What of America is there to be proud of?

[RachelsAlumni]

Come this fourth of July, I am proud of all the true heroes of this country who have fought for the religious freedoms we now tentitively enjoy and must protect.

Lord Cecil Calvert, Proprietor of Maryland who enacted the “Act of Toleration,” that ended penal restrictions imposed on Catholics for public worship, and prosecution of priests for saying Mass. Catholics were denied the right to vote or hold office, but at least they could worship as long as they kept quiet about it.

Colonel Thomas Dongan, Governor of the Province of New York, passed an act entitled “A Charter of Liberties”; “which established town, county, and general courts of justice; solemnly proclaimed the right of religious liberty; and passed acts enunciating certain constitutional liberties, e.g. no taxation without representation; taxes could be levied only by the people met in general assembly; right of suffrage; no martial law or quartering of the soldiers without the consent of the inhabitants; election by majority of votes; and the English law of real property. Dongan’s term as governor can be dated the Magna Charta of American constitutional liberties.”

 

[Verisimilitude]

Stay focused here, Yoda. I said he wasn’t well received. That means I didn’t like him or his ways. So I supported removing him.

Listen Gomer, what you like and support is of little consequence in even the small scheme of things. Check your ego at the door.

If you want to discuss past Iranian policies, I’d be glad to do it in another thread. IE: It’s will be a long thread. No need to hijack this thread with long, off topic posts. Meaning, it’s not a simple yes or no answer.

It is a simple answer and you gave it.

Not neccessarily when it comes to foreign policy. Catholics are supposedly anti war, right? Well that dosen’t sit well with me. Particularly because it is not supported by the Church in a simple, clean cut way. No Pope will condone war, but they also realize that it is needed sometimes.

Is this a new American thing that country trumps Christ’s Testament? You will make the fourth Catholic on this site to say Christ’s teachings do not apply to American Catholcis today. I’m stunned.

Not slower, just with some more information.
“Have you ever considered you might have a wrong view of that?”

Wrong in what view?

That ‘radicals’ did not hijack the Mohammedan religion as its doctrine is that which is proclaimed by bin Laden. Seeing as how you do not pay attention to Catholic Doctrine I don’t suppose you would bother to know Islams.

Kill him and another one steps up. And yes, we saw people like him in Iraq. We have them all over the world. In 100 different nations, including Iraq. His ideology is like roaches. What good does it do to kill just one of them?

So perpetual war to kill them all is your choice of action then. Are you a veteran?

So?

How would you feel if China had bases in Mexico to keep us in line like we do to them? Your one of those who feel it a civic duty to pay a third of your income in taxes to pay Islamic dictators.

Oh, you are an isolationist. I see now.

You see little to nothing and understand even less.

I remember where that policy got us, and the world, in the past. No thanks.

Less war and killing? Less cost to Americans? Are you so afraid of others you prefer war to peace? Who do you want to attack next?

 

[Peregrino]

It is funny. But like I said before, I know what I would personaly do if I felt that way about America. I would leave her. Go live in some other nation that is not as “evil” as America is or it’s government, that was elected by her people. Me, personally, would renounce my citizenship and flee to Canada, Spain, England, or anywhere else but here. But that’s just what I would do. Although, you would have to fight your way through the crowds of people flocking to get into the US, on your way out, but…

The beauty of the system we have in the United States is (in theory) the ability to change things and progress forward, adapt etc. The safeguards we have in place (e.g. Bill of Rights) is designed to preserve this capability.

What I find hilarious is when people (claiming to be “Americans”) complain about other Americans exercising this right to critique and dissent. As others have pointed out, if there is one thing truly American, it is this right to critique, criticize and propose a new direction without the fear of state power being exercised against them. Why does the “love it as it is or leave” crowd get their feathers ruffled when people exercise their rights?

If we everyone conserved things as they stood at the inception of this country the wealthy might still own slaves and women wouldn’t be able to vote.

Thank God there were some true Americans in our past who had the guts to stand up to the “just leave if you don’t like it” crowd and get some of the above mentioned evils changed.

 

[vern_humphrey]

The beauty of the system we have in the United States is (in theory) the ability to change things and progress forward, adapt etc. The safeguards we have in place (e.g. Bill of Rights) is designed to preserve this capability.

What I find hilarious is when people (claiming to be “Americans”) complain about other Americans exercising this right to critique and dissent. As others have pointed out, if there is one thing truly American, it is this right to critique, criticize and propose a new direction without the fear of state power being exercised against them. Why does the “love it as it is or leave” crowd get their feathers ruffled when people exercise their rights?

If we everyone conserved things as they stood at the inception of this country the wealthy might still own slaves and women wouldn’t be able to vote.

Thank God there were some true Americans in our past who had the guts to stand up to the “just leave if you don’t like it” crowd and get some of the above mentioned evils changed.

But aren’t you complaining about other Americans exercising **their ** right to critique and dissent?

 

[Al_Masetti]

This is an absolute MUST READ:

amazon.com/Democracy-America-Signet-Classics-Tocqueville/dp/0451528123

And something more recent:

amazon.com/Alistair-Cookes-America-Cooke/dp/0786710365

And here:

amazon.com/Federalist-Papers-Signet-Classics/dp/0451528816/ref=pd_sim_b_7

These three provide three different perspectives on what makes America unique and great.

And finally …
A shining city upon a hill … a place where people want to come to … not run away from.

Read this:

originofnations.org/books,%20papers/quotes%20etc/Reagan_The%20Shining%20City%20Upon%20A%20Hill%20speech.htm

[Read the whole thing; it’s amazing!]

 

[estesbob]

What I find hilarious is when people (claiming to be “Americans”) complain about other Americans exercising this right to critique and dissent. As others have pointed out, if there is one thing truly American, it is this right to critique, criticize and propose a new direction without the fear of state power being exercised against them. Why does the “love it as it is or leave” crowd get their feathers ruffled when people exercise their rights?

.

The above is a real hoot. While claiming that the right to critique and criticize is truly American you refer to people doing exactly this (but in a way you dont like)as “claiming to be American.” I suspect the irony is lost on you.

 

[vern_humphrey]

The above is a real hoot. While claiming that the right to critique and criticize is truly American you refer to people doing exactly this (but in a way you dont like)as “claiming to be American.” I suspect the irony is lost on you.

There are those who take the position that, “You have a right to hold any opinion you like, as long as you agree with me.”

 

[rlg94086]

This is an absolute MUST READ:

amazon.com/Democracy-America-Signet-Classics-Tocqueville/dp/0451528123

And something more recent:

amazon.com/Alistair-Cookes-America-Cooke/dp/0786710365

And here:

amazon.com/Federalist-Papers-Signet-Classics/dp/0451528816/ref=pd_sim_b_7

These three provide three different perspectives on what makes America unique and great.

And finally …
A shining city upon a hill … a place where people want to come to … not run away from.

Read this:

originofnations.org/books,%20papers/quotes%20etc/Reagan_The%20Shining%20City%20Upon%20A%20Hill%20speech.htm

[Read the whole thing; it’s amazing!]

I found this more recent book very enjoyable - A Patriot’s History of the United States* …*much better than the uber-socialist, America-hating “history” book by Howard Zinn that some else recommended. Don’t waste your time with that one.

 

[RachelsAlumni]

The beauty of the system we have in the United States is (in theory) the ability to change things and progress forward, adapt etc. The safeguards we have in place (e.g. Bill of Rights) is designed to preserve this capability.

What I find hilarious is when people (claiming to be “Americans”) complain about other Americans exercising this right to critique and dissent. As others have pointed out, if there is one thing truly American, it is this right to critique, criticize and propose a new direction without the fear of state power being exercised against them. Why does the “love it as it is or leave” crowd get their feathers ruffled when people exercise their rights?

Thank God there were some true Americans in our past who had the guts to stand up to the “just leave if you don’t like it” crowd and get some of the above mentioned evils changed.

To say nothing of the current evils that must be changed by this right to dissent and protest America’s immoral laws of Abortion and Same Sex Marriage. Thank God we have the right to protest, and protest we do! So I guess I could add the right to protest and dissent as something to be proud of.

 

[rlg94086]

I suppose if it’s so important and it will make people feel better we can cese the use of America and American and just say we are from the United States…but what would that make us United Statesians? Estadounidense works in spanish, doesn’t translate too well to english.

I agree regarding the semantics of calling ourselves Americans. On the other hand, I am swayed by the arguments that we should have some solidarity with the rest of America…especially as Catholics.

American Catholics bring a unique perspective to our country’s relationship with Latin America, since it is populated largely by fellow Catholics, our brothers and sisters in Christ. When the bishops of the hemsphere met at the Synod for America, they articulated a view that invited us all to adopt a revolutionary rethinking of the way we view one another: “We believe that we are one community; and, although America comprises many nations, cultures and languages, there is so much that links us together and so many ways in which each of us affects the lives of our neighbors.” Latin America’s Catholic roots are obvious, and the United States shares those same roots in Florida and the Southwest. Maryland, Louisiana, Quebec and the Maritime Provinces round out this heritage in the United States and Canada. Each nation in North America has a deep-rooted common spiritual heritage.

 There can be little doubt that ours is, in the words of Pope Benedict, "a continent of baptized Christians."  More precisely, it is a continent where the majority of persons are baptized Catholics.   Our goal should be to create a vibrant (North, Central, and South) American Catholic community in which our shared faith and values become a light to the entire world. (Anderson, 2008, p.151)*

*Anderson, Carl 2008 A Civilization of Love - What Every Catholic Can Do to Transform the World, HarperCollins, New York

 

[RachelsAlumni]

I agree regarding the semantics of calling ourselves Americans. On the other hand, I am swayed by the arguments that we should have some solidarity with the rest of America…especially as Catholics.

I’ve heard or read this before. I think the issue over the use of the term American is offensive when it’s used in a manner intended to exclude other non-US citizens in the Americas i.e. South America, Central America. The exclusionary use of the term is seen as arrogant, from what I’ve heard.

I know people from Canada who don’t call the US America, they call us “The States”. I think alot of Europeans also refer to America as The States. Latin Americans refer to us as Estadaunideans or something like that.

 

[vern_humphrey]

I’ve heard or read this before. I think the issue over the use of the term American is offensive when it’s used in a manner intended to exclude other non-US citizens in the Americas i.e. South America, Central America. The exclusionary use of the term is seen as arrogant, from what I’ve heard.

I know people from Canada who don’t call the US America, they call us “The States”. I think alot of Europeans also refer to America as The States. Latin Americans refer to us as Estadaunideans or something like that.

There are several “United States” in the Americas, including the United States of Mexico and the United States of Venezuela.

Latin Americans sometime call us “Los Estados Unidos.”

 

[Peregrino]

But aren’t you complaining about other Americans exercising **their ** right to critique and dissent?

Not at all Vern. I am laughing!

 

[RLT]

Sorry I touched a nerve there Marine! I added that comment just before I posted because I was corrected, earlier this year, from some former Marines by not using America “alone”. (Former Navy here 68-78) No doubt, when the world hears “America”, it thinks “United States”.

Sorry if I came off attcking you, I was just using your quote as a refrence.

I can understand a Jarhead complaining about leaving off te United States part, Marines get all bothered when you say EGA instead of Eagle, Globe and Anchor. Ignore those Jarheads though, I’m right they’re wrong.

 

[neat62]

Verisimilitude;3861357

Listen Gomer, what you like and support is of little consequence in even the small scheme of things. Check your ego at the door.

Right next to yours? You ought to talk pal.

It is a simple answer and you gave it.

No it isn’t simple. The world is not as simple as you seem to think it is.

Is this a new American thing that country trumps Christ’s Testament? You will make the fourth Catholic on this site to say Christ’s teachings do not apply to American Catholcis today. I’m stunned.

It applies to Catholics, not government. If you are a nation and you tunr the other cheek, you will get killed. The last time I checked, Christianity was not a suicide pact.

That ‘radicals’ did not hijack the Mohammedan religion as its doctrine is that which is proclaimed by bin Laden. Seeing as how you do not pay attention to Catholic Doctrine I don’t suppose you would bother to know Islams.

Most Muslims do not act like terrorists though. Just like the vast majoirty of Catholics and other Christians do not follow all of the Bible in it’s entirety.

So perpetual war to kill them all is your choice of action then. Are you a veteran?

No and no. But it dosen’t really matter anyway. Your mind is made up so why should I even get all upset?

How would you feel if China had bases in Mexico to keep us in line like we do to them?

You mean anti freedom Communist China?

Your one of those who feel it a civic duty to pay a third of your income in taxes to pay Islamic dictators.

No more than Ilike my taxes to go to welfare people, socialized medicine, politicians, sex ed in schools, leftist college campuses, abortion, property taxes, taxes on cigarettes, taxes on food, taxes on gas, taxes on merchandise, etc.

You see little to nothing and understand even less.

Now that’s real Christian of you.

Less war and killing? Less cost to Americans? Are you so afraid of others you prefer war to peace? Who do you want to attack next?

Are you kidding? 70 million dead because we did nothing in the first half of the past century. WW2 was over 100% of our GDP. And again, life is not as simple as you seem to think it is.

 

[neat62]

Peregrino;3861385

What I find hilarious is when people (claiming to be “Americans”) complain about other Americans exercising this right to critique and dissent. As others have pointed out, if there is one thing truly American, it is this right to critique, criticize and propose a new direction without the fear of state power being exercised against them. Why does the “love it as it is or leave” crowd get their feathers ruffled when people exercise their rights?

Thank God there were some true Americans in our past who had the guts to stand up to the “just leave if you don’t like it” crowd and get some of the above mentioned evils changed.

1. In light of July 4th, this thread is about what we love about America, NOT WHAT WE HATE ABOUT IT!
2. The First Amendment is an agreement between the government and it’s people. That does not apply to citizen to citizen. Why are my feathers ruffled? Because the “dissenters” are not posting to the government, they are posting to other citizens who feel differently. They purposely come into a post that is looking to see what people love about America, not hate about it. The government is not involved ANYWHERE in this post! Go start a thread about changing all the evils you want, but do you honestly think that we should accept hostile attitudes in a thread like this, with graciousness?? No, this is how civil wars start.

 

[anthony022071]

I feel a sense of pride when I see American Catholics who are faithful to the Church and its doctrines. But I can’t relate to American nationalistic pride. There’s nothing really for me to latch onto in a visceral way,like culture or ethnicity or faith. This is not a country that is defined by ethnicity (blood) or a traditional culture,but by republican democracy,the free-market system and the Enlighenment principles of liberty,civil rights,and tolerance. Those are not bad things,but they are just principles and systems,and nothing to feel proud about in the way that a person would feel proud about a member of his own family or his ethnic neighborhood. Being a citizen of this country doesn’t bring about much of a sense of family relationship with the rest of the country. When the people of European countries feel proud about their countries,it has more to do with who they are as a people,rather than their citizenship,or the benefits that they enjoy under their government and economic systems. There is plenty of reason to feel fortunate and perhaps grateful about being a citizen,but proud?

 

[Dale_M]

Latin Americans refer to us as Estadaunideans or something like that.

RLT, in an earlier post, mentioned that the Latin American term for us people living in the US is estadounidense. But I am not sure if that is plural or singular (or both).

As for what I am proud of…
I am proud that we can speak out against injustice, organize against injustice, and (even if slowly) see justice come around.

I am proud that our children have a realistic chance at having a better life, or at least the freedom to be who they want to be.

I am proud that we are involved in the world, and that the world expects us to do good.

 

[rogerh_57]

Sorry if I came off attcking you, I was just using your quote as a refrence.

I can understand a Jarhead complaining about leaving off te United States part, Marines get all bothered when you say EGA instead of Eagle, Globe and Anchor. Ignore those Jarheads though, I’m right they’re wrong.

No offense taken, at all!

 

[c659smith]

WELL WE ARE A COUNTRY THAT HAS AN IMMIGRATION PROBLEM BECAUSE THE WORLD WANTS TO BECOME CITIZENS NOT LEAVE LIKE MOST COUNTRIES THROUGHOUT THE WORLD.

God Bless America