When will it all end?

[nana3]

I think his counselor can see how the father is trying to turn him against her and impede treatment.

She is making notes, I am sure.

It may take them running off with him and keeping him off his meds and him having an uncontrollable meltdown with them that scares them and maybe he’ll hurt stepmom in his fury before they finally get the message.

That may be what it takes.

Once he becomes a big problem to THEM, they won’t want him anymore. I’m sure they’re not planning to have kids together or they wouldn’t want him around a baby. If she has other kids and he lashes out at them, that will be the last time he’s allowed in HER house.

If the kid can’t even grasp the extent of his own problems and why he’s been institutionalized for periods of time, that needs to be explained to a judge.

I’m sure your lawyer is on this. And the other lawyer does not want to be the lawyer of record in a case where a kid goes berserk and does something horrible and it comes out that THAT lawyer got him out of treatment or his client did something bad that sparked it. Lawyers are about their own reputations too.

Everything you said is true. You are a wise woman and probably lived through this nightmare already.

Child services did call my sister yesterday and came over. They spoke with my niece first in private and then my sister. At first she tried to make my sister out to be negligent as well for not taking the medications to her ex’s house, but she told the case worker that her ex was the one who basically kidnapped their son and it was his responsiblity to come and get the medication and she told him to come and get it in an email. She had to show proof of the email. The case worker took a copy of it. Apparently, the other side lied, the ex that is. Oh, aren’t we so surprised. NOT!! Anyway, the case worker also wants to talk to myself and two other persons that know my sister as a mother and how she is with her children. So I should be getting a call or not. Who knows.

Another good development is my sister’s attorney called this new impartial psychiatrist and the little records that he already has on my nephew does’nt understand what all the fuss is about. He said this child needs to stay on medication and needs to stay (name removed by moderator)atient. He said he knows the child’s psychiatrist personally and by reputation and he is an expert in his field and trusts him and if he admitted this boy, he needs to stay there. So even though the ex is still collecting all the other records, this doctor already thinks in his medical opinion that this boy is where he belongs. He is actually upset that the father has not accepted that his son needs medication and treatment. This will work to help my sister’s case.

Keep praying ladies, the Lord is hearing us and showering us with His mercy. Most of us, this boy needs mercy. Pray for my niece who is scared about going tomorrow with her dad.

By the way, in the sessions with the counselor, sexual abuse came up again. I think he was abused. He did something with the private parts of a doll in play therapy. When asked about it, he became “tight lipped” were the words of the therapist and agitated. Pray that this comes out to the surface as well. I think my niece was molested too, and she is older now and can talk, but she is not talking to anyone about her feelings.

 

[dulcissima]

Nana, I am praying. I am hopeful for your sister and her children.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

My xh basically delegated the care of my children to me alone for over 9 years. One of those years he just took off and was gone.

Then he filed divorce a second time and accused me of being an abusive mother. Used to hide tape recorders in the house to try to get evidence against me.

I had to prove that I wasn’t an unfit mother so I could keep doing what I had been doing with no help for over 9 years. I told the lawyer “If I was abusive, then he is very negligent for going off and leaving me with three small children for a year and going weeks without checking on us. That makes him worse than me. So either I was abusive and he’s extremely negligent to knowingly endanger three children like that, or I wasn’t abusive.”

That shut the other lawyer up.

So I completely sympathize with your sister about how someone who rarely cared about being a parent all of a sudden starts showing an interest in his kids after he leaves.

 

[nana3]

I am sure you all won’t be surprised by this, but he did it again. He was to have my niece for two hours today only he and her, but instead took her to his house. When my niece was not home after two hours, my sister called and he told my sister that my niece did not want to come home. He wanted to argue and so I just told my sister to text him in case it was needed in court. He knew the arrangement that was made by his attorney of all people and he agreed to it and then he said his daughter wanted to stay and it is his weekend and there is nothing she can do about it. She texted him and told him that they had an agreement made in front of the attorney’s and it was his attorney’s idea and he agreed. He is breaking the agreement and listening to a child again versus knowing what he is suppose to do as an adult. In his last text he wrote, “It is my weekend and I am keeping her.” My 18 year old nephew, who just came out of Mass did not know of any of this and called my niece when he got out of Mass. They call each other a lot. He got a hold of her and asked where she was and she answered him in anger that she was at her dads and eating dinner and that she wanted to go home. Right after she said that, her step mom said, “Shut the f**k up!” and my nephew thought it was directed at him, but we think it was directed at my niece for talking. He told my niece that she didn’t have to answer like that and told her the same words back. He should not talk like that either, but he was angry too. The phone went dead. He called again and my niece’s dad answered the phone. My nephew, who is 18 years old, asked to speak to his cousin and the dad said no that this was “adult business.” My nephew said he heard my niece crying in the background and screaming outloud, “I want to go home.” At that he hung up the phone. Pray for my niece. If I know this couple, they are going to send her to bed, it was 7 p.m. without dinner and yell at her some more. If I know my niece, she is not going to sleep tonight for she has separation anxiety from her mother.

This just keeps getting worse, but I really think that on Monday when the ex’s attorney hears that he went back on his word, he is really going to get it. My sister even told them all in that room on Wednesday in the mediation when they decided on this, that he has been known to say 2 hours and his daughter believes him and he lies and goes back on his words. He did it again. She will never want to go with him again. He is just digging his hole bigger and bigger. My nephew that is in the (name removed by moderator)atient unit called his mother tonight and didn’t know any of this and my sister didn’t tell him. He has enough of his own problems.

Pray for my niece tonight. Thanks. I hope that this ends soon.

 

[dulcissima]

Incredible, and I am actually a little worried. This is pretty over the top and seems to point to some strange desperation. These kids have been through so much. He should really know better. She is old enough to have her own opinions.

 

[nana3]

Incredible, and I am actually a little worried. This is pretty over the top and seems to point to some strange desperation. These kids have been through so much. He should really know better. She is old enough to have her own opinions.

You know, my niece has been refusing to open up to counselors because she feels it won’t help. I think now she is so angry at her father, she may now start talking. I know she once wanted to talk to the judge. I hope she talks to this impartial psychiatrist. She really needs too. All the ex is doing, is causing his daughter to hate him even more than what she already does.

She use to be homeschooled by me and I have the entire homeschool co-op group praying for her tonight. They fell in love with her immediately and she made friends in her dance class with three girls and they are praying for her. I can’t wait until she gets back so I can tell her she is loved by some friends who prayed for her and are praying for her. She needs to hear that. She thinks God has abandoned her. Poor thing. We know he hasn’t, but that is how she feels.

 

[horselvr]

This just keeps getting worse. The court, judges, and even the lawyers are not making this any better. Your poor sister and kids. This man is a phyco along with his wife. Your sister must be devastated. I’ll keep your family in mind at Mass this morning.

After seeing all this, my son and I are very fortunate his dad is very negligent and will only call once every 4-5 yrs. Much less crapola to put up with.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Yeah, I envy the people whose spouses just wandered off and didn’t care.

Nana, your neice needs to understand that she DOES have some control over her future. But only if she chooses to exercise it. The truth shall make you free.

She needs to start telling the truth about her experiences over there. If she is over 12 years old, a judge will take into account her preferences. He at least has to listen to her.

Her silence just keeps the situation going. She needs to tell her counselor anything. Otherwise any decision the judge makes is based on a lie and she’s stuck till she’s 18.

 

[nana3]

I will address what you both said, but for now it is 7:45 p.m. and my niece is not home and not answering her cell phone or her text messages. Please pray that her dad will not be so stupid to keep her and will return her. She has been texting her mom all day. I will tell you more later. For now I just need prayers. Yes, this does keep getting worse, but trust me when I say, this man has put my sister through worse than this.

 

[nana3]

Okay, here is the update and yes, it is worse. He is not bringing her home tonight. We are not surprised by his behavior and in fact, my mom predicted that he would do this. My poor niece on the other hand did not see this coming. She has been texting my sister, her mother, all day. She has written things like, “I love you.” “I miss you.” “I am coming home tonight.” “See you tonight.” She has written more of the same. She has texted her a total of 12 times today and that shows how much she did and does miss her mother. We found out that she was alone with the step-mom who she hates. The step mom did not go visit my nephew today as she planned. When my nephew called his mother tonight, my sister, he told her that only his daddy came to visit him in the hospital. It was to suppose to be the “whole clan” for that is what he was told yesterday by his dad. They all stayed home to keep close watch on his daughter and to make sure that my sister would not be waiting at the hospital to take her. They are not stupid. She didn’t go there for she knew she could not get her anyway. He could say that it was his weekend with the children, which it was. There was nothing ever written by the attorneys, so there was no proof of the agreement. Anyway, apparently, my nephew told my sister that he had to be put in the calm room this afternoon. She doesn’t know if it was before or after his dad’s visit, but she will find out tomorrow. She has already emailed her attorney of the events of this weekend and that her ex has kept her daughter pass the agreement time. Her poor daughter is not going to have much time to get ready before she has to get the bus if he gets her on time before her mother has to leave to work. What a mess?

My sister is so worried about Spring Break. It is coming up in March. She doesn’t think it would be in the children’s best interest to go to their fathers for four days. I agree. I hope her attorney can do something. I hope that this little stunt he pulled here this weekend will prove to his attorney that he is not trust worthy or stable. I know him and what he is going to say. He is going to say that his daughter wanted to stay, but even if that was true, he is the adult and made an agreement and had to keep it.

So as of now, he still has my niece and we really don’t know if he will return her in the morning or not. We don’t trust him at all. She goes to a public school and not a private, so if he keeps her from school, they will go after him. I can’t tell you how angry I am at this man and this woman he is married to. I don’t understand why they feel the need to hurt the children in this way. I guess let really hate my sister that badly and think they are hurting her the most, but the ones being hurt more than my sister are the children. It is really sad.

This has been going on for too long. We are so tired of this. We are tired of his stunts and how he treats my sister and most of all the mental and physical abuse that he has done to the kids. It has to end. We pray for a miracle and that is for my sister to get full and sole custody of her children. That is the only way these kids will begin to heal. With this man in there lives, they will never find peace or God in their lives. He doesn’t even take them to Mass on Sunday. When my niece doesn’t go on Sunday, even though she is angry at God, she feels that she has committed a sin. I explain it to her, but still she feels bad.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

You really need to read that PDF on narcissists.

You have to understand, they don’t even consider the fact they’re hurting your niece.

That hasn’t entered their minds. Their sole fixation in this is how all this affects THEM and makes THEM feel.

And it may go on for 10 more years.

And at some point, your niece may decide daddy is the most wonderful man in the world and run after him for favors, money, love and approval. And your sister will become the *****.

Yes, I’ve seen it happen.

Just because your niece is angry right now doesn’t mean she’ll always be angry at him. And eventually the “I love you mommy” emails will turn into “You kept me from my father” emails.

Getting sole custody isn’t the answer. It may buy you some time. But it won’t protect you from the manipulation.

Your niece has to start being honest with the school counselors, the judge, the lawyers, the shrinks… or she’s just acquiescing in all this.

The lies and stories and outrages don’t end. You can document them and fill dozens of marble notebooks with the stories. Eventually you get sick of living like that and writing everything down. What good is it?
Been there, done that, have the notebooks.

The girl was over there. She saw that her father lied to her. Her father lied to her brother. She must either accept that daddy is a liar and she won’t want to go over there again, or she will keep going over hoping this time he won’t lie. But daddy will always have a reason he gives her why he had to lie or disappoint, or fail to keep a promise. She could have called 9-11 and told them she was being kept against her will past a court ordered deadline.

And this is where your sister needs to tell her daughter: Look, you go over there, you take a risk. If you don’t want to go over there, you need to be honest with the professionals about everything. Because the law is listening and believing his lies.

You didn’t say how old the niece was, did you?

She’s old enough to see through the lies.

Ten years ago I got sucked into the lies, and the drama and the harmful effects of daddy keeping them, and his mother keeping them, and the baby not being bathed, and the crying, and the refusal to let me talk to them (no cell phones in those days). He wouldn’t answer the phone until after 9 pm. Then he’d tell me it was too late to talk to them. (I would call from 6 pm on. I had a rule because he wouldn’t call all afternoon on my nights, and then he’d call at 11 pm demanding to talk to them and I’d tell him to call before 9 because that’s when they were in bed. So hence the game.)

What did I get for my crying, praying and worrying? Kids who eventually decided that daddy was so nice because he never yelled at them. (You’d have to give a damn to do that when their homework wasn’t done.) Now I’m hated.

I fought it. I tried to be there, every agonizing step of the way. I spent tens of thousands of dollars I didn’t have. I had church written into the divorce decree. I’d even go to the mass they went to and sit in church to make sure they went and get a chance to hug them that day. He quit going and eventually left me to take them. Now two of them don’t go.

I honestly wonder if I had let go of the rope and let him have the overwhelming burden of taking care of them if they would have turned out less hostile to me and less interested in their faith. The man who used to beat me up is the good guy. They don’t even want to hear me mention his history of abuse. I absorbed a lot of his abuse for them. He was the candyland daddy and I was his target, the person who was “keeping him from his beloved kids.” Yesterday I spent 12 hours of HIS weekend driving an ungrateful daughter around to things she needed to do. Daddy was too busy. Or something. Then she demanded I take her to the store to buy stuff she needed. She was so rude, I turned the car around. Told her to let her father take her. She began to plead. “HE won’t!” Yeah, I’m the sucker who buys her stuff and tonight she wanted me to drive her somewhere on HIS time, and I was too busy. Later he dumped her at my house. Then she wanted to go back over there and spend the night. Accused me of being “greedy.”

That’s my reward for vigilance. And fighting for the kids every step of the way has left me spent, exhausted and completely burned out. And I get no gratitude for it.

This is what narcissists do. Your sister needs to get with her own counselor and decide how much she’s going to take one for the team and how depleted she’s going to be for kids who play her off against daddy. And yes, the son is doing just that. If she goes down in the fire, what will be left of her in 10 years when they crown daddy the hero?

This is only the beginning of the outrages. The kids aren’t willing to fight for themselves. Maybe if mommy let go of the rope, Mr. Only Wants What he Can’t Have won’t want them anymore. It’s not about the kids. It’s about winning. And if he gets full responsibility, you know NEW WIFE will be the one to carry the load. NEW WIFE does NOT want the load. It will break up their marriage. I’m sure there are already cracks in it.

And when son goes into full-blown psychosis under his father’s care and neglect, THEY will be the ones who have to deal with it.

This death by a thousand cuts and the father ignoring the decree are a sign of the next 10 years.

If the kids aren’t going to help their mother at all, my 12 years of experience says do what you can and then let go of the rope. Or it’ll strangle you.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Oh, you don’t say how long he’s been married to new wife.

I’ve got a formula for the shelf-life of someone married to a narcissist.

(It’s lengthier for a devout Catholic who confused fidelity to a vow to complete stupidity trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. But this’ll do.)

Meeting to year 1: Complete nirvana and bliss as he snows her with his dazzling charm, tales of the hideous crazy beast wife he endured, but escaped with his life. It’s all lovey dovey charm as he wines her and dines her and puts on a big act to win her over and get the reflected shine of love and glory in her eyes. During this time, the fool may actually marry him.

Year 1-2: It’s still lovely. By now they’re surely married. He has what he wants. But she’s still pretty sure he’s great. He doesn’t have to try anymore. He starts noticing her flaws.

Year 2-3: She’s invested this much time. Surely it wasn’t a mistake. She hopes that making a suggestion here or there won’t tick him off too much, but he’s smart and if he loves her he’ll correct some of that behavior stuff. He’s bored with her sort of. By now he’s looking around to see if anything on the horizon is better. If he has kids, he starts noticing the fact. After ignoring them to court her and marry her, now he uses them as an excuse to divert attention away from the problems in his relationship with her. If she is a complete narcissist, she’ll dredge up issues with wife #1 to get a common enemy to shore up her failing relationship with him. This flimsy alliance will go along for a while.

Year 3-4: They start bickering. But he has a facade to maintain. And if there are job or custody issues that can be hurt by a divorce, he’ll stay nominally in the marriage. He starts fixating on either job, or kids, to avoid dealing with her. Becomes the world’s greatest dad. Uses the kids to show her her true place. That builds resentment between her and the kids.

Year 4-5: The wheels really start falling off that car. All pretense is gone. It usually ends by this time. Unless she is desperate, in which case she has leverage to hold onto him a while longer by threatening to tell officials about his hidden behavior. But it’s all over but the shouting by now. The end is inevitable.

At this point the good Catholic wife would keep praying, sure it was her fault and if she was just more patient, loving or understanding he would come around. Eventually he leaves because he’s found someone else to cheat on her with. And that person reflects glory and love of him in her eyes. And the cycle continues on…

So don’t know where he is in this… but wives, girlfriends and fiancees seem to have a 5-year maximum shelf life with this kind.

So keep that in mind as you watch this supercouple in action.

 

[nana3]

Oh, you don’t say how long he’s been married to new wife.

I’ve got a formula for the shelf-life of someone married to a narcissist.

(It’s lengthier for a devout Catholic who confused fidelity to a vow to complete stupidity trying to make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear. But this’ll do.)

Meeting to year 1: Complete nirvana and bliss as he snows her with his dazzling charm, tales of the hideous crazy beast wife he endured, but escaped with his life. It’s all lovey dovey charm as he wines her and dines her and puts on a big act to win her over and get the reflected shine of love and glory in her eyes. During this time, the fool may actually marry him.

Year 1-2: It’s still lovely. By now they’re surely married. He has what he wants. But she’s still pretty sure he’s great. He doesn’t have to try anymore. He starts noticing her flaws.

Year 2-3: She’s invested this much time. Surely it wasn’t a mistake. She hopes that making a suggestion here or there won’t tick him off too much, but he’s smart and if he loves her he’ll correct some of that behavior stuff. He’s bored with her sort of. By now he’s looking around to see if anything on the horizon is better. If he has kids, he starts noticing the fact. After ignoring them to court her and marry her, now he uses them as an excuse to divert attention away from the problems in his relationship with her. If she is a complete narcissist, she’ll dredge up issues with wife #1 to get a common enemy to shore up her failing relationship with him. This flimsy alliance will go along for a while.

Year 3-4: They start bickering. But he has a facade to maintain. And if there are job or custody issues that can be hurt by a divorce, he’ll stay nominally in the marriage. He starts fixating on either job, or kids, to avoid dealing with her. Becomes the world’s greatest dad. Uses the kids to show her her true place. That builds resentment between her and the kids.

Year 4-5: The wheels really start falling off that car. All pretense is gone. It usually ends by this time. Unless she is desperate, in which case she has leverage to hold onto him a while longer by threatening to tell officials about his hidden behavior. But it’s all over but the shouting by now. The end is inevitable.

At this point the good Catholic wife would keep praying, sure it was her fault and if she was just more patient, loving or understanding he would come around. Eventually he leaves because he’s found someone else to cheat on her with. And that person reflects glory and love of him in her eyes. And the cycle continues on…

So don’t know where he is in this… but wives, girlfriends and fiancees seem to have a 5-year maximum shelf life with this kind.

So keep that in mind as you watch this supercouple in action.

They have been married for 4 - 5 years. They were married by a judge in the court since the Catholic Church would not marry them. He is still married to my sister and didn’t get an annulment and for the woman, he is husband number 3, not to mention all the boyfriends she has. Currently, she is listed in facebook as a single person and she is married to my ex BIL. I bet he doesn’t know that about her. She has a total of five children. Three are living with her and the 18 year old is dying to get out for she can’t stand her mother. The others are in college and moved far away. The three she has living with her have differnet fathers. That tells you what kind of a woman she is. One of the daughers and we don’t know which one got pregnant and let us say, she never got bigger. My niece saw the pregnancy test and it was positive. She thinks one of them had an abortion. This was when she was 9 years old. What a situation to be around? This family is and was not a good example. One of the step-moms children is into things of the “darkness.” She has colored her hair black and nails black and her room is alway in darkness. She has taped her shades so that they can never be opened. She is the one who once posted my niece when she was only 10 years on facebook as an 18 year old girl looking for a boy. My sister was furious and my niece’s father didn’t know anything about it. He doesn’t monitor what the step daughters do with his children. They are a bad influence, especially spiritually. I am telling, that household is evil and my niece and nephew don’t and shouldn’t go there anymore.

I agree totally with what you said. They are fighting more now than ever as a couple.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

I would suggest that the step siblings and that influence and negativity be discussed with the lawyers.

The woman is a basket case, and if she couldn’t make it work with all those men, she won’t make it work with your ex BIL.

And once it ends, he’ll be on the chase to a new girlfriend and too busy for the kids.

Meanwhile, make sure your niece and nephew have blessed medals they wear in that house and make sure that your niece says the prayer to St. Michael often when she is there. That environment and whatever the step sibling is conjuring cannot be good for a pubescent girl and a boy with emotional problems to be around. In fact, they’re sitting ducks for the diabolical there.

 

[nana3]

The girl was over there. She saw that her father lied to her. Her father lied to her brother. She must either accept that daddy is a liar and she won’t want to go over there again, or she will keep going over hoping this time he won’t lie. But daddy will always have a reason he gives her why he had to lie or disappoint, or fail to keep a promise. She could have called 9-11 and told them she was being kept against her will past a court ordered deadline.

And this is where your sister needs to tell her daughter: Look, you go over there, you take a risk. If you don’t want to go over there, you need to be honest with the professionals about everything. Because the law is listening and believing his lies.

You didn’t say how old the niece was, did you?

She’s old enough to see through the lies.

Ten years ago I got sucked into the lies, and the drama and the harmful effects of daddy keeping them, and his mother keeping them, and the baby not being bathed, and the crying, and the refusal to let me talk to them (no cell phones in those days). He wouldn’t answer the phone until after 9 pm. Then he’d tell me it was too late to talk to them. (I would call from 6 pm on. I had a rule because he wouldn’t call all afternoon on my nights, and then he’d call at 11 pm demanding to talk to them and I’d tell him to call before 9 because that’s when they were in bed. So hence the game.)

What did I get for my crying, praying and worrying? Kids who eventually decided that daddy was so nice because he never yelled at them. (You’d have to give a damn to do that when their homework wasn’t done.) Now I’m hated.

I fought it. I tried to be there, every agonizing step of the way. I spent tens of thousands of dollars I didn’t have. I had church written into the divorce decree. I’d even go to the mass they went to and sit in church to make sure they went and get a chance to hug them that day. He quit going and eventually left me to take them. Now two of them don’t go.

I honestly wonder if I had let go of the rope and let him have the overwhelming burden of taking care of them if they would have turned out less hostile to me and less interested in their faith. The man who used to beat me up is the good guy. They don’t even want to hear me mention his history of abuse. I absorbed a lot of his abuse for them. He was the candyland daddy and I was his target, the person who was “keeping him from his beloved kids.” Yesterday I spent 12 hours of HIS weekend driving an ungrateful daughter around to things she needed to do. Daddy was too busy. Or something. Then she demanded I take her to the store to buy stuff she needed. She was so rude, I turned the car around. Told her to let her father take her. She began to plead. “HE won’t!” Yeah, I’m the sucker who buys her stuff and tonight she wanted me to drive her somewhere on HIS time, and I was too busy. Later he dumped her at my house. Then she wanted to go back over there and spend the night. Accused me of being “greedy.”

That’s my reward for vigilance. And fighting for the kids every step of the way has left me spent, exhausted and completely burned out. And I get no gratitude for it.

This is what narcissists do. Your sister needs to get with her own counselor and decide how much she’s going to take one for the team and how depleted she’s going to be for kids who play her off against daddy. And yes, the son is doing just that. If she goes down in the fire, what will be left of her in 10 years when they crown daddy the hero?

This is only the beginning of the outrages. The kids aren’t willing to fight for themselves. Maybe if mommy let go of the rope, Mr. Only Wants What he Can’t Have won’t want them anymore. It’s not about the kids. It’s about winning. And if he gets full responsibility, you know NEW WIFE will be the one to carry the load. NEW WIFE does NOT want the load. It will break up their marriage. I’m sure there are already cracks in it.

And when son goes into full-blown psychosis under his father’s care and neglect, THEY will be the ones who have to deal with it.

This death by a thousand cuts and the father ignoring the decree are a sign of the next 10 years.

If the kids aren’t going to help their mother at all, my 12 years of experience says do what you can and then let go of the rope. Or it’ll strangle you.

Wow, I am so sorry for all that you went through and are still going through. I think it will be hard for my sister to let go as you say. Thousands of dollars have gone into “fixing” her son. This (name removed by moderator)atient alone cost one of my sister $13,000.00 and my nephew shows so much improvement on medications. The dad denies his son needs medications or that he even has any mental problems. He has spoken to a psychologist and a psychiatrist and they have told him. He has all the reports to read and till he is in denial. My sister is concern that her son will get worse. As far as her daughter, she is afraid he daughter would be pregnant by the age of 18 years old if she stays with this step-mom and her dad. They don’t have the same values as she has. They allow dating at the age of 11 years old. They allow more freedom at such a young age. They have no religion but call themselves Catholic.

If she lets go, her children’s soul are in danger of being lost. It is not that easy. I think waht you say is trust and can happen too, but she has to try and fight for their souls and see what she can do with the Lord’s help. Nothing is impossible with God!

My niece is 13 years old.

 

[nana3]

PS: My niece is too afraid of them and won’t call 911. She has been told to do this by counselors and she told me that if do any good for her dad would say to the officers who respond that he was just discipling her or something like that and than she would “really get it.” She is just too afraid.

 

[Liberanosamalo]

Then she needs to write an affidavit under oath testifying about the threats and behavior there.

I understand completely why your sister won’t leave. I had many people tell me to leave. But I couldn’t leave them to HIM. HE would destroy them. So I stayed. And I did my best. And I had a front row seat to him scandalizing them, denigrating me, and wearing away and undermining the values I taught them. In the end, did it make a difference that I stayed? Well, God doesn’t ask us to succeed. He asks us to be faithful. I can look myself in the mirror. For what it’s worth.

And for 12 years everyone lectured me to quit obsessing about him and live my own life and blah blah blah. As if I could while he had control over the children.

I’m just painting a real picture of what may be ahead. No one warned me that the children who used to be so loving and dependent on me and so angry at the things he did would completely forget what he did and he would become the hero. THAT is what a narcissist does!

YOU are going to need to keep your sister on an even keel and remind her to have a life outside her kids. Or there will be nothing left. And you need the lawyer to document the ex’s denial of medical issues. Would he be allowed to do that if the boy were diabetic?

This could be that fatal.

It would be like a judge letting the boy go there and the father refuses to check his insulin or give him shots and he slips into a coma.

What judge would do that?

Your sister needs to have one day a week that is NOT about the ex, the lawyers or the kids.

 

[nana3]

Libera, thanks for your advice, and I will mention it to my sister. I don’t know if your ex use to abuse your children himself, but this man does. This dad has yelled at his kids face and hit the boy so hard that marks were left. The wife is the same. The 13 yr old year was abused when she was 9 yr. old and left home alone for lying about eating corn and she suffered from fear of being alone and anxiety. Then he lied in court and said she was never alone. Her brother and her know she was alone. I will tell you both kids are terrified of both of these people and the boy has forgiven his dad and is totally brain washed,but something in him is rebelling and fights him internally that is against his dad. I think he is struggling and the psychologist see this.

As far as my niece, she got home today at 8:08 am this morning and looked terrible. She had bags and dark circles under her eyes. She told her mom that her dad kept her up until 1 a.m. cleaning the house. A child that needs to get up at 6 a.m. and they didn’t care about their kids for they were going to skip school today for they were going to a party today. That is another thing this couple does a lot and that is allow the children to skip school and they call it in as the child is sick. They did that once in the past with my sister’s children. They were not sick, but they wanted to make sure they had them to go to a graduation that my sister already said no too for it was going to end to late and it was a school night. They didn’t care and the children got home that night at 10:35 p.m. that night. My niece also told her mom that all her texts that she had between her brother and her were erased by her dad. We knew they were going to do that. If they had nothing to hide, why erase them? These were the texts that were sent from my nephew when he was in their house that week it was held captive in their house. In the texts,you can tell which were sent by him, all the misspelling and which were sent by an adult, perfect spelling with smiley faces and exclamations points and all. I am going to the cell phone place today and hope they have records of that to show the courts. Some of them, my niece sent to her mother’s cell, thank God, but not the ones sent for sure my nephew showing how he really writes. These people are not stupid but they are crazy!!!

As for my niece, we can tell she is traumatized. My sister said she hugged her and cried and looked very depressed. I suggested a school counselor,but the school doesn’t have one due to the budget.

I personally don’t think she will make it through the day and will be calling with a stomach ache sometime today. That is how she handles stress. Time will tell, unless she is hardening her heart.

But now you see why my sister is fighiting for sole custody. She can’t leave them to this monster!

 

[Liberanosamalo]

GET THE GIRL TO THE SCHOOL NURSE TO TELL HER EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENED. If there is no school counselor, she needs to tell the principal or someone else who can know the routine.

Have the lawyer issue an injunction against the girl going over there again based on the abuse she endured and the violation of the custody order.

The kids need to testify about the abuse they suffered in a court. They are old enough to testify.

 

[nana3]

GET THE GIRL TO THE SCHOOL NURSE TO TELL HER EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENED. If there is no school counselor, she needs to tell the principal or someone else who can know the routine.

Have the lawyer issue an injunction against the girl going over there again based on the abuse she endured and the violation of the custody order.

The kids need to testify about the abuse they suffered in a court. They are old enough to testify.

It is more complicated than just going to court. This attorney seems much smarter than all the others my sister has had. They all rushed to court and we always had the same Judge and he always ruled in favor of the dad. This attorney has told my sister that she still has the same judge and that he is not one to mess around with child custody, not EVEN in case of child abuse. I know that will anger many, for it did us and still does. It is not fair or just, but he is a judge and that is who he is. He thinks he is God. So my sister’s attorney called her this morning, even though she is on vacation when she heard what this man did over the weekend. She is seeing that this man is “sick” and that mediation is not going to work with him. Talking and being nice will not work with him. She knows going to court on the issues of the children with the same judge will work against them and so since the kids are old enough, as you said, to talk and are juveniles, she wants to make a motion for a parent coordinator in the Majestrate Justice system, is what she called it. It is basically the Juvenile court system and we will get another judge to deal with the issues of the kids and the abuses and if the kids wish to talk to the judge they can. So my sister’s attorney is smart.

As far as these two narcissist erasing all the text messages, it doesn’t matter for I called the cell phone company and it is recorded on their data banks and can be printed out. All it did was show that they had something to hide.

As far as my niece going today to any school officials, I know her and she will bottle all this up inside and not tell any person who she needs too, but the lawyers don’t want child services to be called though. They think it will make their case worse. I don’t understand it, but they have a plan that we don’t see yet. I think for my sister’s attorney to call her while on vacation demonstates that she is doing all she can legally to protect my sister and her kids. I do know that they have several motions in plan this week. One is that the ex is comtempt of paying child support and medical bill. This may land him in jail. I do know that she spoke with the ex’s attorney who was disgusted that his client went back on his word. I do need to make clear that there was only an oral agreement for the 2 hour and no court order. As far as the orginal court order goes, this was the father’s weekend and he is allowed to keep them until Monday morning, so in his eyes he didn’t break any laws. My niece wanted to go home after the two hours and he broke his trust with his daughter. The whole 2 hours was to build up trust again and he lost it. As far as cleaning the house until 1 a.m., we know this couple so well for they have done it before, they will say my niece is lying and get their children, that is the wife’s kids, to lie with them saying that they all went to bed early. Trust me, they have done this two many times to count. Like I said, they are not stupid and have thought of everything. Afterall, they are cops.

My sister has mentioned the injunction and her attorney doesn’t think it is wise to do so just yet. I don’t know after this weekend if she still feels that way. I think this couple will behave for the parent coordinator and when she is gone, go wild again.