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rpp
Guest
Christ did not spend time with sinners to join in their debauchery. Christ called people out their debauchery.
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rpp
Guest
This is a good question. Let me ask it in a different way.
** Would you take your grandmother to this club and let her watch you do this?**
My question is not intended to be rhetorical. I would like to OP to answer it and explain his answer.
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Cari
Guest
Yes. This is turning another person into an object, reducing them to a- their physical beauty and b-the pleasure they give you. Neither of these are “loving your neighbor as yourself” nor are they recognizing the image of God stamped on each human being.
I know you want the general concensus to say “no biggie”, but really, you need to look at the situation from an eternal standpoint.
po18guy
Well-known member
However, Grandma can kill your body, but cannot cast your soul into hell. God, Who sees everything, can both kill the body and cast the soul into eternal fire. As Catholics, we are called to holiness. This means that we reject this world in favor of the next. We specifically reject those practices and beliefs of this world (abortion, euthanasia, homosexual marriage, freak dancing, etc.), as ungodly, and unholy.
Could anyone in this club know, from looking at you, or from your behavior, that you were Catholic? If not, you are in danger.
Christ’s peace.
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rpp
Guest
Excellent answer.
I wonder what the OP’s thoughts are.
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rwoehmke
Guest
I might say that for some of us our favorite mortal sin can’t be that bad. When it’s one of one’s favorite sins it can get difficult to admit the truth. We twist and turn and squirm trying to justify it as not to bad or only venial, but we know deep down that it is not venial. Just asking the question is an indication that somehow we really do know better. 
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jackhf12
Guest
I’m sorry but I go out to clubs all the time and I don’t believe this is a sin for everyone. I can accept that if you are intending to get something out of it sexually then yes some may consider it a sin. But for most(including myself) this ‘freak dancing’, if thats what you crazy kids are calling it now, is just a way to let loose and have fun. Not in a sexual way or anything, certainly not for myself because I dance with many of my friends in what some would call a provocative manner, but there’s no sexual feelings there, just good old simple fun, and we would never consider it suggestive.
Remember the good old days when showing a bit of ankle was provocative. I’m sure if we took a person from a hundred years ago and showed them someone wearing shorts, they would think them sinful and very suggestive, but today the idea of that sounds ludicrous.
Basically I think it just comes down to the individual. If you associate this type of dancing with lustful thoughts then perhaps you should stop and examine it. Otherwise boogie on down:thumbsup:
Remember the good old days when showing a bit of ankle was provocative. I’m sure if we took a person from a hundred years ago and showed them someone wearing shorts, they would think them sinful and very suggestive, but today the idea of that sounds ludicrous.
Basically I think it just comes down to the individual. If you associate this type of dancing with lustful thoughts then perhaps you should stop and examine it. Otherwise boogie on down:thumbsup:
po18guy
Well-known member
If it is not sexual acting out, then what is it? It does not resemble painting a house, working at a computer, or any human activity but sexual relations! The clothing saves you from being arrested, but does not shield you from judgment.
This is a 100% worldly activity. This is revelry. If you receive communion, how can you subject Jesus Christ, Whom you carry inside of you, to such lascivious, unrepentant behavior? It is He Who judges you after having called you to repentance. Read the stories of Sodom and Gemorrah. See the similarities in behavior. They believed they would be spared, because “everyone was doing it”.
“This is my beloved Son. Listen to Him”
Christ’s peace.
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jackhf12
Guest
Like I said its a way to relax and have fun. A good way to vent after a particularly tough day i find. And no I do not mean vent sexually
And did I say that because everyone else is doing it then it ok? No i did not. I said if the individual derives sexually pleasure from dancing like this, then it would be advisable to stop. Just as I would advise someone that derives sexual pleasure from painting a house or working at a computer to stop. Just because you feel the activity may have sexual connotations it does not mean it does.
But for me I most certainly do not get some sort of sexual kick out of dancing. I enjoy it the same way as I enjoy reading, cycling or posting on this forum. Simply its a break where it gives a person a chance to relax and forget about their worldly concerns for a short time. And no I would not be ashamed to know Jesus or my grandmother were watching me do this since I don’t see it as sexual, shameful or a sin.
Like I said, this is a matter for a persons own conscience to decide upon.
And did I say that because everyone else is doing it then it ok? No i did not. I said if the individual derives sexually pleasure from dancing like this, then it would be advisable to stop. Just as I would advise someone that derives sexual pleasure from painting a house or working at a computer to stop. Just because you feel the activity may have sexual connotations it does not mean it does.
But for me I most certainly do not get some sort of sexual kick out of dancing. I enjoy it the same way as I enjoy reading, cycling or posting on this forum. Simply its a break where it gives a person a chance to relax and forget about their worldly concerns for a short time. And no I would not be ashamed to know Jesus or my grandmother were watching me do this since I don’t see it as sexual, shameful or a sin.
Like I said, this is a matter for a persons own conscience to decide upon.
po18guy
Well-known member
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teachccd
Guest
Maybe some time for a little conscience formation…
I may not get aroused at homosexual pornography but that does not make it alright for me to view it. There are actions that by their very nature are immoral whether or not your conscience thinks that they are or not. A club where people are “grinding” their privates together is not a moral atmosphere regardless of your inability to see the vulgarity of this type of behavior. Many prostitutes admit to having absolutely no sexual feelings while engaging in their acts but would you say that because of that prostitution is not a sin? With your logic how could it be? The person is just there doing their job. Yea, a little bit ludicrous wouldn’t you think??
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adeezy
Guest
I figured this would be debated amongst people.
I actually agree with jack. In most cases, it’s just fun. It’s just the way dancing is today. Many dancing is subjected to touch, I am not an expert on dance but I know for instance swing dancing, some formal types, and salsa involve “touching” of such private parts. Some look even more provocative than freak dancing. These kinds of dances are performed at competitions where “elegance” is a necessity. Elegance is almost paired to morality, and there is certainly no ill intent.
Sin has been always something described because there is an ill intent behind the action, an evil behind what was done. Sometimes, there isn’t any evil at all, it can lead to evil. But I think it’s no worse than going to a beach and getting tempted by all the “hot” ladies.
Sometimes its just good fun to a different standard. Sometimes… yea, I could admit that there was ill intent, but sometimes it’s just plain old fun. But definitely not all the time is it a mortal sin.
I actually agree with jack. In most cases, it’s just fun. It’s just the way dancing is today. Many dancing is subjected to touch, I am not an expert on dance but I know for instance swing dancing, some formal types, and salsa involve “touching” of such private parts. Some look even more provocative than freak dancing. These kinds of dances are performed at competitions where “elegance” is a necessity. Elegance is almost paired to morality, and there is certainly no ill intent.
Sin has been always something described because there is an ill intent behind the action, an evil behind what was done. Sometimes, there isn’t any evil at all, it can lead to evil. But I think it’s no worse than going to a beach and getting tempted by all the “hot” ladies.
Sometimes its just good fun to a different standard. Sometimes… yea, I could admit that there was ill intent, but sometimes it’s just plain old fun. But definitely not all the time is it a mortal sin.
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Jea9
Guest
Just because something is “generally” accepted does not make it moral. Most of the world does not see anything wrong with Miss America, Miss Universe, the Victoria’s Secret “Fashion Show”, etc. but that does not make them morally ok. If only one time you were sexually excited by this dance then it should be considered a mortal sin, and any future time you engaged in the activity would be an occasion of sin. You say that it does not always arouse you, but how will you know when it will? I say it’s best to avoid it altogether and then you don’t have to worry about it.
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MementoMori3283
Guest
I get it. From the OP and others, some don’t see it as wrong. Bring Jesus and He will show you the way. Really, bring Jesus the next time out on the dance floor and He will show the way to Truth.The premise of my rhetorical question was to awaken any sense of embarrassment that one might have if they knew that Jesus would accompany them to such an establishment. It was not to undermine the many attempts that Jesus made to call sinners to Himself. After all, that is why He came.
I’m sorry that you did not see the intent of my post…God Bless…teachccd
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Neil_Anthony
Guest
Hi,
Any sin against chastity is objectively mortal. It could be venial if full knowledge or full intent was not there, but that doesn’t seem to be the case here.
"Sins against the virtue of chastity differ from sins against most other virtues in one notable point: thought, word, or action against the virtue of chastity, if fully deliberate, is always a mortal sin. One may violate any other virtue deliberately, and yet sin venially because of the slightness of the matter. " - The Faith Explained, Third Edition, Fr. Leo J. Trese
On the other hand, this dancing if not a “expression of sexual pleasure” would be a sin against modesty, which might or might not be mortal, depending on the gravity.
My opinion: it’s extremely scandalous and provocative. It’s hard to imagine someone being so blind and absorbed in the culture that they wouldn’t have the knowledge or intent for it to be a mortal sin.
You have a chance to witness to your faith here by not participating in this type of dancing. Surely not everyone does this stuff.
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petitfleur
Guest
You asked a question…got the answer…did not like it…now you argue. 
Why dont you ask your parish priest what he thinks just to be on the safe side. When it comes to my salvation I dont want to take stupid chances.
Why dont you ask your parish priest what he thinks just to be on the safe side. When it comes to my salvation I dont want to take stupid chances.
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zzzmmm
Guest
OK…so what kinds of dancing ARE acceptable?
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