Yes, I am serious. As I said, it is just my opinion. Obviously I do not think it would cut off anyone’s legs. Basic economics and a freer economy would balance unemployment and increase productivity. I just really, really, really, thing that all who are here should be taxed for the benefits they receive. And if you note, I mentioned that legal immigration would provide a means of tracking and documentation. Illegal immigration provides no security.“…any and all can come???”…are you serious???..and do what??. We have 10% unemployment. You would cut the legs out from our own citizens?? NO WAY.
Do I detect a prejudice against the Middle Eastern people?Yes. I do not trust them.
No. That would be a false assumption.Do I detect a prejudice against the Middle Eastern people?
I admire Roger Cardinal Mahoney, known as Rogelio to his Spanish-speaking parishioners, and I especially loved it when he said that he would defy the law if required to report undocumented parishioners.
I think we should be careful to not slander someone unfairly, especially a member of the clergy. What Cardinal Mahoney says has validity. Law enforcement is not the role of the Church. Some saints have given their lives rather than allow the state to encroach on the mission of the Church. The law that Cardinal Mahoney spoke of fortunately never was passed. The Church is to feed and clothe the poor, not arrest and detain them.Cardinal Mahoney conspires with illegals to help their efforts to violate the law.
The United States has the right to restrict immigration and regulate it. Those that come here have the obligation to respect the law. Now how this is done is surely debatable and Catholics may legitimately disagree on what is best. The point is, just like the state should not cross the line and tell the Church how it is to conduct charity, the Church should not tell the state how to best exercise judgement in these matters. Every priest is in a democracy is entitled to their opinion, but they must not hold that opinion up as Church teaching when it is not.Political authorities, for the sake of the common good for which they are responsible, may make the exercise of the right to immigrate subject to various juridical conditions, especially with regard to the immigrants’ duties toward their country of adoption. Immigrants are obliged to respect with gratitude the material and spiritual heritage of the country that receives them, to obey its laws and to assist in carrying civic burdens. (CCC #2241)
But while doing so, the Church does not assist the prisoner in evading authority, escaping, or breaking any additional laws.You do know, don’t you, that the Church also minsters to those in prison, as commanded by Jesus Himself?
No, the Church doesn’t. I do not think anyone has suggested that the Church should do such a thing or has do such a thing. The Church just tends to the spiritual needs and for charity sake, the physical needs of those in dire straits.But while doing so, the Church does not assist the prisoner in evading authority, escaping, or breaking any additional laws.
You have to read what one says, not what one implies. The latter allows for too much misunderstanding. It might help to consider the context of what I was responding to, namely, I was pointing out that the argument the Church should not minister to illegal immigrants because they are criminals, is fallacious. I have never said that the Church should have any role in lying to the government or aid in the violation of the law. In fact, I said just the opposite. Likewise, the Church should not, and does not, engage in promoting wars.That’s not what your earlier post (that I quoted) at all implied.
Your implication, not mine. Likewise, your over-generalization can also lead to false assumptions. Lumping me in with others that you have dealt with might be why you missed what I really said in favor of what I said. I am not a “they.”Then later you pulled back from such an implied parallelism. That’s fine, but the reason I dwell on the earlier rhetoric is that this is one of the great fallacies in the whole very loaded immigration rhetoric that is so often bandied about publicly, including by people in the Church. They use rhetoric to answer a different question or concern than the issue at hand, as if generalized rhetoric substitutes for truth or can change truth.
The Catholic Church is becoming a haven for anything illegal. Illegal aliens, pedophile priest, money laudering,etc.I do think that American law needs to be written so that it follows practice more closely. In other words, be honest about how many immigrants we really want: Many, it would seem under present practice, and expand legal immigration accordingly.
But the tenor of this thread disturbs me because it is very familiar. I have an uncle is an angry opponent of immigration even though his own MOTHER arrived illegally. How many of you angry, anti-migrant posters here had ancestors who arrived without papers? If you are Irish or Italian, almost certainly you have undocumented forebears. Would you have wanted them sent back?
There is a superb book on the development of Catholic Charities called The Poor Belong to Us, and it describes the Church’s efforts to care for the poor since the late 19th C. Some in our history would agree with those who want to prosecute the undocumented. But the bishops have consistently supported immigration, regardless of status, because it is Catholic teaching to care for the disadvantaged, and the poor do much better in the States than in many other areas of the world.
I admire Roger Cardinal Mahoney, known as Rogelio to his Spanish-speaking parishioners, and I especially loved it when he said that he would defy the law if required to report undocumented parishioners. Here’s a very good article from the NY Times about “Nuevo Catholics” that includes discussion of his ministry:
nytimes.com/2006/12/24/magazine/24catholics.t.html?pagewanted=all
Comment if you want, but I will not reply to angry posters.
I think your post needs correcting…has anyone on this thread said anything about being against legal immigrants? If so, I missed it. Trying to uphold justice and solidarity (as taught by the Church) is not being anti-migrant. We need to be careful with our language.But the tenor of this thread disturbs me because it is very familiar. I have an uncle is an angry opponent of immigration even though his own MOTHER arrived illegally. How many of you angry, anti-migrant posters here had ancestors who arrived without papers? If you are Irish or Italian, almost certainly you have undocumented forebears. Would you have wanted them sent back?
There is so much deception and I can’t blame the good Catholics who try to follow their faith. Here is an excellent article from AB Chaput who says the Church has abdicated its role in instruction and faith formation. Our bishops need to teach us with one united voice and uphold authentic Church teaching:There is a superb book on the development of Catholic Charities called The Poor Belong to Us, and it describes the Church’s efforts to care for the poor since the late 19th C. Some in our history would agree with those who want to prosecute the undocumented. But the bishops have consistently supported immigration, regardless of status, because it is Catholic teaching to care for the disadvantaged, and the poor do much better in the States than in many other areas of the world.
All the while this real life entity, Catholic Charities, has been worming its way into the hearts, minds and checkbooks of the faithful while absolutely working as “change agents” before the United Nations and the federal and state governments **to install what would amount to a secular humanist welfare state system of governance. ** And, all of it is based on a twisted interpretation of the Good Samaritan as the first community-minded social activist.
Any of the Catholic “social justice” groups need to be thoroughly investigated before buying into their rhetoric . You may want to do a search on this forum which contains many excellent links to support the truth of this. And Mahoney? Sorry, but he is not one of my role models…he has been raked over the coals because of the scandal in his own diocese over the pedophilia coverup and subsequent mess. He was investigated by the Feds as I remember and he’s now a cardinal!!!