When white folk won't describe black folk by their race

[quiet52]

Meanwhile, SOME white people have this common perception that in order to look good, they must become as tan as possible, even go to the lengths of spraying false color on themselves. I don’t know how many times I’ve been told I “need to get some sun.” I find it so bizarre.

I have added a word to your post to make it less a generalization.

 

[Et_Cetera]

I don’t think this is necessarily so. Physical characteristics like race can indeed be the most distinguishing characteristic, and I think in many contexts it is not at all offensive, especially in situations where people are dressed similarly and such.

In any case, just because one feels offended does not mean one should feel offended; not all indignation is righteous indignation.

If you’re Caucasian, and you’re in a room full of Caucasian people, you will be able to find ways to describe someone in that room without mentioning race. If everyone is of the same race in the room, of course it would be pretty pointless to mention race, but my point is that you can find a way to describe someone’s other features. Just because it’s more convenient for you to use racial descriptors, it doesn’t make it right. The easiest way is not always the best way.

As for your comment about feeling offended, you need to carefully consider a person’s reasons for being offended. I will agree with you that certain things should not offend someone. For example, if I went into a restaurant and became offended that I didn’t get served before others who had come before me simply because I felt myself to be superior, then that would be a silly reason to be offended for something, and most would dismiss my case. But when it comes to racial tension, I don’t think it’s our call (as the traditionally non-marginalized race) to say when minorities should and should not be offended. At best it comes off as ignorant and at worst as racist.

Try to put yourself in the shoes of those who have been treated poorly by a particular race. It would certainly seem frustrating to feel like your race is being seen before your other attributes and achievements. Imagine if Caucasians had been the typically marginalized race and you worked very hard at something–say you worked to become a great musician–it would get tiring to hear people say things like, “Well, he’s a good musician…for a white person.” It would be better to say: He’s a good musician. And so I think this ties back to the comment about racial descriptors. Why use terms that could be potentially harmful when you can find another way? Don’t look at what’s easiest for you, but rather what will create the best situation for others.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

If you’re Caucasian, and you’re in a room full of Caucasian people, you will be able to find ways to describe someone in that room without mentioning race. If everyone is of the same race in the room, of course it would be pretty pointless to mention race, but my point is that you can find a way to describe someone’s other features. Just because it’s more convenient for you to use racial descriptors, it doesn’t make it right. The easiest way is not always the best way.

As for your comment about feeling offended, you need to carefully consider a person’s reasons for being offended. I will agree with you that certain things should not offend someone. For example, if I went into a restaurant and became offended that I didn’t get served before others who had come before me simply because I felt myself to be superior, then that would be a silly reason to be offended for something, and most would dismiss my case. But when it comes to racial tension, I don’t think it’s our call (as the traditionally non-marginalized race) to say when minorities should and should not be offended. At best it comes off as ignorant and at worst as racist.

Try to put yourself in the shoes of those who have been treated poorly by a particular race. It would certainly seem frustrating to feel like your race is being seen before your other attributes and achievements. Imagine if Caucasians had been the typically marginalized race and you worked very hard at something–say you worked to become a great musician–it would get tiring to hear people say things like, “Well, he’s a good musician…for a white person.” It would be better to say: He’s a good musician. And so I think this ties back to the comment about racial descriptors. Why use terms that could be potentially harmful when you can find another way? Don’t look at what’s easiest for you, but rather what will create the best situation for others.

 

[JRKH]

Actually, children don’t notice until they are taught otherwise. They will play and fight with each other, have as much fun with one as with another.

Amen…

Peace
James

 

[MJJean]

Actually, children don’t notice until they are taught otherwise. They will play and fight with each other, have as much fun with one as with another.

Not true. I live just outside of Detroit and near the largest population of Muslims outside the Middle East. We also have a decent mix of people of Hispanic descent and Asian descent. I raised 3 of my own children in this area as well as helped raise my younger siblings and a host of cousins.

Trust me, kids notice everything. Kids notice at a very young age differences in skin color, customary dress, and even accents. I remember when my kids were little (3-4 age range) they would ask questions about why a lady (Muslim) was all covered up in the summer or why the little boy (black) had “funny hair” or why that man (from Quebec) “talked like that”.

They notice, they just don’t care. The differences they notice are interesting for a few moments and then back to the business of being a kid. No biggie. It’s when adults teach them that the differences are somehow “bad” that we start having problems.

 

[Micosil]

As a person of Indian (India) heritage, I’ve honestly never noticed this among my Caucasian friends and acquaintances. They may call me “el moreno con pelo largo” (the one with the dark skin and long hair), which is fine with me, since I have dark skin, and my hair is long.

…If you’re white, then you won’t know what it’s like to experience racism from cradle to grave… .

I am sorry, but I strongly disagree with this.

 

[on_the_hill]

I think Freeman was referring to it as “in principle” so to speak; that is, aspiring toward a state where race is considered an irrelevant characteristic, more like hair color or eye color.

And of course, I doubt anyone would consider it offensive to be referred to as ‘the blonde guy’ or whatever.

I think this is probably on the mark. Otherwise, Freeman’s mark does appear to be a bit simplistic.

 

[MJJean]

I think this is probably on the mark. Otherwise, Freeman’s mark does appear to be a bit simplistic.

Anyone remember Freeman in Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves? There’s this scene where his character is in the thieves camp in the woods and he is approached by a little girl. The child asks if God painted him and why. He tells her that God painted him because He likes wondrous variety. One of my favorite movie moments ever.

 

[severus68]

Sure they notice colors. They just don’t care with regards to playing. I was fascinated the first time I saw a deep black person instead of a brown person. Same with an albino person.

How old were you at that time? Young children do not see a difference in skin colour as being of any importance, a child of a different skin colour is just another child. A person with a skin colour never seen before might be of momentary curiousity/fascination.It depends on how young they are.
Children learn to be prejudiced, they are not born prejudiced.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

How old were you at that time? Young children do not see a difference in skin colour as being of any importance, a child of a different skin colour is just another child. A person with a skin colour never seen before might be of momentary curiousity/fascination.It depends on how young they are.
Children learn to be prejudiced, they are not born prejudiced.

I think that children notice skin color. I noticed that a friend’s skin was darker than mine. I have an ivory complexion, so everyone is darker than me. lol. I didn’t care what their color was. Kids aren’t blind, they can notice differences. It would be silly for me to say that my husband, who is an African American, doesn’t have a different skin tone. He does. I just don’t care that he is darker.
I remember having a friend in kindergarten who is black. I noticed her hair was different from mine. I would ask my mom why I couldn’t have hair like my friend. I have black, curly hair, so our hair is similar. I wanted my hair styled like hers. lol.

 

[Deus_tecum]

I can tell that some of you have taken corporate sensitivity classes and have swallowed the politically correct verbiage hook, line, and sinker. If there is truly nothing wrong with being black, white, brown, whatever, then how can it be offensive to use it as a descriptor? I had to laugh when our local news decided to not mention color, but still say “Police are asking for your help in locating the suspect.” and then provide an artist sketch that was only an outline but showed features common to black people.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

I can tell that some of you have taken corporate sensitivity classes and have swallowed the politically correct verbiage hook, line, and sinker. If there is truly nothing wrong with being black, white, brown, whatever, then how can it be offensive to use it as a descriptor? I had to laugh when our local news decided to not mention color, but still say “Police are asking for your help in locating the suspect.” and then provide an artist sketch that was only an outline but showed features common to black people.

And what would have been the purpose of stating the obvious? Wouldn’t it have been redundant?

 

[doormouse73]

How old were you at that time? Young children do not see a difference in skin colour as being of any importance, a child of a different skin colour is just another child. A person with a skin colour never seen before might be of momentary curiousity/fascination.It depends on how young they are.
Children learn to be prejudiced, they are not born prejudiced.

Children learn history and geography…

is that a bad thing to show were people come from.or do we all belong in the same continent,have the same culture ,the same beliefs,politics …

really it think this is getting out of hand here…

is it a bad thing to say he or she is working class?

when i ask for a coffee the say would you like it black or white,the same with chocolate…

what is wrong with people,its a descriptive full stop… nothing more nothing less…

when a personal word or innuendo comes before or after it,that is when the descriptive get on to the path of racism…

 

[Pug]

How old were you at that time? Young children do not see a difference in skin colour as being of any importance, a child of a different skin colour is just another child. A person with a skin colour never seen before might be of momentary curiousity/fascination.It depends on how young they are.
Children learn to be prejudiced, they are not born prejudiced.

Hmmm. I don’t know. It was the albino and the eyebrows and eyes that were especially interesting. Perhaps the deep black was partly made interesting by the discovery that “black” was a word that made sense. I assume I was older for that one.

 

[severus68]

I think that children notice skin color. I noticed that a friend’s skin was darker than mine. I have an ivory complexion, so everyone is darker than me. lol. I didn’t care what their color was. Kids aren’t blind, they can notice differences. It would be silly for me to say that my husband, who is an African American, doesn’t have a different skin tone. He does. I just don’t care that he is darker.
I remember having a friend in kindergarten who is black. I noticed her hair was different from mine. I would ask my mom why I couldn’t have hair like my friend. I have black, curly hair, so our hair is similar. I wanted my hair styled like hers. lol.

You are adult. I qualified to say young children. They may see differences but they do not see it as something which makes a difference.

I have observed this a few times. The only ones really “noticing” and making comments were adult strangers.

 

[severus68]

If you’re Caucasian, and you’re in a room full of Caucasian people, you will be able to find ways to describe someone in that room without mentioning race. If everyone is of the same race in the room, of course it would be pretty pointless to mention race, but my point is that you can find a way to describe someone’s other features. Just because it’s more convenient for you to use racial descriptors, it doesn’t make it right. The easiest way is not always the best way.

As for your comment about feeling offended, you need to carefully consider a person’s reasons for being offended. I will agree with you that certain things should not offend someone. For example, if I went into a restaurant and became offended that I didn’t get served before others who had come before me simply because I felt myself to be superior, then that would be a silly reason to be offended for something, and most would dismiss my case. But when it comes to racial tension, I don’t think it’s our call (as the traditionally non-marginalized race) to say when minorities should and should not be offended. At best it comes off as ignorant and at worst as racist.

Try to put yourself in the shoes of those who have been treated poorly by a particular race. It would certainly seem frustrating to feel like your race is being seen before your other attributes and achievements. Imagine if Caucasians had been the typically marginalized race and you worked very hard at something–say you worked to become a great musician–it would get tiring to hear people say things like, “Well, he’s a good musician…for a white person.” It would be better to say: He’s a good musician. And so I think this ties back to the comment about racial descriptors. Why use terms that could be potentially harmful when you can find another way? Don’t look at what’s easiest for you, but rather what will create the best situation for others.

Again, well said.

 

[severus68]

Not true. I live just outside of Detroit and near the largest population of Muslims outside the Middle East. We also have a decent mix of people of Hispanic descent and Asian descent. I raised 3 of my own children in this area as well as helped raise my younger siblings and a host of cousins.

Trust me, kids notice everything. Kids notice at a very young age differences in skin color, customary dress, and even accents. I remember when my kids were little (3-4 age range) they would ask questions about why a lady (Muslim) was all covered up in the summer or why the little boy (black) had “funny hair” or why that man (from Quebec) “talked like that”.

They notice, they just don’t care. The differences they notice are interesting for a few moments and then back to the business of being a kid. No biggie. It’s when adults teach them that the differences are somehow “bad” that we start having problems.

Yes, thank you, that is what I meant by not “noticing”. Maybe I did not put it clearly.

They will still see the "differently looking " kids as kids to mix and play with

 

[KendraDZ1902]

You are adult. I qualified to say young children. They may see differences but they do not see it as something which makes a difference.

I have observed this a few times. The only ones really “noticing” and making comments were adult strangers.

I wasn’t an adult in Kindergarten. I totally knew her hair was different, I wanted mine like it, and I told others about it.

 

[Pug]

I wasn’t an adult in Kindergarten. I totally knew her hair was different, I wanted mine like it, and I told others about it.

I’m with you on that. My poor mother had to learn to braid my hair to satisfy me after I had been at a friend’s house while her mother made those cool braids on my friend’s head. The whole thing only got worse for mom when I read little house on the prairie.

 

[MJJean]

I wasn’t an adult in Kindergarten. I totally knew her hair was different, I wanted mine like it, and I told others about it.

I’m with you on that. My poor mother had to learn to braid my hair to satisfy me after I had been at a friend’s house while her mother made those cool braids on my friend’s head. The whole thing only got worse for mom when I read little house on the prairie.

Reminds me of when my youngest daughter was in pre-school. My husbands closest friend is a Jewish fellow. He is a wonderful man and he loves kids. Endless patience, loves playing with kids, talking to kids, and teaching kids. Of course, kids respond to a cool adult like that. My daughter became his stalker. She thought his “Jew-fro” hair was the coolest thing ever and loved to comb it and try to style it. She was kind of perturbed that we were not of Jewish descent and couldn’t have that hair.

Bless him, my husbands friend indulged her hair fascination right up until she decided she was going to really give him some style and came at him with scissors, rofl.