What Role Do Catholics Play in Combatting Rape Culture?

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Jump4Joy said:
It would be a little much to try to teach the nexte generation to save themselves for marriages especially if they aren’t religious.
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Then how about using this very problem to show the prudence of the model of marriage that is fast becoming obsolete?
 
Apparently so, since we no longer teach them that sex is for marriage. Instead we teach them that casual sex is fine, just be safe and get consent and don’t get pregnant or get a disease.

Maybe we should just start teaching the truth about sex. Catholic teaching is the truth about sex.
 
pnewton said:
The best written consent is a marriage license.
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Nope. Did you miss the posts about marital rape upthread? And, since it’s been a few years now, I’ll mention the man who would regularly rape his wife before Mass.

In the context of this subject you are saying, even if you don’t realize it, that a marriage license is a license to rape. I repeat: In this context. I realize that you probably don’t believe that rape is wrong any time but when talking about consent, and the reality of marital rape, if you aren’t out right saying a marriage license is consent to rape then you are being rather flippant about rape and consent.

Sorry. I just never get used to it.
 
Bruised_Reed said:
In the context of this subject you are saying, even if you don’t realize it, that a marriage license is a license to rape.
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No, I said it is consent, as in St Paul 101. It is a consent to have consensual sex. That is like to unmarried people saying “yes” is an invitation to rape. The problem with everything under the sun being called rape, including less than enthusiastic marital encounters, is that it downplay sexual assault, rape. What if neither is very enthusiastic? Are they raping each other? No, it is usually only the man.

This brings an interesting point. I have to think this current METOO may be inadvertently damaging our rape culture, by lumping everything into one, big basket. There was a politician that got skewered by using a term “real rape” a while back, but are we all so stupid that we get swept along with every fad? Rape, sexual assault, has a real, definable, meaning. Legally, there is such a thing as real rape. The law speaks of performing an act without that person’s consent, not that they didn’t say no, and not that they gave on-going consent.

In marriage it is very hard to prove lack of consent, and consent must be the default implication in marriage. It would be far better for such a spouse to separate in a situation to make it clear there is no consent.
Now for the matters you wrote about: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband. The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband. In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife. Do not deprive each other except perhaps by mutual consent and for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer. Then come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
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gcshapero said:
There are even texts showing that it was the girl who had requested it.
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This is why ongoing consent is important. If she is incapacitated by the time they are in the same space, consent is revoked.
 
If their parents don’t teach them those morals, why should schools teach students to save themselves for marriage
 
Jump4Joy said:
If their parents don’t teach them those morals, why should schools teach students to save themselves for marriage
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I speak of prudence, not morals. Even it were not moral, there is practical benefit in marriage, like this whole business of a partner changing their mind after the fact, out of anger, rejection, or just plain ditziness, and dragging you to court. Having multiple partners, even serially, also increases the risk of sexually transmitted disease.
 
pnewton said:
No, I said it is consent, as in St Paul 101. It is a consent to have consensual sex.
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But you do need to spell that out for some people. Unfortunately.
pnewton said:
That is like to unmarried people saying “yes” is an invitation to rape.
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Did you mean “two” not to?
pnewton said:
have to think this current METOO may be inadvertently damaging our rape culture, by lumping everything into one, big basket.
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Rape culture is a big basket and a lot fits within it, not just the US federal definition of rape. It includes street harassment, snapping bras, telling girls that when boys hit them it means they like her, it’s jokes about rape, it’s when the victim becomes the target of harassment even if the violence was caught on camera, it’s a judge telling a rape victim that she looked older, it prison “don’t drop the soap” jokes, it’s being groped in public (at clubs, subway), it’s not believing a victim because you like the perpetrator, it’s suggesting that a boy who gets sexual attention from a “hot” teacher is some kind of dream come true, it’s covering for rapists and child molesters…rape culture isn’t just about a legal definition; it’s anything that normalizes rape and sexual assault.
 
I mentioned this upthread, but I think it got missed.

Women aren’t going to get married unless they go out on dates. It’s not like a man saying he believes in Christian values is a guarantee that he’s never going to attempt anything. So it’s not like the woman believing in chastity is a guarantee for her. And there’s a real danger that if the danger of extramarital sex is taught, but the idea of consent is not, that women who are raped stay silent out of shame and fear of being tarnished for unchastity.

Also, rape culture affects women too. If you don’t teach women about respect and consent, you can’t expect them to know to not marry a guy who doesn’t care about it.
 
pnewton said:
like this whole business of a partner changing their mind after the fact, out of anger, rejection, or just plain ditziness, and dragging you to court.
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Yes, let’s make it about the 2-7% of “false” reports, and considering how many legit rapes never make get beyond a police report, the number that make it to court is tiny.
 
I just think the term “rape culture” is weird. Can people not use terms like rape, assault, harrassment, misogyny, chsuvinism, violence, etc.
 
I don’t anyone is encouraging casual sex. I think the message is if you choose to engage in casual sex, here is the way to do so respectfully and safely. Do you hope public schools preach to students save yourself for marriage? I think they can discuss the safety of abstinence. Then again, chaste modest women are rape victims.
 
I can agree with discussing how abstinence is the safest option. What does that have to do with rape? I think most adults are aware of the dangers of promiscuity.
 
Loud-living-dogma said:
I just think the term “rape culture” is weird. Can people not use terms like rape, assault, harrassment, misogyny, chsuvinism, violence, etc.
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You mean list each and every one, every time? And not consider what rape culture might be and how one might unwittingly contribute to it?
 
I’m going to add one more to this: How we respond to women who become pregnant as the result of rape. Granted, not too many of us will experience this, but have you ever heard someone say that a rape victim should be allowed to get an abortion. And how would you act around her? I think a lot of people want to erase the “shame” because they think something intimate happened. They think they know. Why is there a stigma attached to the victim or child? Rape culture. It’s not that far removed from honor killings; they want to get rid of the source of shame. The fact that so many don’t even know the definition of rape culture is and what it looks like and aren’t even willing to do a one-time deep dive into the subject to gain some understanding, I can’ t cover everything. This thread will close in a little more than an hour (depending on time zones :confused:) and we’re barely scratching the tip of the iceberg.
 
Jump4Joy said:
I don’t anyone is encouraging casual sex. I think the message is if you choose to engage in casual sex, here is the way to do so respectfully and safely. Do you hope public schools preach to students save yourself for marriage? I think they can discuss the safety of abstinence. Then again, chaste modest women are rape victims.
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I think that schools should not teach children that having unmarried sex is a good thing to do. But by teaching them how to have “safe sex” they are implicitly teaching them that it’s okay as long as it’s safe. But it’s not safe. One might even say that it encourages a sex entitlement culture which leads to a rape culture.
 
No, I wasn’t sure. I thought maybe my reading comprehension wasn’t so great. It’s still an wonkily worded sentence and whether to or two I had trouble parsing it.
 
It’s more than about sex. There are a lot of occasions in which I’ve applied consent. I will ask someone if it’s okay to give them a hug or rub their back for comfort. The person is usually of the same gender or a child and while hugging is an acceptable thing it can be kind of automatic or assumed. I get hugged way more than I want to be and it would be so much easier on both parties if they were to ask, rather than me having to say, “no, I don’t feel like being hugged today,” or “I don’t wan’t to hug you because you are obviously here to get your needs met and disregarding mine,” because that will go over like the proverbial lead balloon. Should I assert myself more? Yes, definitely. But then let’s get the word out: don’t judge, don’t take it personally, don’t act like I’m the problem. M’kay?
 
Bruised_Reed said:
It’s still an wonkily worded sentence and whether to or two I had trouble parsing it.
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Misspell a word here, elide a word or two there, and yeah, I guess it turned out pretty wonky, and I grant that was goofy, unlike my difficult posts that are cause more usually caused by run-on sentences, which by their nature are difficult to follow, especially in a society where sentence diagramming is no longer taught, unlike the way we used to teach when I was younger. (all in one sentence!)
 
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