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Dakota_Roberts
Guest
The Reformation was a bit after the Middle AgesI’d hardly call burning at the stake of protestants and black death the Golden Age.
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fakename
Guest
user "AngryAtheist8":
So technically, if monks were appointed to all the places I said, the Catholic Church would not be under the control of those institutions; they would be secular.
It wouldn’t cause major changes based on some estimates of mine: it doesn’t cost much to feed and house a monk, or to transport them to where they need to be in order to oversee the company/corporate business, after all private citizens do this all the time. It would cost more to establish a regulatory bureau and to hire ,what I’m told, are apparently armies of bureaucrats who have to be paid more than a man who has to take a vow of poverty should get.
So it would not be expensive or particularly intrusive, for there are no regulatory directives or regulators combing the country: only as many monks as there are companies of a certain size/influence. Think of it as establishing a sort of jedi-knighthood. If full monks are too Catholic or denominational, then third order quasi-monks could be used.
This system would do for morality what rabbis overseeing kosher food lines does for food.
And all products could come stamped with a morality “seal of approval”. Personally I don’t think that this would cause damaging change except perhaps in some small areas, while general improvements could be made and snowball into a gradual evolution of standards.
Sorry that was a bit much but you get my point I’m sure.
Like I said, this might be controversial to you but basically for Catholics being a monk is not a sufficient condition for being a clergyman and being a clergyman is not a necessary condition for being a monk.
So technically, if monks were appointed to all the places I said, the Catholic Church would not be under the control of those institutions; they would be secular.
It wouldn’t cause major changes based on some estimates of mine: it doesn’t cost much to feed and house a monk, or to transport them to where they need to be in order to oversee the company/corporate business, after all private citizens do this all the time. It would cost more to establish a regulatory bureau and to hire ,what I’m told, are apparently armies of bureaucrats who have to be paid more than a man who has to take a vow of poverty should get.
So it would not be expensive or particularly intrusive, for there are no regulatory directives or regulators combing the country: only as many monks as there are companies of a certain size/influence. Think of it as establishing a sort of jedi-knighthood. If full monks are too Catholic or denominational, then third order quasi-monks could be used.
This system would do for morality what rabbis overseeing kosher food lines does for food.
And all products could come stamped with a morality “seal of approval”. Personally I don’t think that this would cause damaging change except perhaps in some small areas, while general improvements could be made and snowball into a gradual evolution of standards.
Sorry that was a bit much but you get my point I’m sure.
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David_Castlen
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How many, how many burnings were done by Catholic Clergy?I’d hardly call burning at the stake of protestants and black death the Golden Age.
The black plague was bad. So was polio, so is cancer…
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
I have always wanted to fly.
You miss the point. When the Catholic church became “the ruler” life improved dramatically in all areas. From dirt poor to a roof and a floor without insects and rats is a big improvement. The reason the seculars and the Protestants have been successful in their propoganda about the life in the Middle Ages is two-fold: Currently, to compare life styles to then leaves one with a deplorable view of “back then.” And secondly, Prostestants (especially Elizabeth) told and continue to tell so many lies about the Chruch it is unbelievable. Do not doubt, look it up: **the Middle Ages is Golden Age./**QUOTE]
According to what standard?
Does more Church control automatically = better in your eyes?
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
Are you serious?
There are so many things wrong with this post that I don’t know where to start?
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
From what I understand they usually delegated that to the secular authorities after pronouncing judgment.**How many, how many burnings were done by Catholic Clergy? **The black plague was bad. So was polio, so is cancer…
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David_Castlen
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David Castlen;9226028:
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According to what standard?
Does more Church control automatically = better in your eyes?
I am telling you what happened in the past. I do not know what would happen now. Image if our country was run by the liberal bishops we have now?
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David_Castlen
Guest
It was ussually a pronouncement from a securlar authority; ALBEIT, the secular authority were Catholics. But note this, Elizabeth killed mercelessly Catholics - thousands. You seldom hear of that. Remember this: When the Church became the ruler, deaths from the government declined dramactically.
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perro_sarnoso
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Sorry,
Just a mangy dog…
America would look like Israel except…Jesus would be recognized as God Incarnate.
We would receive the same attacks and chastisements from Muslims as they do… but not the territorial dilemmas that they confront.
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
It was ussually a pronouncement from a securlar authority; ALBEIT, the secular authority were Catholics. But note this, Elizabeth killed mercelessly Catholics - thousands. You seldom hear of that. **Remember this: When the Church became the ruler, deaths from the government declined dramactically./**QUOTE]
How does that square away with the claim (made in this thread) that the Catholic Church never really ruled (except in the Papal States)?
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BillP
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What planet’s Middle Ages are you attempting to describe? Because it most certainly is NOT the one which prevailed in Western Europe on Earth from the 6th to the 16th Century.
**No one **lived without insects and rats, that’s how the Black Death which killed between 1/4 and 1/3 of Europe (compared to the Black Death, even the worst excesses of WWI, WWI & the Communist purges are a "walk in the park
!Women and commoners were more or less chattel, subject to every whim of their husband or Lord.
There was little or no education, even what passed for education in those days for most people was encompassed by the bare ability to slowly and laboriously read Latin.
There was little to no opportunity to become anything other than what you father was, and no opportunity at all for women)!!
There was no science.
Technology had actually regressed since the fall of Rome and almost no one had access to clean drinking water or proper sanitation.
You’ve been reading too much fiction.
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BillP
Guest
This is simply nonsense (which is probably why you never hear of it). I think you’re confusing Elizabeth with her Catholic sister Mary, who did indeed kill thousands, albeit they were Protestants. BTW, she was attempting to reimpose Catholicism on her subjects.
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Dakota_Roberts
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Hundreds actually, but don’t worry, her daddy killed tens of thousands in the Anglican Reformation
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David_Castlen
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Wrong, Mary had some people put to death for political reasons as did all Kings and Queens, but ole’ Elizabeth killed many many many more just because they were Catholics and priest in particular. Read Thomas Woods’ history of the Middle Ages you may want to look at his book “How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization”.
Catholics lost the propoganda war to a very aggressive anti-Catholic protestant world that has been support by secular propogantist. Currently, most people believe that Pope Pius the XII was an anti Jew, when in fact, few if any ever helped the jews more than him. Read MIT graduate Joe Shoeman’s conversion story “Salvation is of the Jews.”
YOu have bought into the propoganda. The Catholic Church is the greatest thing that has ever happened to this earth. Its art, its music, its science, its Charity, its hospitals, its salvation to the American Indians, on and on and on and on.
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AngryAtheist8
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Both Catholics and Protestants got kind of murder-happy during that time:shrug:
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
Actually David you’re the one who appears to buying the propaganda.
Saying things like THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS THE GREATEST THING EVER! hardly make you look reasonable and objective.
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
Salvation?
What salvation?
Are you referring to the Spanish conquest (and destruction of the native civilizations) that occured in South America?
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tafan
Guest
Aa, I would suggest you consider the answer to the following question: in what countries of the western hemisphere are native American descendants the predominant population and in what countries are they a vast minority? Then you can start ignoring the remnants of the English black myth we in the US grew up learning and start investigAting why. it may be that the policy of externiation adopted north of the Rio Grande was never the policy elsewhere. Considering the two alternatives, it would seem salvation is not too strong of a term.Salvation?
What salvation?
Are you referring to the Spanish conquest (and destruction of the native civilizations) that occured in South America?
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David_Castlen
Guest
Yes, a great thing.Salvation?
What salvation?
Are you referring to the Spanish conquest (and destruction of the native civilizations) that occured in South America?
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AngryAtheist8
Guest
Originally Posted by AngryAtheist8
Salvation?
What salvation?
Are you referring to the Spanish conquest (and destruction of the native civilizations) that occured in South America?
Salvation?
What salvation?
Are you referring to the Spanish conquest (and destruction of the native civilizations) that occured in South America?
Was that *great *before or after the Spanish had to import African slaves into places like Brazil as laborers because they worked too many of the natives to death?
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