What is the Gospel?

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I can certainly reject His will, as Adam & Eve did.
Adam and Eve had free will prior to the fall. I think you inherited the fallen nature of Adam with the inclination toward sin which is quite different. I did not know your will is stronger than God’s will? Therefore, you are sovereign over God.

The Word of God (Sacred Scripture)

What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means! For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.

You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? As indeed he says in Hosea,

“Those who were not my people I will call ‘my people,’
and her who was not beloved I will call ‘beloved.’”
“And in the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’
there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.’”

And Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: “Though the number of the sons of Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them will be saved, for the Lord will carry out his sentence upon the earth fully and without delay.” And as Isaiah predicted,

“If the Lord of hosts had not left us offspring,
we would have been like Sodom
and become like Gomorrah.”

The true light, which enlightens everyone, was coming into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. - John 1

:knight2::flowers::grouphug:
 
Adam and Eve had free will prior to the fall. I think you inherited the fallen nature of Adam with the inclination toward sin which is quite different. I did not know your will is stronger than God’s will? Therefore, you are sovereign over God.

The Word of God (Sacred Scripture)

What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God’s part? By no means! For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” So then it depends not on human will or exertion, but on God, who has mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.

You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles? As indeed he says in Hosea,

“Those who were not my people I will call ‘my people,’
and her who was not beloved I will call ‘beloved.’”
“And in the very place where it was said to them, ‘You are not my people,’
there they will be called ‘sons of the living God.’”

And Isaiah cries out concerning Israel: “Though the number of the sons of Israel be as the sand of the sea, only a remnant of them will be saved, for the Lord will carry out his sentence upon the earth fully and without delay.” And as Isaiah predicted,

“If the Lord of hosts had not left us offspring,
we would have been like Sodom
and become like Gomorrah.”

The true light, which enlightens everyone, was coming into the world. He was in the world, and the world was made through him, yet the world did not know him. He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him. But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God, who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. - John 1

:knight2::flowers::grouphug:
Adam & Eves’ wills were not stronger than God’s, either, of course, and yet He chose to let them have the freedom to decide their fate in spite of His will for them-that’s what free will is. Of course, as Catholics, we believe our wills were weakened by the fall but not so corrupted that they could no longer function. We could argue the doctrine of predestination forever-it’s been done long ago, of course, but the fact is that God wills none to perish and yet some will-according to the gospel.
 
To me, the Gospel is that Jesus brought glad tidings to the poor [in spirit], proclaims liberty to captives [of sin], the recovery of sight to the [spiritually] blind, and to let the [spiritually] oppressed go free.

that’s Good News to me . . . a sinner.
 
Adam & Eves’ wills were not stronger than God’s, either, of course, and yet He chose to let them have the freedom to decide their fate in spite of His will for them-that’s what free will is. Of course, as Catholics, we believe our wills were weakened by the fall but not so corrupted that they could no longer function. We could argue the doctrine of predestination forever-it’s been done long ago, of course, but the fact is that God wills none to perish and yet some will-according to the gospel.
The Predestination discussion thread is happening right now!

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=393580
 
Do you understand that just a few verses are actually interpreted for you as a Catholic?
Which ones are those then?
The majority of the Scirpture verses do not have official Catholic interpretations.
Basis for this conclusion?

And, would you say that it follows that, since there can be incorrect and correct interpretations of the Bible, that the Bible requires an authoritative interpreter?
 
Originally Posted by 2nd Adam
Do you understand that just a few verses are actually interpreted for you as a Catholic?
Which ones are those then?
Your Catholic and I am only catholic. Therefore, you should know the few verses that are dogmatically interperted for you as being Catholic. Nobody wants to be called a Cafeteria Catholic on this site if you catch my drift. Did you witness the last witch hunt on here?

http://ai.pricegrabber.com/pi/71/17/79/711779071_160.jpg
 
Your Catholic and I am only catholic. Therefore, you should know the few verses that are dogmatically interperted for you as being Catholic. Nobody wants to be called a Cafeteria Catholic on this site if you catch my drift. Did you witness the last witch hunt on here?

http://ai.pricegrabber.com/pi/71/17/79/711779071_160.jpg
Are you kidding me 2nd? You just stated that the Catholic Church “dogmatically interprets scripture” and only a few verses at that. I want to know what you think they are!
 
Are you kidding me 2nd? You just stated that the Catholic Church “dogmatically interprets scripture” and only a few verses at that. I want to know what you think they are!
I’m sure Matthew 16 is one of those verses! Maybe other Catholics can share which additonal Scriptures have dogmatic interpertatons?
 
I’m sure Matthew 16 is one of those verses! Maybe other Catholics can share which additonal Scriptures have dogmatic interpertatons?
I understand why you would not be able to quote them since you conveniently pass them over as not to meaning truth, you seem to ponder only the easy stuff.Carlan
 
I understand why you would not be able to quote them since you conveniently pass them over as not to meaning truth, you seem to ponder only the easy stuff.Carlan
I have read all of Adams post here and other threads and I have never seen him ponder only the easy stuff. I wonder where he has so much wisdom, but I know that it all comes from God.:hmmm:
 
I have read all of Adams post here and other threads and I have never seen him ponder only the easy stuff. I wonder where he has so much wisdom, but I know that it all comes from God.:hmmm:
Well I believe too that Adam does a lot of pondering , it seems to me though that he skips over about 20% of it.;)Carlan
 
I’m sure Matthew 16 is one of those verses! Maybe other Catholics can share which additonal Scriptures have dogmatic interpertatons?
Okay, so can you find references from official Catholic teaching that back up your claim that Matthew 16 is one of the only “dogmatically interpreted Scripture verses”?
 
Oh, and I would still like an answer to whether or not you think that, since there can be incorrect interpretations, there needs to be an authoritative interpreter?
 
Okay, so can you find firm references that back up your claim that Matthew 16 is one of the only “dogmatically interpreted Scripture verses”?
I did not post that Matthew 16 is the only Scripture that is interperted for you. I was asking for help from orthodox Catholic Christians who may know which actual Scriptures have dogmatic interpertations for Catholics. This is a Catholic Forum Site with a wealth of information in regards to the orthodox Catholic Faith. Maybe you can ask an apologist on this site for the answer?
 
To me, the Gospel is that Jesus brought glad tidings to the poor [in spirit], proclaims liberty to captives [of sin], the recovery of sight to the [spiritually] blind, and to let the [spiritually] oppressed go free.

that’s Good News to me . . . a sinner.
Welcome Darth-linux, I like what you shared. I have learned much following CA forums, I’ll l ook forward to hearing from you again:thumbsup:Carlan
 
Oh, and I would still like an answer to whether or not you think that, since there can be incorrect interpretations, there needs to be an authoritative interpreter?
Both Catholics and Protetstants believe that God the Holy Spirit is the authorative interperter of Scripture (see 1 Cor 2).
 
I did not post that Matthew 16 is the only Scripture that is interperted for you. I was asking for help from orthodox Catholic Christians who may know which actual Scriptures have dogmatic interpertations for Catholics. This is a Catholic Forum Site with a wealth of information in regards to the orthodox Catholic Faith. Maybe you can ask an apologist on this site for the answer?
No, you posted that there are only a few “interpreted for us” as Catholics. I’d like to know how you know this?
 
Both Catholics and Protetstants believe that God the Holy Spirit is the authorative interperter of Scripture (see 1 Cor 2).
You would agree that there is an authoritative interpretation then?
 
To the Protestant, we can give God all the glory for saving and transforming sinners into the image of God, to the praise of His glorious grace. Of confidence is not in ourselves; our total confidence is in God and His promises, because it is impossible for God to lie. IF we boast, we boast in the Lord only. Christ is completely sufficient for us.
Catholics do the same. Though I would say “God” is completely sufficient for me, but close enough.
To the Catholic, he is control of his own fate. The Catholic is sovereign over his final destiny, and can give God 98% of the glory for his salvation. Is this the logical conclusion of official Catholic theology? In your posting, you can say that Christ is 98% sufficient, but your 2% can nullify the work of God which was merited by the life and death of Christ.
Um…nope. This would be “the Catholic Church according to 2nd”, not the actual Catholic Church.

There is nothing we can do to earn our own salvation. Zilch, zero, nada.

We can however reject God’s offer of salvation, unfortunately many do so. 😦

Chuck
 
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