OK, but this particular bishop said it is an option. If you feel this is an abuse serious enough to address, then in conscience, you might want to make an official complaint.
An option that only the Apostolic See has the authority to implement.
It is not up to the community to instruct the bishop.That community did not “disrespect” him. They taught a valuable lesson. As soon as he started the actual PRAYER, the few standing knelt right back down.
They taught him what? That they’re stubborn? Did they teach him WHY what he did was wrong? Not a bit. To this day he probably just thinks they’re old sticks-in-the mud and still knows no better really.I’ll give a better example.
About 15 years ago, a bishop visited a certain community. I was present.
At the time for the Eucharistic Prayer, he began by saying, “Let us stand as a priestly people in the ancient sign of respect and honor to our Lord.”
Some people were confused…they had (automatically) started to kneel. They looked at each other, curious. Some (very few, as I recall) did stand. Most remained kneeling. The bishop said, “I said…let us stand.” Some more now stood. Most did not. The bishop looked apoplectic. He said, “WE ARE A PRIESTLY PEOPLE, AND WE STAND TO HONOR OUR LORD!”
This time, nobody else stood…presumably because he didn’t use an imperative, despite his loud tone.
That community did not “disrespect” him. They taught a valuable lesson. As soon as he started the actual PRAYER, the few standing knelt right back down.
Amen.It’s scary, really, how some people think bishops are little popes, or maybe even little gods, in their dioceses.
It’s also scary how the sensus fidelium has been so ruined and/or lost.
The response is “Amen” in the ordinary usage. End of story. It’s a universal reply in the Roman Rite.
Not “I believe”, not “Yes your Lordship”, not “Sure thing!”
It’s Amen.
And this isn’t brain surgery to grasp.
OK, but this particular bishop said it is an option. If you feel this is an abuse serious enough to address, then in conscience, you might want to make an official complaint.
I personally doubt he would be reprimanded or even corrected. I would be interested if anyone has that information.
Lux
WH,
We are discussing a situation, and I am giving my opinion, and asking if anyone has any report of a bishop being reprimanded or corrected for a minor change.
Your anger and nastiness to me certainly doesn’t help the situation.
This bishop did not instruct anyone to do anything, but a priest in my parish told me that we are to obey if we are instructed to do something, and discuss or report it later, unless it is against faith (doctrine ) or morals. I would listen to a priest rather than you in this situation.
Lux
I would not consider this option a dis-figurement
Just to clarify again—any dis-figurement introduced to the Mass—
does contribute to obscuring the Catholic faith and doctrine.
RS–2004
[6.] For abuses “contribute to the obscuring of the Catholic faith and doctrine concerning this wonderful sacrament"…
So what would you consider disfigurement, obscuring or abuse?I would not consider this option a dis-figurement
I would not consider this option obscuring but clarification of the Catholic faith.
I would not consider this option an abuse.
Obscuring would be something that makes the truth of the sacramental action more difficult to discern for those who are not well educated in the faith.So what would you consider disfigurement, obscuring or abuse?
(For a point of clarity. It helps when two people are using the same meanings for common terms)
I would not consider this option a dis-figurement
I would not consider this option obscuring but clarification of the Catholic faith.
I would not consider this option an abuse.
This may be a case of sensus fidelium. If the faithful fail use use the option, there is no need for a clearer statement of believe. If huge masses of people in the diocese choose to say “I believe” the sense of the faithful would be that Amen is unclear.“Amen” isn’t cryptic. Where is the great sensus fidelium?
As a lay person, when I am serving as a EMHE, is there anything I should do or say in response to anything from the communicant other than ‘Amen’?No matter who, why, and/or how many—a response other then Amen is illicit.