What would count as absolute proof that God exists?

[0thetrooth0]

1.What you are describing is the capability of a person to think beyond the natural environment. If one can swing a bat, it doesn’t make any difference if one hits a baseball or a watermelon, the first important thing is that the person has the capability to swing a bat.

2.The second important thing is that the person, with the capability to swing a bat, also knows the difference between a baseball and a watermelon and therefore can choose to swing at either or not swing.

3.The third important thing is that the person, with the capability to swing a bat, with the ability to choose to swing or not, also knows that a baseball belongs in a game and that the watermelon belongs on a plate ready to be eaten.

4.The fourth important thing is that the person described above also knows that the baseball is not intended as nourishment and hopefully she or he will seek more appropriate food than a watermelon.

The absolute proof that God exists needs to come from within the person who is looking for proof of God. The criteria is not the perfection of the proof; the criteria is that the proof works for that individual. The four points presented above could serve as a prime analogy to help someone reason to the existence of God.

I realize that I am answering post 7 and thus there are a lot of posts I haven’t read. However, point 1 has been rolling between my ears as an answer to the imagination of aliens and pink unicorns which can be a flaw when it comes to imagining or thinking about God.

I have no clue if any of the four points will really work because I am depending on the other person to spot what may be analogous in his or her search for a proof for God’s existence which is similar to the prime analogy above.

this post confused me, i dont understand what you said, can you dumb it down a bit

 

[0thetrooth0]

The point is not any faith in anything; the real point is that humans have the capability to think of something beyond one’s natural environment. Go back to the dawn of human history. What do you find in oral stories? Explanations of what? Describe the talent of shamans.

its a fact that we humans only know about 5% of everything, in that 95% there couls be nature spirits, gods, God, other dimensions etc.

i do think there are other things beyond this physical world and out of the reach of our 5 senses but that doesnt mean God exists

shamans didnt dont believe in a personal God that rewards and punishes… so yea… u cant use shamans to justify ur point or ur beliefs because shamans dont agree with alot of what you believe

about shamans, theres stories about how they talk to animas and travel to other dimensions, lets say alot of this stuff is true, it only shows that there are things that we dont yet understand and that are beyond science and religion,

science is just barely understanding the world/universe it discovers new things everyday, quantum physcis, etc and also keep in mind that there are people in the higher realms of science that hide certain information for themselves

religion gives us a certain world view ,it gets us locked in that world view, faith doesnt give us the answers it only stops us from asking the questions

 

[SonSearcher]

its a fact that we humans only know about 5% of everything, in that 95% there couls be nature spirits, gods, God, other dimensions etc.

i do think there are other things beyond this physical world and out of the reach of our 5 senses but that doesnt mean God exists

shamans didnt dont believe in a personal God that rewards and punishes… so yea… u cant use shamans to justify ur point or ur beliefs because shamans dont agree with alot of what you believe

about shamans, theres stories about how they talk to animas and travel to other dimensions, lets say alot of this stuff is true, it only shows that there are things that we dont yet understand and that are beyond science and religion,

science is just barely understanding the world/universe it discovers new things everyday, quantum physcis, etc and also keep in mind that there are people in the higher realms of science that hide certain information for themselves

religion gives us a certain world view ,it gets us locked in that world view, faith doesnt give us the answers it only stops us from asking the questions

It seems to me that even if you are using 5% of everything that paints you in a smaller corner than choosing a religion.

You are wrong Faith gives more answers than just making your own worldview. I would like to pose a question to your extremely literal self. If we only know 5% of everything then how can we be sure that God doesn’t exist?

Maybe this post should have started as “Hey guys I am going to tell you why I don’t believe in God, over the course of many hours, and no matter how many ideas we come across I will not change my mind so have fun trying.”

 

[0thetrooth0]

Atheists and agnostics should be very humble people who concern themselves with no religion at all. But most times they are too concerned with proving believers wrong. Instead of just accepting their place as a non-believer they seek out believers and try to change their mind.

This leads me to think that some of these folks must want to find God. The reason they seek us out to prove us wrong is to find the proof of existence. I think no human on earth can satisfactorily answer the question that was posed by the OP if he does not want to accept the undeniable Truth of the existence of God.

They say they want miracles, already happened. They want it in written form, point 'em to Aquinas. They want to see a true Christian, we shed light on the Saints in no particular order. Whatever we do isn’t enough. It is God’s call which will finally make the paradigm shift whole. Because that is what it is. A shift in the whole view of every aspect of human existence.

So we can argue until the Earth folds up like a scroll, or we can just pray for them. I prefer prayer. It is the single thing that will change the world.

i used to be comfortable with seeing a true christian, written form etc. but then i realized, that an all powerful being aka God can surely give us WAY better evidence/miracles/proofs

 

[SonSearcher]

i used to be comfortable with seeing a true christian, written form etc. but then i realized, that an all powerful being aka God can surely give us WAY better evidence/miracles/proofs

but that is the point. The evidence is all around us. He doesn’t need to do anything else for you, you need to accept his existence and it will make sense. He is God and you are creation.

It is like a teacher student relationship, a father son relationship. The son doesn’t question the existence of the father, he just accepts it.

 

[0thetrooth0]

Truth Seeker/Leaker

what is a truth seeker/leaker?

its some complex stuff, but to put it simply its something around the lines of:

a truth seeker is someone who seeks the truth, who wants to know the truth, a truth leaker is somone who knows the truth and shares it

maybe will never know the truth

maybe certain people/beings/illuminati know the truth but will not share

maybe will only know the truth when we die

our minds are built in such a way that we cant be 100% sure what is the truth

…

 

[hazcompat]

i used to be comfortable with seeing a true christian, written form etc. but then i realized, that an all powerful being aka God can surely give us WAY better evidence/miracles/proofs

Matthew 16:1 The Pharisees and Sadducees came and, to test him, asked him to show them a sign from heaven. 2* He said to them in reply, “[In the evening you say, ‘Tomorrow will be fair, for the sky is red’; 3b and, in the morning, ‘Today will be stormy, for the sky is red and threatening.’ You know how to judge the appearance of the sky, but you cannot judge the signs of the times.] 4c An evil and unfaithful generation seeks a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah.”* Then he left them and went away.

peace

 

[0thetrooth0]

but that is the point. The evidence is all around us. He doesn’t need to do anything else for you, you need to accept his existence and it will make sense. He is God and you are creation.

It is like a teacher student relationship, a father son relationship. The son doesn’t question the existence of the father, he just accepts it.

the son sees the father, we dont see God, see the difference? xtraordinary claims require xtraordinary evidence, period! end of story

if theists say God exists they must prove it, if atheists say God doesnt exist they most prove it, but they cant prove God doesnt exist, but we CAN prove God does exist, by seeing him, seeing xtraordinary miracles be performed by God right infront of us, etc

the evidence is all around us? all we can say is we see the sky the sun trees other people etc thats all we can say, eveyrthing we see hear, touch ,etc only proves that that particular thing exists

Einstein said something like we are like children in a big library, we dont know what the books are for or what were doing here…

a philosopher once said… all i know is that i know nothing

 

[jochoa]

i used to be comfortable with seeing a true christian, written form etc. but then i realized, that an all powerful being aka God can surely give us WAY better evidence/miracles/proofs

My friend, please consider the following proofs:

Proof #1: www.gospelofcreation.com

Proof #2: The following is an intro to recognizing the Fullness of Truth:

1. We think, therefore we do not know, therefore we must have faith. Since you and I have faith, why not place our faith in something greater, something hopeful?
   2a. One of the greatest hopes in dying is Heaven. In order to recognize a possibility for Heaven existing, one must ponder what was the first thing to exist as a physical substance. There are two options: the first thing had to either be living or non-living. If we assume the first thing is non-living, then all things up to the first life would have been non-living and would have had no ability to create a Heaven. Therefore a greater and more hopeful faith will not only place its trust in a Heaven, but also a single all-powerful God. Two reasons for a single all-powerful God are: 1. If we believe the first thing was living, then all things following came from that single living being. 2. If we believe the first thing created a Heaven and the living being created other all-powerful Gods, then the other Gods could destroy the Heaven and Earth that was created.
   2b. Since every person wants and fulfills various wants, we all want happiness. However in order to experience a genuine happiness, there must be peace. And in order to have peace, there must be complete patience, and in order to experience any degree of happiness, there must be kindness. Therefore, it can be said that the greatest actions in living to master are patience and kindness for one will experience an unbreakable peace and perfect happiness. Next recognize that it is the Holy Bible that declares this first, “…the greatest of these is charity/love” 1 Corinthians 13:13 where “Charity/Love is Patient and Kind.” 1 Corinthians 13:4.
   At this point, one should also recognize that it is the Holy Bible that first declares, “Now these three remain: Faith, Hope, and Charity/Love.” Given the wisdom of the Holy Bible is Truth, one has the option of crediting the Author(s) of the Holy Bible for the revelation of the Truth or one can discredit it. If one credits it, s/he will give all glory to the one God, Jesus Christ, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as well as credit to His Universal Church for overcoming the challenges of spreading the Word. If one discredits it, one will live as though they are self-made.

From this point, if one will ponder, talk about, and heavily focus on mastering patience, kindness, and motivation for God with all the body, spirit, thoughts, and will equally towards others and the self, for the sake of unbreakable peace, limitless happiness, and unstoppable energy as a society and individual, all other Truths of the Catholic Faith will become evident, especially because s/he will be striving to become one with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ.

My friend, I thoroughly enjoyed responding to you. You have helped me grow in understanding by asking questions, and I greatly appreciate you asking. May your day be filled with peace and happiness, and I look forward to further conversation!

Thoughts?

 

[0thetrooth0]

It seems to me that even if you are using 5% of everything that paints you in a smaller corner than choosing a religion.

You are wrong Faith gives more answers than just making your own worldview. I would like to pose a question to your extremely literal self. If we only know 5% of everything then how can we be sure that God doesn’t exist?

Maybe this post should have started as “Hey guys I am going to tell you why I don’t believe in God, over the course of many hours, and no matter how many ideas we come across I will not change my mind so have fun trying.”

i didnt say God doesnt exist, some people including myself may say he does or doesnt exist, but all of humans deep inside KNOW that we dont KNOW if God exists or not.
Does God exist? i dont know
we should all say we dont know because we dont know! and stay in that neutrality

 

[SonSearcher]

i didnt say God doesnt exist, some people including myself may say he does or doesnt exist, but all of humans deep inside KNOW that we dont KNOW if God exists or not.
Does God exist? i dont know
we should all say we dont know because we dont know! and stay in that neutrality

no winking or thumbsup.

deep inside I know he exists. I look at the atmosphere and say it couldn’t have been chaos that made that. I look at the angle of the earth and say, it is absolutely perfect, if it was even 1 degree to either way we would either burn up or freeze. It can’t just be that way because it just so happened that way.

You are on a Catholic website, that promotes Catholic ideals and doctrine. You are peddling the non-existence of God because **you **are unsure.

 

[hazcompat]

i didnt say God doesnt exist, some people including myself may say he does or doesnt exist, but all of humans deep inside KNOW that we dont KNOW if God exists or not.
Does God exist? i dont know
we should all say we dont know because we dont know! and stay in that neutrality

I know my redeemer lives!

peace

 

[grannymh]

. A shift in the whole view of every aspect of human existence.

.

Obviously, the “whole view of every aspect of human existence” has taken a tremendous shift in this century and the last half of the 20th. That is why contemporary Catholic Apologetics has to defend human nature, itself.

If and when Catholics can focus on basic human nature beginning with the dawn of human history, a demonstration of God’s existence is possible.

Post 55 is a lead-in as to how and why there can be a reasonable proof that God exists per the OP.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=9042105&postcount=55

 

[SonSearcher]

Obviously, the “whole view of every aspect of human existence” has taken a tremendous shift in this century and the last half of the 20th. That is why contemporary Catholic Apologetics has to defend human nature, itself.

If and when Catholics can focus on basic human nature beginning with the dawn of human history, a demonstration of God’s existence is possible.

Post 55 is a lead-in as to how and why there can be a reasonable proof that God exists per the OP.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=9042105&postcount=55

But no matter how much the shift actually is in the last half of the 20th century, I am speaking to the fact that when you put God at the center, everything else makes sense. It falls into place. I am not speaking to how humans now interpret human existence, compared with times before.

I agree with the rest of your statement just needed to clarify.

 

[grannymh]

its a fact that we humans only know about 5% of everything, in that 95% there couls be nature spirits, gods, God, other dimensions etc.

i do think there are other things beyond this physical world and out of the reach of our 5 senses but that doesnt mean God exists

shamans didnt dont believe in a personal God that rewards and punishes… so yea… u cant use shamans to justify ur point or ur beliefs because shamans dont agree with alot of what you believe

about shamans, theres stories about how they talk to animas and travel to other dimensions, lets say alot of this stuff is true, it only shows that there are things that we dont yet understand and that are beyond science and religion,

science is just barely understanding the world/universe it discovers new things everyday, quantum physcis, etc and also keep in mind that there are people in the higher realms of science that hide certain information for themselves

religion gives us a certain world view ,it gets us locked in that world view, faith doesnt give us the answers it only stops us from asking the questions

This is a lot of interesting information. However, I need to rephrase my original questions found in post 55 so it is easier to go back to the dawn of human history.

Post 55, "The point is not any faith in anything; the real point is that humans have the capability to think of something beyond one’s natural environment. Go back to the dawn of human history. What do you find in oral stories? Explanations of what? Describe the talent of shamans. "
Emphasis added in this post.

At the dawn of human history, before the development of a written language, traditions or history of the past were passed on orally. In Alaska, there are still oral stories being told. Some of these stories are similar to the written “myths” in other parts of the world. Stories or myths explained human history plus they were an attempt at explaining natural phenomena. Think about the stories of the Greek and Roman gods as a later history example. What ties these ancient stories together is “information” which goes beyond the natural environment. Whether or not the “information” is true is not the real point. See sentence in bold above.

Personally, I find shamans very interesting since their talents or skills differ from place to place.

This is from Othetrooth0’s post 61.

“about shamans, theres stories about how they talk to animas and travel to other dimensions, lets say alot of this stuff is true, it only shows that there are things that we dont yet understand and that are beyond science and religion,”

What I would like to do is to shift the focus from things we don’t understand, etc., back to the human person known as a “shaman”. What is it that we do know about this person’s human nature? This is a different question from one asking about a shaman’s beliefs in a personal God that rewards and punishes.

Once we truly understand human nature, then one can use this understanding to demonstrate the existence of God.

 

[SonSearcher]

This is the individual we are talking to. I think he needs prayers to help him along. We shouldn’t be trying to defend ourselves here, we should be helping him through this spiritual crisis. I am personally sorry trooth, I will pray for you form now on. Here is one of his original posts.

Hi everyone, I would really appreciate it if you could pray for me. I am 20 years old, my mom is a strong Catholic. my mom prays for me and i am really really thankful for that. I am spiritually lost, im in a state of confusion, i dont know if there is a God or what he wants from me, what is the true religion,what happens after death, etc. i want to know The Truth. when i was little i was Catholic, probably because i was raised in a Catholic household. then i figured out Catholicism was the truth, so iwas Catholic for some time, then i became Atheist than Agnostic, than i started searching for “The Truth” and i came across Islam and other religions, then kabbalah and other similar teachings, to put it simply, i became a truth seeker, i am still truth seeking, when i remember i always ask God to show me the truth, to show me why is the truth or to give me a sign or a miracle or evidence, and to have mercy on me when i die. some of the things i feel is hopelessness, anger, depression, lack of motivation to live, sometimes suicidal, and confusion. I would really apreciate it if you could pray for me, it really brings me joy that there are people outthere kind enough to pray for someone even if they’ve never met them, nice people is one of the things that reminds me that life can be beautiful, Thank You very very much for your prayers.

He needs prayers not arguments. i underlined and bolded for emphasis

 

[grannymh]

But no matter how much the shift actually is in the last half of the 20th century, I am speaking to the fact that when you put God at the center, everything else makes sense. It falls into place. I am not speaking to how humans now interpret human existence, compared with times before.

I agree with the rest of your statement just needed to clarify.

Thank you for the clarification. You and I were seeing two completely different types of shifts.

Out of respect for the ban on evolution discussion, I will simply say that science has produced many benefits for society especially in the medical arena. Nonetheless, natural science is properly limited to the material/physical world around us. It is because of improper interpretations, that there has been a shift, i.e., a downgrading of human nature.

By all means, the realm of natural science is that of the material and physical world. But that does not automatically eliminate the immaterial or spiritual realm from inquiry as if it were non-existent. Ah, one says. The immaterial cannot be put under a microscope. True. But that does not exclude the reality of its existence which can be known by the tools of reason, self reflection, logical evaluation, and analytical thought.

Shifting God from the center of life is the worse shift of all. One of the results of this shift is the ignoring of the complete human nature. By demonstrating that a complete human nature, rational soul and material anatomy, existed at the dawn of human history, one can proceed to a reasonable demonstration of God’s existence.

I just noticed in post 72 that I said reasonable proof – that should have been reasonable demonstration.

 

[Qoeleth]

CATHOLICS LISTEN AND LISTEN GOOD

i could be described as being more or less in the A-team, i do wish there was proof, if given the choice i would prefer a loving personal God that rewards over being a product of random chance of luck or big bang, etc etc.

Having said that, we look at the world universe stars etc, its all some amazing stuff, obviosly we humans cant even come close to producing someting like that, i can only be in awe when i observe the grass, stars , sun, clouds oceans, etc all i can say is wow, whatever whoever did this is powerful,

lets say a being aka God did this, if he wants us to believe in his existence or do what he says, he has to show HIMSELF to us, we have a intelligent brain for a REASON, humans are not creatures that just believe in something without solid evidence, (obviously alot of people are the complete opposite of this but thats another story)

we only do things because we get something out of it, lets be honest with ourselves, we either get fun or happiness or a future reward out of it,

if God exists and his a loving and good God, he would make his existence known to us in the best possible way, the reality/world we live in does not reflect a good and caring God,
if he wants us to obey and know he exists he would speak to us directly or send a angel to speak to us on his behalf, what we have today is just other humans telling us who God is, what he wants from us. etc

if a personal God exists he would talk to us, we would be in heaven instead of this planet, in order for us to appreciate heaven he should send us all to hell for a certain amount of time so we can really appreciate heaven.

if God were to do loads of miracles and do everything we want him to do fo us in order for us to believe he exists i think majority of humans would believe in him, i know i would, lets say were on earth right, so God does all these things, now theres probably gon be people who refuse to believe in him and others who say this is one big matrix a alien teenager created. we cant know for sure its a alien or if its God all we know is we do certain things and will be happy forever, thats all that matter, if were in the real heaven or a created heaven by a alien, who cares? will never KNOW what is the truth, we wud have to accept that we cant know the truth and just look at the glass half full,

the nice thing for God to so is to appear to us, now obviously we humans would know theres a God, the only thing tha shud change is that God tests us even harder than before or makes us suffer more so we can be wortyh of heaven, the difrence with this scenario and the world we live in today is that in my scenario we would go through all bunch of hardships here on earth but we nwe die we wud KNOW will go to heaven, in the world we live in alot of peeple are doing alot of good and going through alot of hardships all so they can go to heaven possibly. but they DONT know if heaven, God, etc even exist.

It seems you have held onto an idea of God, which unfortunately many people still have. This mistaken (or at least primitive) idea of what or who God is, is at the heart of the flourishing of athiesm.

God is not a person, who makes decisions, takes actions, etc., except in a metaphoric, mythological sense. God is the transcendental ‘X’, the thought beyond our thoughts, the destiny of our hopes and desires beyond any of their earthly (or even ‘celestial’) objects- God does not exist in the same way you or I exist- ‘He’ ‘is’ beyond being.

As Eckhart said, we must go beyond ‘God’. You have obviously gone beyond the ‘child’s God’ (the ‘Being’ in Heaven), and perhaps should seek further. Here is some help:
Angelus Silesius: “God is purest naught”
Jacques Derrida: “‘God’ ‘is’ the bottomless collapse of meaning.”

As John of the Cross said, “Faith is a dark night of the soul.”- to ‘believe’ while no longer believing.

Now Jesus (the incarnation of life, death, love and suffering) is the manifestation of this unknown, unperceived, even unimagined God. The self-emptying of God to become one of us. The transcendental ‘other’ becomes the human ‘other’.
If you believe in humanity, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’.
If you can no longer believe in humanity, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’
If you believe in love, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’.
If you have felt or witnessed human suffering, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’.
If you have any hope, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’.
If you have abandoned all hope, you believe ‘God’ ‘exists’.

Many atheists seem to be in a deeper search for God than ‘believers’. And, in not finding Him, thay are perhaps they fulfilling the words of Christ:
“If they say to you, ‘Look, he is in the desert’ do not go there; ‘Look, He is in some hiding place’, do not believe it.” (Mt 24:26)

So, please keep praying for us (even if that prayer takes the form of arguments and scorn), as we will keep praying for you.

 

[Nicko]

My friend, please consider the following proofs:

Proof #1: www.gospelofcreation.com

This is a link to a site that appears to make certain claims regarding evolution. It is my understanding that I am not permitted to discuss this here.

Proof #2: The following is an intro to recognizing the Fullness of Truth:

1. We think, therefore we do not know, therefore we must have faith. Since you and I have faith, why not place our faith in something greater, something hopeful?

If we do not know, the honest thing is to admit that we do not know. I am afraid I simply cannot countenance the “argument” that “we do not know, therefore we must have faith (that we do know)”. It simply makes no sense to me.

2a. One of the greatest hopes in dying is Heaven. In order to recognize a possibility for Heaven existing, one must ponder what was the first thing to exist as a physical substance. There are two options: the first thing had to either be living or non-living. If we assume the first thing is non-living, then all things up to the first life would have been non-living and would have had no ability to create a Heaven. Therefore a greater and more hopeful faith will not only place its trust in a Heaven, but also a single all-powerful God. Two reasons for a single all-powerful God are: 1. If we believe the first thing was living, then all things following came from that single living being. 2. If we believe the first thing created a Heaven and the living being created other all-powerful Gods, then the other Gods could destroy the Heaven and Earth that was created.
2b. Since every person wants and fulfills various wants, we all want happiness. However in order to experience a genuine happiness, there must be peace. And in order to have peace, there must be complete patience, and in order to experience any degree of happiness, there must be kindness. Therefore, it can be said that the greatest actions in living to master are patience and kindness for one will experience an unbreakable peace and perfect happiness. Next recognize that it is the Holy Bible that declares this first, “…the greatest of these is charity/love” 1 Corinthians 13:13 where “Charity/Love is Patient and Kind.” 1 Corinthians 13:4.

The following is paraphrased from a point made by Sam Harris.

Suppose you run into an old friend whom you have not seen for some time. He looks great, healthier than you have ever seen him. When you ask him what has been the cause of this change in his life, he tells you everything changed for him the day he realized he was destined to marry Angelina Jolie.

It might occur to you to ask, why does he believe this?

Angelina Jolie is, after all, one of the most beautiful and famous people on the planet. She’s, not incidentally, married to Brad Pitt. They have something like 27 children. What if your friend, sensing your skepticism, said, “Clearly you don’t understand. This belief gives my life meaning. I now know my purpose in life: it’s to be Angelina’s husband”?

What if your friend said, “This belief has made me a better person. I’m now incredibly kind to children, anticipating having to raise Angelina’s once Brad leaves”?

Or what if your friend said, “You can believe whatever you want, but I wouldn’t want to live in a universe where I don’t marry Angelina Jolie”?

It should be quite clear that your friend has lost his mind …

Beliefs are not like clothing. Comfort, utility and attractiveness cannot be our conscious criteria for adopting them. We should strive to acquire only true beliefs and to rid ourselves of beliefs that are not true.

At this point, one should also recognize that it is the Holy Bible that first declares, “Now these three remain: Faith, Hope, and Charity/Love.” Given the wisdom of the Holy Bible is Truth, one has the option of crediting the Author(s) of the Holy Bible for the revelation of the Truth or one can discredit it. If one credits it, s/he will give all glory to the one God, Jesus Christ, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as well as credit to His Universal Church for overcoming the challenges of spreading the Word.

I find it hard to see how anyone could disagree with this passage. It is absolutely true that if one believes the Bible is the revealed Word of God, one will become a Christian. The former leads to the latter inevitably.

I am unsure, however, why you think that this will impress someone who lacks the belief that the Bible is the revealed Word of God.

If one discredits it, one will live as though they are self-made.

I am unsure why you think that this belief follows from the absence of the belief that the Bible is the revealed Word of God.

From this point, if one will ponder, talk about, and heavily focus on mastering patience, kindness, and motivation for God with all the body, spirit, thoughts, and will equally towards others and the self, for the sake of unbreakable peace, limitless happiness, and unstoppable energy as a society and individual, all other Truths of the Catholic Faith will become evident, especially because s/he will be striving to become one with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ…

Thoughts?

My thoughts are that your faith has obviously had a positive influence on your life and your character. You are a living refutation of Christopher Hitchens’ contention that, “religion poisons everything”.

None of which convinces me that your faith is correct. My own acceptance of my lack of faith had a similarly transformative effect upon my own life, prompting me to take a degree of responsibility over it that had been lacking for some time. But that is not why I am an atheist.

I am an atheist because I have never encountered a reason to believe that God exists. As such, I would be compelled to be an atheist even if it made me miserable. Happily, it doesn’t.

 

[Nicko]

NOTE REGARDING MY LAST POST: It occurs to me that the line, “It should be quite clear that your friend has lost his mind …” may be taken as an assertion that religious people are insane. Such was not the intent of the analogy, and I apologise if anyone takes this meaning away from it.

The analogy is merely intended to illustrate that the positive effects of a belief are not a good reason to suppose the belief is true.