What teachings would the Catholic Church have to drop for you to be a catholic

[Thorwald]

And that Body is the Catholic Church, outside of which, there is no salvation. I should be clearer now for you to have a better picture of the thing you are agreeing with.

So Mary is just nothing?

You (Catholics) seem to have missed part of ‘your church (body)’. When the disciples of Christ told Him that His mother and brothers were outside, what did Christ say? He said that we are all HIs mothers. brothers, sisters. etc. What did He mean? He meant, that as "Son of Man’, He, Himself was the same as all of us. He had to prove that He could remain holy. As ‘Son of God’, He is above us (Lord of Hosts). Mary has nothing to do with Christ being the Son of God. He held this ‘title’ before the world was. Mary provided the means for the Son of God to take on a human form. It was not her choice, but rather, it was God’s choice. This is true of all prophets, disciples, apostles, etc. God chose these people, in order to carry out His needs. Mary is no different. We are not told by Christ to ‘worship’ Mary, or put her on any kind of pedistal. Man has chosen to do so. By doing so, the Word of God has been added to.

Thorwald Johansen

 

[w_stewart]

The body of the congregation stays together outside of Mass on a regular basis? Or is the shouting of praise reserved for the extra special occasion?

That is not what I said. What I said is that Catholics can do the dancing and shouting for the Lord anytime/anywhere but not during the Mass.

 

[SteveGC]

Here’s another way to think about it.

How much listening to the quiet words and nudges of God are you doing while you are shouting and dancing and grooving all over the place? How much are you REALLY connecting with the Passion of our Lord when your body and mouth are so active?

Again, not that there’s not a place for this behavior, because I believe our Lord does delight in our exuberance for Him, but again, Mass is the form of worship our apostolic fathers instituted, received from the teachings of Christ Himself. This is a most solemn occasion where we are to join together as community, and demonstrate utmost reverence for His once-for-all sacrifice for us.

God Bless

 

[4Squarebaby]

That is not what I said. What I said is that Catholics can do the dancing and shouting for the Lord anytime/anywhere but not during the Mass.

But when do they get together to do so is were I’m curious? Not if it is allowed outside the Mass. The Mass is obligatory for the faithful but how often do you gather for shouting praise?

 

[w_stewart]

You (Catholics) seem to have missed part of ‘your church (body)’. When the disciples of Christ told Him that His mother and brothers were outside, what did Christ say? He said that we are all HIs mothers. brothers, sisters. etc. What did He mean? He meant, that as "Son of Man’, He, Himself was the same as all of us. He had to prove that He could remain holy. As ‘Son of God’, He is above us (Lord of Hosts). Mary has nothing to do with Christ being the Son of God. He held this ‘title’ before the world was. Mary provided the means for the Son of God to take on a human form. It was not her choice, but rather, it was God’s choice. This is true of all prophets, disciples, apostles, etc. God chose these people, in order to carry out His needs. Mary is no different. We are not told by Christ to ‘worship’ Mary, or put her on any kind of pedistal. Man has chosen to do so. By doing so, the Word of God has been added to.

Thorwald Johansen

Don’t you think Mary deserve some utmost respect we can give to a human being who happens to be the Mother of our Saviour, the Mother of our God who died for us?

 

[w_stewart]

But when do they get together to do so is were I’m curious? Not if it is allowed outside the Mass. The Mass is obligatory for the faithful but how often do you gather for shouting praise?

Well, Catholic Charismatic groups, Couples for Christ do the shouting of praises during their meetings.

BTW, I don’t think it is necessary for a Catholic to shout praise for God. We can praise God silently.

 

[SteveGC]

You (Catholics) seem to have missed part of ‘your church (body)’. When the disciples of Christ told Him that His mother and brothers were outside, what did Christ say? He said that we are all HIs mothers. brothers, sisters. etc. What did He mean? He meant, that as "Son of Man’, He, Himself was the same as all of us. He had to prove that He could remain holy. As ‘Son of God’, He is above us (Lord of Hosts). Mary has nothing to do with Christ being the Son of God. He held this ‘title’ before the world was. Mary provided the means for the Son of God to take on a human form. It was not her choice, but rather, it was God’s choice. This is true of all prophets, disciples, apostles, etc. God chose these people, in order to carry out His needs. Mary is no different. We are not told by Christ to ‘worship’ Mary, or put her on any kind of pedistal. Man has chosen to do so. By doing so, the Word of God has been added to.

Thorwald Johansen

Yet again…completely diminishing free will…and the most important “Fiat” of all time. Even if we all agree that God predestined Mary’s “yes”…this is not a reason to shelve her with all the other people God “could have” chosen. Don’t forget, He didn’t just choose Her as He chose prophets to speak for Him…He chose her for the most monumental, universally salvific action in the entire world. He chose her for His ultimate humility, His ultimate expression of Love for all mankind. This was no trivial thing, where the one He chooses to be the instrument of it, should be classified among those that were not.

 

[SteveGC]

But when do they get together to do so is were I’m curious? Not if it is allowed outside the Mass. The Mass is obligatory for the faithful but how often do you gather for shouting praise?

Explain the significance of “shouting praise”. Explain how what you are doing glorifies God above the reverence Catholics routinely express. So many non-Catholics cannot fathom how a Christian won’t physically and outwardly sing, shout and dance at the very sound of Christ’s name. Yes, He’s alive…He’s alive! We know. And we sing it in our hearts, and we express it in our daily interaction with the world. But why do so many make the implication that it is only authentic Christianity if this dancing and shouting is a physically manifested act? If it’s not just for God to see, then who are you doing it for? Yourself? to feel good about you? Or fallen away Christians, or non-Christians? Well, they can’t see you in your church. Do you see my point?

 

[Cinette]

You (Catholics) seem to have missed part of ‘your church (body)’. When the disciples of Christ told Him that His mother and brothers were outside, what did Christ say? He said that we are all HIs mothers. brothers, sisters. etc. What did He mean? He meant, that as "Son of Man’, He, Himself was the same as all of us. He had to prove that He could remain holy. As ‘Son of God’, He is above us (Lord of Hosts). Mary has nothing to do with Christ being the Son of God. He held this ‘title’ before the world was. Mary provided the means for the Son of God to take on a human form. It was not her choice, but rather, it was God’s choice. This is true of all prophets, disciples, apostles, etc. God chose these people, in order to carry out His needs. Mary is no different. We are not told by Christ to ‘worship’ Mary, or put her on any kind of pedistal. Man has chosen to do so. By doing so, the Word of God has been added to.

Thorwald Johansen

I do not wish to offend you but you offend me with what you say about our Blessed Lady, the Mother of God. We do not worship her at all, please note.

We love and honour her and recognise the role she has played in our lives - and continues to play. I am very sorry for your offensive words in regard to our beloved Mother. Your Mother too

Cinette

 

[Thorwald]

Don’t you think Mary deserve some utmost respect we can give to a human being who happens to be the Mother of our Saviour, the Mother of our God who died for us?

Your own scripture tells you to ‘respect no man’.

Thorwald Johansen

 

[Cinette]

Explain the significance of “shouting praise”. Explain how what you are doing glorifies God above the reverence Catholics routinely express. So many non-Catholics cannot fathom how a Christian won’t physically and outwardly sing, shout and dance at the very sound of Christ’s name. Yes, He’s alive…He’s alive! We know. And we sing it in our hearts, and we express it in our daily interaction with the world. But why do so many make the implication that it is only authentic Christianity if this dancing and shouting is a physically manifested act? If it’s not just for God to see, then who are you doing it for? Yourself? to feel good about you? Or fallen away Christians, or non-Christians? Well, they can’t see you in your church. Do you see my point?

I would like to add how the Mass is seeped in scripture. Also the readings and psalms are all connected.

All the prayers - all the liturgy emanates from scripture.

I would like to invite all protestants to attend the Holy Week services. To experience the Easter Vigil for example. And then to tell us if they didn’t feel they were in Heaven!

Cinette

 

[w_stewart]

I do not wish to offend you but you offend me with what you say about our Blessed Lady, the Mother of God. We do not worship her at all, please note.

We love and honour her and recognise the role she has played in our lives - and continues to play. I am very sorry for your offensive words in regard to our beloved Mother. Your Mother too

Cinette

Indeed, it is deplorable how our Protestant brethren offend our Mother, the Mother of our Saviour. Jesus, for sure, feels the pains everytime her Mother is put in the situation like this.

If our Muslim brethren honor our Mother, why cannot the Protestants do that? I wonder why.

 

[w_stewart]

Your own scripture tells you to ‘respect no man’.

Thorwald Johansen

So God was wrong when he commanded us to respect our parents?

 

[jlhargus]

I’m curious. Mass is held everyday. If the believers are not dancing and shouting unto the Lord at Mass then when will they do it? Some may gather in His presence more then twice a week, but my guess is that most of the most faithful church goers only come that one Saturday or Sunday.

JL: Sorta like most Protestants go on Sunday only. As a former non-denominational Protestant, I know very few attend mid-week services and most only go Sunday morning and few go Sunday evening. As far as Catholics dancing and shouting, Your brand of Protestantism says the same about, Presbyterians, Methodist, Lutheran etc… You would have said the same about my non-denomination, there was Amens at the sermon, no dancing. Now if you want to talk about Catholics who speak in tongues, I have seen both shouting and dancing, after the liturgy of the Word and before the sacrifice of the mass. I assume you are with the 4square church, a Pentecostal group. Most Protestant’s call them holy rollers. Protestant groups oppose one another just as they oppose the Catholic Church, which is the only thing most Protestants agree on.

 

[4Squarebaby]

JL: Sorta like most Protestants go on Sunday only. As a fromer non-denominational Prostestant, I know very few attend mid-week services and most only go Sunday morning and few go Sunday evening…

Which is why the shouting of praise as a body does indeed happen during Sunday/Saturday services.

 

[Thorwald]

I do not wish to offend you but you offend me with what you say about our Blessed Lady, the Mother of God. We do not worship her at all, please note.

We love and honour her and recognise the role she has played in our lives - and continues to play. I am very sorry for your offensive words in regard to our beloved Mother. Your Mother too

Cinette

I am very well aware of the ‘honour’ placed upon Mary, by the Catholic Church. That is your privilege. Any honour bestowed upon Mary by God, is between God and Mary. I am not commanded by God to bestow any honour upon her, beyond the knowledge that she is the mother of our Lord Jesus Christ. I find no ‘special powers’ granted to her, that I need, in order to become saved, or live my life in a way that is pleasing to God.

I am not trying to be offensive. The Word of God has been given unto us. It tells us the way to salvation, and what we must do or not do. I find no requirement to ‘worship’ Mary being commanded unto me. This is the only point that I am trying to make. If you wish to worship Mary, go ahead. Just don’t judge my Christian behaviour based on whether or not I worship Mary in any way. Thanks.

Thorwald Johansen

 

[Thorwald]

So God was wrong when he commanded us to respect our parents?

God told us to ‘honour’ our parents. We do this by following the Word of God. We dishonour our parents by following satan.

Thorwald Johansen

 

[SteveGC]

We are not told by Christ to ‘worship’ Mary, or put her on any kind of pedistal. Man has chosen to do so. By doing so, the Word of God has been added to. Thorwald Johansen

First of all, we do not worship Mary.
Second, are you saying the “Word of God” is the Bible? For even the Bible calls Jesus the Word of God. And so, you are saying “we are adding to Jesus”. And yet, the Bible once again tells us, that there are many teachings of Christ not written down. Hence tradition is necessary. Nevertheless, there is nothing in Sacred Scripture which refutes the veneration due to the Blessed Mother of our Lord.

God Bless

 

[Cinette]

God told us to ‘honour’ our parents. We do this by following the Word of God. We dishonour our parents by following satan.

Thorwald Johansen

So honouring the Blessed Mother we are following satan???

You continue to insult. Is this why you come to the Forum?

Cinette:bigyikes::bigyikes:

 

[SteveGC]

God told us to ‘honour’ our parents. We do this by following the Word of God. We dishonour our parents by following satan.

Thorwald Johansen

And so…

We must honor our parents. But it is against the Word of God (which for you, is the Bible, not Christ) to honor Mary, even though Christ did throughout his life. He did, but we are not supposed to. We are not to imitate Him. That’s your theory?

God Bless

p.s. Cinette, in Thorwald’s defense, I don’t think he was associating Mary with Satan. I think he was just making a point about how we honor and dishonor our parents.