When is ok to live with your girlfriend?

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Adam_Cook

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So…I understand the teaching the church gives of co-habitation and I completely 100% agree with it, but. That being said I am at an odds within myself because of the fact that while I do not want to co-habitate, or live with, my girlfriend prior to marriage, I am faced with several dilemmas. My girlfriend has a history of panic attacks, severe panic attacks. She will panic and then pass out for hours until she regains consciousness and is then pretty lethargic due to the strain of the situation it takes on her. Usually afterward she is scared, so scared and when she is there that is where I want to be.

I love this girl, I want to be there for her and take care of her when something like this happens. Yet, as someone who is in formation to become a Secular Franciscan, I know that I am bound by obedience to the Church and to the teachings of the Church as the Holy Father Francis was, as Christ was to the Father. Yet is it acceptable for me to live with my girlfriend that I could take care of her, love her and be there for her when something like this happens? Currently we are 40 min apart and traveling down there is a lot of gas money so it constrains me from being able to be there for her. This aggravates me, it gets under my skin because even though she is in this state, I can do nothing for her but pray. I can’t physically hold her and tell her she is going to be ok, or help her prevent the attack in the first place. She has therapists that she goes to, but they couldn’t see her today nor this week.

I understand the church’s teaching, but this isn’t about sex or financial security, this is about the fact that I want to be there to take care of this beautiful women that God has given me, this daughter of his that he has entrusted into my hands and me into hers. So at what line does it become acceptable? Or does it never become acceptable even if the reason has behind it a corporeal work of mercy?

Pax.
 
when is it OK to live with your girlfriend? when she is your wife.
 
Adam_Cook said:
Yet is it acceptable for me to live with my girlfriend that I could take care of her, love her and be there for her when something like this happens?
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No. If she needs professional medical or psychological care she should get it. You trying to take on the role of caregiver may actually be detrimental to her getting help and getting better. You are not her rescuer. If she is not in a mental or physical state to be on her own, perhaps it is best if she is with her parents until she is better.
Adam_Cook said:
Currently we are 40 min apart and traveling down there is a lot of gas money so it constrains me from being able to be there for her. This aggravates me, it gets under my skin because even though she is in this state, I can do nothing for her but pray. I can’t physically hold her and tell her she is going to be ok, or help her prevent the attack in the first place. She has therapists that she goes to, but they couldn’t see her today nor this week.
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Again, this is not your role, and you should not try to take it on. She needs professional help. Perhaps she will need a lot of it before she will be in a position to be a wife or mother.
Adam_Cook said:
I understand the church’s teaching, but this isn’t about sex or financial security, this is about the fact that I want to be there to take care of this beautiful women that God has given me, this daughter of his that he has entrusted into my hands and me into hers.
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You are confusing your role. God has given her parents to take care of her, not you.
Adam_Cook said:
So at what line does it become acceptable? Or does it never become acceptable even if the reason has behind it a corporeal work of mercy?
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If you are a licensed caregiver, then it would be appropriate to give her care. But, even for caregivers who become emotionally involved with patients this is a conflict of interest best handled by replacing with another caregiver.

You are not objective. She is in need of serious therapy, not a knight in shining armor. That role will grow very burdensome very quickly.
 
Adam_Cook said:
So…I understand the teaching the church gives of co-habitation and I completely 100% agree with it, but. That being said I am at an odds within myself because of the fact that while I do not want to co-habitate, or live with, my girlfriend prior to marriage, I am faced with several dilemmas. My girlfriend has a history of panic attacks, severe panic attacks. She will panic and then pass out for hours until she regains consciousness and is then pretty lethargic due to the strain of the situation it takes on her. Usually afterward she is scared, so scared and when she is there that is where I want to be.

I love this girl, I want to be there for her and take care of her when something like this happens. Yet, as someone who is in formation to become a Secular Franciscan, I know that I am bound by obedience to the Church and to the teachings of the Church as the Holy Father Francis was, as Christ was to the Father. Yet is it acceptable for me to live with my girlfriend that I could take care of her, love her and be there for her when something like this happens? Currently we are 40 min apart and traveling down there is a lot of gas money so it constrains me from being able to be there for her. This aggravates me, it gets under my skin because even though she is in this state, I can do nothing for her but pray. I can’t physically hold her and tell her she is going to be ok, or help her prevent the attack in the first place. She has therapists that she goes to, but they couldn’t see her today nor this week.

I understand the church’s teaching, but this isn’t about sex or financial security, this is about the fact that I want to be there to take care of this beautiful women that God has given me, this daughter of his that he has entrusted into my hands and me into hers. So at what line does it become acceptable? Or does it never become acceptable even if the reason has behind it a corporeal work of mercy?

Pax.
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I think you need to be careful here so that you are not making excuses for some other motive, which be assured God will know about it if it’s there.

It sounds like she needs medical attention maybe even beyond what is happening at therapy and I would wonder just how effective that is. Frankly, there are not great therapists out there. 🤷

I would speak to a priest about this, but I would imagine he would cover what I have said to some point.
 
if this poor girl is seeing a Doctor, urge her to get a second opinion, ASAP. She needs serious medical attention, not just your devotion.
Praying for you both.
Peace
 
If you are in formation to become a secular Franciscan, I’m thinking you have a spiritual director, correct? Why are you asking us? As 1ke indicated, you need some guidance concerning what roles are proper for you and whether or not this woman is currently suited to marriage. If her panic attacks are so severe that she needs a live-in caretaker, for instance, how are you going to have any way of holding down a job? If she does not need a live-in caretaker, then why would you have to co-habitate?

Have you considered moving nearer to her, but not moving in with her? More importantly, has her therapist or doctor actually said that having you there to hold her is going to make some difference in the frequency or severity of these attacks, or have you simply assumed that you would be able to exert some control over her affliction, if only you were there? I would not take your girlfriend’s word for this, either, because this is not one of those situations where the patient necessarily understands the affliction and how to combat it as well as those who have experience with others who also have this kind of affliction.
 
Adam_Cook said:
So…I understand the teaching the church gives of co-habitation and I completely 100% agree with it, but. That being said I am at an odds within myself because of the fact that while I do not want to co-habitate, or live with, my girlfriend prior to marriage, I am faced with several dilemmas. My girlfriend has a history of panic attacks, severe panic attacks. She will panic and then pass out for hours until she regains consciousness and is then pretty lethargic due to the strain of the situation it takes on her. Usually afterward she is scared, so scared and when she is there that is where I want to be.

I love this girl, I want to be there for her and take care of her when something like this happens. Yet, as someone who is in formation to become a Secular Franciscan, I know that I am bound by obedience to the Church and to the teachings of the Church as the Holy Father Francis was, as Christ was to the Father. Yet is it acceptable for me to live with my girlfriend that I could take care of her, love her and be there for her when something like this happens? Currently we are 40 min apart and traveling down there is a lot of gas money so it constrains me from being able to be there for her. This aggravates me, it gets under my skin because even though she is in this state, I can do nothing for her but pray. I can’t physically hold her and tell her she is going to be ok, or help her prevent the attack in the first place. She has therapists that she goes to, but they couldn’t see her today nor this week.

I understand the church’s teaching, but this isn’t about sex or financial security, this is about the fact that I want to be there to take care of this beautiful women that God has given me, this daughter of his that he has entrusted into my hands and me into hers. So at what line does it become acceptable? Or does it never become acceptable even if the reason has behind it a corporeal work of mercy?

Pax.
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If I weren’t married, and I did have a girlfriend, the answer would be it’s NEVER ok for YOU to live with MY girlfriend!😃
 
I wonder if you would feel in love with her if she were 100% healthy. Sometimes what we think is love is an emotional enmeshment stemming from our need to be needed by someone. Now that can turn into true love, but wouldn’t true love recognize the woman has a severe medical problem, and needs treatment? What if a panic attack happened while she was driving?

Of course modern “treatment” for panic attacks is a daily dose of addictive benzodiazapine drugs. These are ok if used intermittently but not ok to take every day for months. Unfortunately doctors do not seem to know this.
 
1ke is right, as usual…After receiving the Sacrament of Holy Matrimony and she would then be your wife, you could live together. You have to consider that your girlfriend may be forming a dependency with you. She may become dependent on your comforting her in times of panic. You may be inhibiting her from getting the proper help. Your girlfriend needs professional help until she can get these attacks under control. God has entrusted you to her care, so direct her to those trained in this field. If you should marry her, this could be a lifelong situation. In the future you will need someone who can be your support in being a Secular Franciscan. How much does she want to be a part of this life for you? I am sure you have mutual love for each other. Is it a feeling that will pass? Can you make a forever commitment? I do admire you for caring enough to help her. Let her get well first. If you want to be there for her through it, then fine. Praying for her recovery and for you to receive wisdom from God.
 
Adam_Cook said:
She will panic and then pass out for hours until she regains consciousness and is then pretty lethargic due to the strain of the situation it takes on her.
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She doesn’t need a boyfriend. She needs to be in a hospital. I’ve never heard of someone having panic attacks that cause them to pass out for several hours. Either you’re exaggerating or she’s got something seriously wrong with her. If this happened to someone I knew the first thing I’d do is call 9-1-1, not worry about whether or not I can use it as a reason to live with her.
 
I have a major concern as to your future with this young woman if her panic attacks are as debilitating as you say they are. I realize that she is currently just your girlfriend, but it sounds to me as if you are both adults. Likely, at this point, I expect you are dating with a view towards marriage. Given her current mental state, I am not sure this girl is suitable marriage material. If she can’t take care of herself, how will she be able to hold down a job or care for your children?

I also have an issue with you becoming her caregiver, as the PPs do. Permanent caregiving completely changes the dynamic of a relationship if it’s a state that is entered early in the relationship. (I do not mean to say that caregiving is a problem if the couple has been together for, say, 40 years and all of a sudden one spouse develops problems. In that case, the couple have been together for a number of years and have a solid foundation for their relationship.) The question becomes, what is your primary role - as her romantic partner or as her caregiver? If her condition suddenly improves, how does that affect your relationship? If she’s as debilitated as you say she is, she NEEDS to seek professional help.

FYI - benzodiazepines are no longer the primary treatment for anxiety disorders. They may be prescribed in small quantities for the treatment of acute panic attacks, but most anxiety disorders are treated with antidepressants, which have a lower abuse potential and work better long-term. Your girlfriend needs to see a mental health professional who will be able to work out a treatment plan that is appropriate for her.
 
Obviously, if this is something that you are going to seriously consider and you are concerned about the religious and moral implications of this, you need to talk to your priest. If you move forward with this, you and your girlfriend should work together with your priest to make sure that you aren’t putting yourselves in bad situations.

As far as being a caretaker of someone with those kids of issues…that’s a different story. I suffer from severe depression, generalized anxiety, and an acute panic disorder. I vehemently disagree that these disorders make someone unfit for marriage, as other posters have indicated, but they do bring unique challenges. The fact is, even if she was doing very well right now, she could have a pretty severe bout the day after your wedding. With mental disorders, anything can happen.

My husband did act as a primary caretaker to me for about 6 months. At the time we were just dating, though we got engaged towards the end of that 6 month period. My disorders were so bad that I had to drop out of college just as I was finishing my degree, and I was unable to attend school or work during that time. I was also extremely paranoid and would not leave my bedroom when I was home alone. I wouldn’t go out of the apartment at all unaccompanied. And that was just the anxiety. The depression put me in very serious danger of self-harm and suicide, and I was hospitalized for a time. In short, I was a complete disaster.

Yes, I was getting professional help. My then boyfriend was no substitute for that. However, I could not live alone. I had a roommate at the time who was extremely patient and understanding, but as my illness progressed my boyfriend encouraged me to move in with him, rather than live with a friend. I agreed, as I didn’t want to burden someone else like that, and my therapist also agreed that since we had been together for so long, this was not a rash decision and that it would be good for me. That meant that my boyfriend had to attend many joint therapy sessions with me, both to understand exactly what was going on with me and how I was being helped, and to help us learn how to balance the romantic partner and caretaker roles that were being placed on him. He was my emergency medical contact, which meant he was called out of work more than once, and on one occasion he had to take me to the ER at 2 in the morning. He was in charge of keeping and dispensing all of my meds, so that I couldn’t abuse them or worse, OD. He locked away all sharp objects and weapons, and monitored me while I cooked with them. All of this was at the insistence of my therapist. His social life suffered greatly. Because he wanted to protect my privacy and dignity, he didn’t speak about my illness with anyone, which put him in counseling himself just to deal with it. Financially, we racked up a lot of debt that took us quite awhile and a lot of hard work to pay off. (About 8K in credit card debt and another 3K in medical bills.) This is really just the beginning of what he went through for me, and we were lucky, we met couples during this ordeal that had it much worse.

If you do this, you have to understand that it will radically change every single aspect of your life. You will be stressed, lonely, scared, worried, and often times feel like you have lost your romantic partner all together. Even with the best of treatments and the hardest working patients, there are no guarantees as to the quality of life that she will have, or how healthy she will ever be. You will make arrangements and agreements with her, only to find out that she is unable to uphold her end of the bargain. You will bend over backwards for someone who is at times, completely incapable of showing gratitude, and sometimes, who is downright hostile about the care you are giving.

My husband did it, and he is the greatest man I’ve ever known. But even so, it isn’t a course of action that I would recommend. For every person out there like him that can do it and do it as well as he did, there are many more who think that they can, and go in with the best intentions, only to hurt themselves and their mentally ill partner. Doing this will mean working with her and her healthcare team, sacrificing more than anyone should have to, and subjecting yourself to emotional neglect, and maybe even abuse. If you do this, you should only do it if you are absolutely sure that you are going to marry her, and even then, just to be on the safe side, you should probably wait until after you’ve proposed.
 
Even now that I’m “healthy”, there are still challenges. I went back and finished up college very quickly (I had already graduated a couple years earlier with my first degree, I had just gone back for a second) got a job, moved up quickly in the company, and then quit to go to law school. My husband and I are newly married, living in a great city, and having the time of our lives. I am still in counseling, but only twice a month. My medication was finally figured out and the depression and generalized anxiety is managed. I only see a psychiatrist once a year to check up on my meds. I still have an occasional panic attack, but a Xanax and some quiet time usually does the trick. But my husband still makes sure that he can rattle off all of my medications and dosages, just in case. There are days and sometimes weeks where my depression is extremely noticeable, and we both have to adjust for it. Occasionally, my anxiety requires that I leave large events because the people and noise are starting to send me into a panic. Although we’re married and I’m doing a million times better, there are still problems and he still sacrifices for me. Just something to consider.
 
His_helpmeet said:
I have a major concern as to your future with this young woman if her panic attacks are as debilitating as you say they are. I realize that she is currently just your girlfriend, but it sounds to me as if you are both adults. Likely, at this point, I expect you are dating with a view towards marriage. Given her current mental state, I am not sure this girl is suitable marriage material. If she can’t take care of herself, how will she be able to hold down a job or care for your children?

I also have an issue with you becoming her caregiver, as the PPs do. Permanent caregiving completely changes the dynamic of a relationship if it’s a state that is entered early in the relationship. (I do not mean to say that caregiving is a problem if the couple has been together for, say, 40 years and all of a sudden one spouse develops problems. In that case, the couple have been together for a number of years and have a solid foundation for their relationship.) The question becomes, what is your primary role - as her romantic partner or as her caregiver? If her condition suddenly improves, how does that affect your relationship? If she’s as debilitated as you say she is, she NEEDS to seek professional help.
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I concur.

I really think the OP needs to step back from the situation and separate the discernment of marriage with the need to help this person. It appears the two might be conflated, and marriage is being viewed as a solution to being able help this person more. If that’s the case, that is a very, very bad reason to get married.
 
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