be a place where they will always receive me, no matter what. The Bible tells me that" The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit that we are the children of God. " If one cannot have confidence, then you are not living in victory and you will not truly live an abundant life as Jesus promised it. Jesus said “My sheep know My voice and they follow Me”. King David knew that he was saved and never doubted. That is true humility. But now we have a better covenant than David. A Muslim can never know for sure that he is saved unless he becomes a martyr for Islam. This is a poor deel. I thank God that i can know.

1. Can you get to Heaven if you don’t love Jesus?
2. What is required of those who love Jesus?
3. What happens to those who do not perform the answer to #2 above?

 

[patmiron]

=IGotQuestions;13185612]If Catholics are Christians what are the steps they take to receive salvation?
Protestants believe Romans 10:9 & 10. Confess with your mouth and believe in your heart that Jesus is Lord and you shall be saved.

Here my friend is both a short answer and a more detailed reply. THANKS for asking

Catholics hold and always have that Salvation is a PROCESS not a single step.

The Process is centered around the Seven Sacraments

Baptism
Eucharist
Confirmation
Penance [Confession of our sins John 20:19-23]
Marriage
Holy Orders the priesthood extended from the time of Moses; now perfected
The Last rites

Each of which was Instituted By Christ either explicitly or implicitly Mt 16:015-19

Protestants hold very often to Once Saved Always Saved; Altar calls and the Sinners Prayer; none of which is biblically grounded when using the entire Bible.

Part of the difference is our different views of the necessity of Suffering.

Non-catholic s often take the position that Christ DID IT ALL, which is not biblical when using the entire New Testament.

Because GOD suffered so much for us Christ Himself TAUGHT that we too must expect to suffer in order to prove our love for Him.

Take Up your Cross and Follow Me

Phil.2: 8 “And being found in human form he humbled himself and became obedient unto death, even death on a cross Luke.9 :23 And he said to all, "If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me.Mark.8: 34 And he called to him the multitude with his disciples, and said to them, "If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross and follow me. Luke.9: 23 And he said to all, "If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. Luke.14: 7 Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple.” Matt.5: 19 “Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. “ Matt.19: 17 “And he said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? One there is who is good. If you would enter life, keep the commandments.”

Your question requires much further discussion but space is limited.

God Bless you!
Patrick

 

[zz912]

Protestants hold very often to Once Saved Always Saved; **Altar calls **and the Sinners Prayer; none of which is biblically grounded when using the entire Bible.

Which is ironic and funny since they deny having an altar.

 

[Faithdancer]

It never ceases to amaze me that, despite the documents from Vatican II and the official Church teachings on those documents vis a vis the subject of salvation, and despite even Pope Francis the First’s statements since his election, there are still Roman Catholics who insist that Protestants are denied salvation. Of course, on the other side, there are Protestants who insist that Roman Catholics are denied salvation, I believe both are equally in error and grievously so.

 

[JMM1957]

It never ceases to amaze me that, despite the documents from Vatican II and the official Church teachings on those documents vis a vis the subject of salvation, and despite even Pope Francis the First’s statements since his election, there are still Roman Catholics who insist that Protestants are denied salvation. Of course, on the other side, there are Protestants who insist that Roman Catholics are denied salvation, I believe both are equally in error and grievously so.

It just goes to show how unclear teaching can have an effect on generations of religious. I understand the Church has been better lately at clearing up some of the misconceptions, but there are still those members of certain age groups that are not hearing what the Church is saying, for whatever reason. Poor catechesis definitely can have long lasting devastating affects on a person.

 

[In_His_Grace]

It just goes to show how unclear teaching can have an effect on generations of religious. I understand the Church has been better lately at clearing up some of the misconceptions, but there are still those members of certain age groups that are not hearing what the Church is saying, for whatever reason. Poor catechesis definitely can have long lasting devastating affects on a person.

My wife is Roman Catholic (48 year old cradle Catholic, Catholic grade school/high school etc.) and to say that she is poorly catechized would be an understatement. How widespread would you say this problem is in Catholicism? What is the Catholic Church doing to address this issue?

Thanks

 

[zz912]

My wife is Roman Catholic (48 year old cradle Catholic, Catholic grade school/high school etc.) and to say that she is poorly catechized would be an understatement. How widespread would you say this problem is in Catholicism?

Rampant. Macaroni pictures and saint posterboard projects replaced religious education for at least the last 50 years. It’s doubtful most heard anything more than a variation of “God is love” over and over, with further context or instruction. It was abysmal.

What is the Catholic Church doing to address this issue?

Thanks

Veeeeeeerrrrryyyy slowly, it seems to be turning around. The younger priests appear to be more faithful, and seem to be preaching the full Gospel. Hopefully religious education starts improving as well. I expect to see even more improvement once the 60’s generation has passed on as the younger generations are more faithful.

 

[patmiron]

=In His Grace;13199557]My wife is Roman Catholic (48 year old cradle Catholic, Catholic grade school/high school etc.) and to say that she is poorly catechized would be an understatement. How widespread would you say this problem is in Catholicism? What is the Catholic Church doing to address this issue?

Thanks

Sadly your wife’s experience in more common than not.

A few years ago an new initiative termed the “THE NEW EVANGELAZATION” was introduced. It has taken many forms , depending on the Local Bishops Direction and the Parish priest response to it.

More than 20 years ago, Pope {Saint} John Paul II foresaw the need and tried various way’s to address this REAL problem. Father John A. Hardon S.J, who was a “Papal Leget” [emissary of and for the Pope] was asked to devise a course of Study for Mother Theresa of Calcutta’s nuns. Father did this and then expanded it to a NEW Lay Apostolate called the “Marian Catechist”; to teach. explain and defend when necessary our Cherished Catholic Faith.

I have been reaching our Catholic Faith for around 30 years, and am a trained and certified member of the Marian Catechist Lay Apostolate. I offer a TOTALLY FREE OF ALL COST home study e-mailed course; that I make available to anyone who desires to learn What we believe; why we believe it and hoe to explain and defend it. So if either you or the Mrs are interested just send me a private message.

This in now the 6th year of this for me retirement Ministry. Having co-taught RCIA for 3 years, my course covers MORE topics, all in far more depth, and I stress proving the evidence of our beliefs and practices. I also answer all Faith questions.

So while this does not SOLVE the BIG problem; we are at least doing something.

Thanks to the Holy Spirit, I have at present more than 130 people that I share our Faith with.

God Bless you, and thanks for asking!

Patrick

 

[patmiron]

=zz912;13196317]

1. Can you get to Heaven if you don’t love Jesus?

NOT by Love alone. John 3:5 has Jesus mandating Christian Baptism as the essential and necessary [NORMAL] first step on what is a PROCESS of meriting salvation. Mt. 19:17 tells us that Obedience to ALL of the 10 Commandments [which by the way are 10 categories of sins; not the entire list of them. And each category holds the potential for at least one “Mortal sin.” [which have the effect of separating one from the Love of Jesus]. READ 1 Jn. 1: 6-7; 1 Jn. 5:16-17 & John 20:19-23

1. What is required of those who love Jesus?

Salvation is a process. It begins with Sacramental Baptism’ and is then aided by the other sis Sacraments; each of which WAS instituted by Jesus to AID us in meriting His Salvation. Of these; The Sacrament of KNOWN forgiveness of sins[GOD’S desired and accepted WAY!] and the Most Holy Eucharist; Literally Jesus Himself; have an irreplaceable relevance and importance in this Process.

There is a GREAT deal more but space is limited.

As A FYI, I’m a trained and greatly experienced teacher of our Catholic Faith; now retired after about 30 years of Faith sharing; I offer A TOTALLY FREE OF ALL COST HOME STUDY e-mailed course. With a new Lesson mailed each Monday; and I answer all Faith questions is depth and with the evidence that proves our beliefs and practices.

The short story for your question is to 1. Be Baptized & 2 Die without any MORTAL sins not confessed and forgiven by a Priest as Jesus tells us in the passages I referenced above. There is more BUT…

1. What happens to those who do not perform the answer to #2 above?

Because God obligates Himself to offer at least sufficient grace so that everyone CAN know Him; grace which can be and OFTEN is refused; … One who is NOT Baptized AND therefore denies God through their OWN FAULT; [opportunities rejected]; and OR die NOT in the “Sate of God’s grace”; have chosen for THEMSELVES eternal Hell. Again this is the VERY SHORT version.

God Bless you,

Please consider my course; you’ll learn a great deal, and its backed up with the evidence of our faith. Just send me a private message my friend

PRAY much,

God Bless you,

Patrick

 

[In_His_Grace]

Thanks zz912 and Patrick. I appreciate both of you taking the time to respond to my questions.

Blessings

 

[SJacob7]

Catholics believe that anyone at all can go to Heaven, Catholic or Pentecostal, Unitarian or Jew, Muslim or agnostic. However, we believe that the only Way any of them get there is through Jesus Christ and by His Catholic Church…

Would it be a sin to not believe what you wrote? I mean, really, why even try to convert people to Catholicism if anyone can go to heaven. What’s the purpose?

Yes, heaven is through Jesus Christ. He died for all human salvation. But what do we need to do in order to receive this salvation? Scripture makes it very clear. You have to believe in Jesus. I don’t think Jew, Muslim or Agnostic and others believe in Jesus. Oh, they admit he lived, but they don’t believe in him. They don’t believe him when He says he is God’s son etc. Thus, I don’t see how they can be saved?

So if what you say is Catholic doctrine, am I sinning by not believing it???