I stand corrected. Belief is required but now the thought is that it may be an internal fire in our soul rather than a physical place of torment.
I remember awhile back a Catholic poster proposed that non-Catholic believers also believe in a purgatory, they just have not called it that. That purgatory or purging process is Jesus who is there interceeding for us, at the moment we arrive at the gate, if Jesus claims us as one of His own, He steps forward and proclaims that all is covered by His blood. Purgatory in an instant!
Let’s look at the catechism section on Purgatory first, as there is a scriptural basis for this. By prayers, we are making atonement for the dead person’s sins, that the person at that point is not allowed to make.
Purgatory is often analogized with the example of a kid who throws a baseball through the window of his family home and breaks the window. The kid then faces his angry father. Kid cries and says he is sorry for breaking the window and won’t do it again. The father, out of love for his child, sets aside his wrath, hugs his repentant kid, and forgives him. This is basically confession and absolution.
You have this a bit wrong. Catholics do not “purchase” things at funerals. You get a prayer card at the funeral to remember the deceased and maybe remind you to pray for them. Same thing happens at Protestant funerals.
I understand the analogy but I was raised with a very loving father who would never have demanded that I would, when unable, have to pay for the window. Out of his love and forgiveness he would pay for it himself, and never remind me again of my transgression.Wannano:
Let’s look at the catechism section on Purgatory first, as there is a scriptural basis for this. By prayers, we are making atonement for the dead person’s sins, that the person at that point is not allowed to make.
Purgatory is often analogized with the example of a kid who throws a baseball through the window of his family home and breaks the window. The kid then faces his angry father. Kid cries and says he is sorry for breaking the window and won’t do it again. The father, out of love for his child, sets aside his wrath, hugs his repentant kid, and forgives him. This is basically confession and absolution.
However, the kid still has to pay for the new window. This is purgatory.
Think of our prayers as if we donated some money to help pay for the window, thus reducing the amount the kid had to pay - and reducing his time in purgatory.
Another way prayers might work is to make purgatory more comfortable for the person while they are there. So let’s say the kid got a job to make money to pay for the window and he was working really hard and sweating in the hot sun. Our prayers might be as if we brought him a giant size cold Coke with lots of ice. He still has to work (serve time in Purgatory) but he’s not as uncomfortable.
Hope this helps.
Yes, ok, I can see I used the wrong word. Sorry, I wasn’t thinking of how loaded the word “purchase” is. Paying the stipend to have the priest perform a Mass is definitely softer language.Wannano:
You have this a bit wrong. Catholics do not “purchase” things at funerals. You get a prayer card at the funeral to remember the deceased and maybe remind you to pray for them. Same thing happens at Protestant funerals.
Sometimes at the funeral there is a donation box for the deceased’s favorite charity or to help his family with the expenses. If you put money in there, it goes to the charity or to the family.
If a Catholic wishes to have a Mass said as part of one’s prayers for the deceased, then you go over to the church of your choice or to the online website of your choice offering Masses (which may be a parish church, a monastery or a mission, etc. ) and pay the stipend for the Mass, write the name of the deceased. Your Mass will then be said by a priest. At a parish, you may (or may not) be able to request a specific day for the Mass so you can attend it or have it said on the dead person’s birthday etc.
There is a special series of Masses for the dead called Gregorian Masses that were established under Pope Gregory. If you have these said, you can feel confident that you have made your best effort on behalf of the deceased person, although it is still up to God whether he will let the person out of purgatory (and it’s possible the person is already out of Purgatory or even that they went to Hell, in which case God would apply the grace elsewhere). You can request these from a place that offers them, typically a monastery or mission as the parishes get too many requests for regular Masses to handle the Gregorian series.
Thanks, is it also fair to say no one knows how long it takes either?
Since God’s time is nothing like our time, and God also determines the time for each soul and doesn’t tell us, we would have absolutely no idea.
Please pardon my ignorance but I am wondering why those in purgatory don’t pray for their loved ones on earth unless the loved ones first pray for them.
The priest could conceivably agree to say a Mass without the stipend, for example if a very poor person needed a Mass said. It is very important to the Church that Masses not be seen as being “purchased” or “sold”, as discussed here about halfway down the page. The Church is really sensitive to not wanting to be seen as selling Masses, indulgences, relics etc because of the abuses in the past that led to the Protestant schism among other things.
My loved one, like my mom, might (most probably she WOULD) pray for me. But when we pray for “souls in purgatory” we are often praying for a whole bunch of people we don’t know. I have prayed for thousands of souls in purgatory over the past year. I maybe only knew two dozen of them.
That article was very interesting and informative. That a priest can only keep the stipend for one Mass even though a hundred others paid the stipend for the same intention is informative for sure. I needed to know that.Wannano:
The priest could conceivably agree to say a Mass without the stipend, for example if a very poor person needed a Mass said. It is very important to the Church that Masses not be seen as being “purchased” or “sold”, as discussed here about halfway down the page. The Church is really sensitive to not wanting to be seen as selling Masses, indulgences, relics etc because of the abuses in the past that led to the Protestant schism among other things.
http://canonlawmadeeasy.com/2008/02/22/mass-intentions-and-stipends/
Couldn’t they also just pray “for all the souls on earth?”Wannano:
My loved one, like my mom, might (most probably she WOULD) pray for me. But when we pray for “souls in purgatory” we are often praying for a whole bunch of people we don’t know. I have prayed for thousands of souls in purgatory over the past year. I maybe only knew two dozen of them.
How is a total stranger in purgatory going to know to pray for me, if I don’t pray for them first?