where did we get the bible?

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Odell said:
I have been told it is the Catholic Church. And that is what I believe. But if it is true waht do protestants have to say or do they believe the bible came about any different.

anyway I would like to know both sides so I can determine for my self who really knows what they are talking about.
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51-125
The New Testament books are written.

140
Marcion, a businessman in Rome, taught that there were two Gods: Yahweh, the cruel God of the Old Testament, and Abba, the kind father of the New Testament. Marcion eliminated the Old Testament as scriptures and, since he was anti-Semitic, kept from the New Testament only 10 letters of Paul and 2/3 of Luke’s gospel (he deleted references to Jesus’s Jewishness). Marcion’s “New Testament”, the first to be compiled, forced the mainstream Church to decide on a core canon: the four Gospels and Letters of Paul.

200
The periphery of the canon is not yet determined. According to one list, compiled at Rome c. AD 200 (the Muratorian Canon), the NT consists of the 4 gospels; Acts; 13 letters of Paul (Hebrews is not included); 3 of the 7 General Epistles (1-2 John and Jude); and also the Apocalypse of Peter.

367
The earliest extant list of the books of the NT, in exactly the number and order in which we presently have them, is written by Athanasius, Bishop of Alexandria, in his Festal letter # 39 of 367 A.D…

382
Council of Rome (whereby Pope Damasus started the ball rolling for the defining of a universal canon for all city-churches). Listed the New Testament books in their present number and order.

393
the Council of Hippo, which began “arguing it out.” Canon proposed by Bishop Athanasius.

397
The Council of Carthage, which refined the canon for the Western Church, sending it back to Pope Innocent for ratification. In the East, the canonical process was hampered by a number of schisms (esp. within the Church of Antioch). However, this changed by …

787
The Ecumenical Council of Nicaea II, which adopted the canon of Carthage. At this point, both the Latin West and the Greek / Byzantine East had the same canon. However, … The non-Greek, Monophysite and Nestorian Churches of the East (the Copts, the Ethiopians, the Syrians, the Armenians, the Syro-Malankars, the Chaldeans, and the Malabars) were still left out. But these Churches came together in agreement, in 1442A.D., in Florence.

1442
AD : At the Council of Florence, the entire Church recognized the 27 books. This council confirmed the Roman Catholic Canon of the Bible which Pope Damasus I had published a thousand years earlier. So, by 1439, all orthodox branches of the Church were legally bound to the same canon. This is 100 years before the Reformation.

1536
In his translation of the Bible from Greek into German, Luther removed 4 N.T. books (Hebrews, James, Jude, and Revelation) and placed them in an appendix saying they were less than canonical.

1546
At the Council of Trent, the Catholic Church reaffirmed once and for all the full list of 27 books. The council also confirmed the inclusion of the Deuterocanonical books which had been a part of the Bible canon since the early Church and was confirmed at the councils of 393 AD, 373, 787 and 1442 AD. At Trent Rome actually dogmatized the canon, making it more than a matter of canon law, which had been the case up to that point, closing it for good.
 
Septuagint and Catholic Bible

The Septuagint (which comes from the Latin for 70, “septuaginta”) was a translation of the Hebrew Books of the Old Testament into Greek, by 70 Jewish scholars.

The translation became necessary when it was found that most of the Israelites in exile, especially as a result of the Babylonian Captivity of 586-536 B.C., did not know Hebrew, but wanted to read the sacred books.

The work was done in Alexandria, Egypt, sometime between 250 B.C. and 100 B.C… This translation was warmly welcomed by Jews outside Palestine, as was read by many Gentiles. Consequently, many Gentiles were familiar with the important ideas in the Old Testament and were thus prepared to hear and accept the teachings of Jesus Christ.

In the early Church no list of inspired books had been accepted or approved.

Christ, and then the Apostles, did not give us a list of books which were inspired. However, the Septuagint was extremely influential among Jews living outside Palestine (and some inside Palestine), and was the sacred writings adopted by the early Greek-speaking Christians.

Throughout the New Testament there are more than 300 direct quotations or paraphrases from the Septuagint Bible out of some 350 Old Testament references. Scholars regard this as an indication that the Catholic Christian writers of the Apostolic Era had adopted the Septuagint as their own.

The Christians took the Septuagint over so completely that the Jews decided to adopt their own version. This was done about 90 A.D…

The Council of Hippo (393), the Council of Carthage (397), and Pope Innocent I (405) listed the 46 books of the Septuagint as inspired. The Catholic, Greek, Russian and other Orthodox Old Testaments are based on the Septuagint.

Vulgate

The Vulgate is the Latin version of the Bible prepared by St. Jerome (382-404), at the request of Pope St. Damasus I.

He translated the Old Testament directly from the original Hebrew, Aramaic and Greek, and revised the existing Latin text of the New Testament.

“Vulgate” means “common” or “popular”, since Latin was the popular language in Europe at the time. This translation was done in a language they could understand. Very few knew how to read.

The Vulgate was used through the centuries and was declared the official Latin text of the Bible for Catholics by the Council of Trent (1545-63).

It was from the Vulgate that almost all English Catholic translations were made until the middle of the 20th century, when scholars began to use original sources.

It remained the official Latin text of the Bible for the Catholic Church until Pope John Paul II replaced it with the New Vulgate in 1979.

Catholic Christians and non-Catholic Christians believe that the Bible is the inspired Word of God. This belief is based on their acceptance of the fact that the Catholic Church had the authority to declare which books were inspired and should be included in the list of sacred books or “Canon”, and which should not be included.

The Catholic Church knew it had this authority and guidance because:
  1. “And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever - the Spirit of truth” (John 14:16-17)
  2. “However, when He, the Spirit of Truth, as come, He will guide you into all truth” (John 16:13)
  3. “… I am with you always, even to the end of the age” (Matthew 28:20)
  4. “Whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven” (Matthew 16:19)
  5. “… it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets” (Ephesians 3:5)
  6. “… the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth” (1 Timothy 3:15)
For more than 1500 years the Catholic Church has accepted and taught that these 73 books of the Bible are inspired and make up the list of sacred books.

Jesus gave His Apostles and Church the gift of the Holy Spirit when He said. “… ‘Receive the Holy Spirit.’” (John 20:22).

Jesus also said, “However, when He, the Spirit of truth, has come, He will guide you into all truth” (John 16:13).

It is impossible that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, would lead the Church in an error for 1900 years. Such a promise was made to the Church alone.

So the Spirit of Truth guides the Church in all truth, not an individual person.
 
-Writings Which the Catholic Church decided to be the “Canon” of Scripture of the New Testament:

**Bolded ** Writings which the Catholic Church decided to be the “Canon” of Scripture of the New Testament

+ Writings (existing today) which the Church decided would NOT be included in the “Canon”

***** Writings (no longer in existence) which the Church decided would NOT be included in the “Canon”

GOSPELS

*Andrew
*Apelles
*Twelve Apostles
*Barnabas
*Bartholomew
*Basilides
+Birth of Mary
*Cerinthus
*Eyptians
*Ebionites
*Encratites
*Eve
*Hebrews
*Hesychius
+Infancy of Jesus Christ
+Infancy (by Thomas)
John
*Jude
*Judas Iscariot
+Lost Gospel of Peter
Luke
*Marcion
Mark
Matthew
*Matthias
*Mernthus
*Nazarenes
+Nicodemus
*Perfection
*Peter
+Philip
+The Protevangelion
*Sythianus
*Titan
*Thaddaeus
+Thomas
+Truth
  • Valentinus
REVELATION

*Cerinthus
John
*Paul
*Peter
*Philip
*Stephen
*Thomas

EPISTLES

+Barnabas
*Christ (to Peter & Paul)
*Christ (produced by the Manichees)
+Clement to the Corinthians (1)
+Clement to the Corinthians (2)
Hebrews
+Herod and Pilate
+Igantius to the Ephesians
+Igantius to the Magnesians
+Igantius to the Trallians
+Igantius to the Romans
+Igantius to the Philadelphians
+Igantius to the Smyrnaeans
+Igantius to the Polycarp
James
+Jesus and Abgarus
**John (1) **
**John (2) **
**John (3) **
Jude
+Paul to the Laodicians
+Paul and the Seneca
Paul to Romans
**Paul to the Corinthians (1) **
**Paul to the Corinthians (2) **
Paul to the Galatians
Paul to the Ephesians
Paul to the Philippians
Paul to the Colossians
**Paul to the Thessalonians (1) **
**Paul to the Thessalonians (2) **
**Paul to Timothy (1) **
**Paul to Timothy (2) **
Paul to Titus
Paul to Philemon
**Peter (1) **
**Peter (2) **
+Polycarp to the Philippians
*Themison (the Montanist)

ACTS

*Andrew
*Apostles (by Leucius)
*Apostles (by Lentitus)
*Apostles (by Leontius)
*Apostles (by Leuthon)
**Apostles (by Luke) **
*Apostles (used by the Ebonites)
*Apostles (used by Manichees)
*Apostles (used by Seleucus)
*John
*Paul
*Paul and Thecla
*Peter
*Philip
*Pilate
*Thomas

BOOKS BY

*Andrew
*Christ
*The Helkesaites
+Hermas (His Visions 1)
+Hermas (His Commands 2)
+Hermas (His Similitudes 3)
*James
*John
*Lentitius
*Matthew
*Matthias
*Paul
*Thomas

OTHER

+Apostles’ Creed
+The Didache
*The Doctrine of Peter
*The Judgement of Peter
*The Preaching of Paul (and Peter)
*The Preaching of Peter
*The Traditions of Matthias

From David McDonalds site;

The Catholic Church protected the Bible across the ages until the Gutenberg press was invented. Century after century, Monks in Monasteries faithfully copied Scripture. They were incredibly accurate. We have a modern discovery that is a testimony to how accurate the Monks were when they copied the Bible. The “Dead Sea Scrolls” were discovered in 1947 and they date back to 200 BC. They contain Old Testament books such as Isaiah. They predate some of the Monk’s copies by 1500 years. Yet the hand copied Bibles created by monks are almost identical to the Dead Sea Scrolls. This is remarkable given that the Monks were working from copies of copies. It would take each monk a lifetime to copy one Bible and thousands of faithful Catholics dedicated their lives to this work. Catholics protected the Bible over the centuries of wars, famines, plaques, the fall of Rome, fires, and threats from all sides. This was long before any other denomination existed.

The Bible didn’t just drop out of the sky, spiral bound, with an NIV sticker on it. The Catholic Church chose which books to include in the Bible in the Synod’s of Hippo (393 AD) and confirmed it at Carthage (397 AD). Here are the words of Professor Peter Flint, the non-Catholic scholar who translated the only English version of the Dead Sea Scrolls which won first prize from the Washington Biblical Archeology association:

“Without the Catholic Church you have no Bible, just a bunch of books and letters. With the Church you have the Bible!”
 
Joab_Anias said:
-Writings Which the Catholic Church decided to be the “Canon” of Scripture of the New Testament:

“Without the Catholic Church you have no Bible, just a bunch of books and letters. With the Church you have the Bible!”
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Very impressive. I’m going to print this out for future reference. 👍
 
Roguemelody said:
Personally, I thought (err…assumed) that he was called John the Baptist because of the numerous baptism he performed, including that of Jesus’.

Wasn’t the Baptist Church founded in the 16th century? Someone pls correct me if I’m wrong…my history lessons in school were minimal 😉

Also, just because both ‘John the Baptist’ and the ‘Baptist Church’ share the same word “baptist”, doesn’t make early Christians Baptist!! Especially because most of what the Bible teaches and what the Baptist Church teaches are two different things.

I’m convince that if John the Baptist had been going around preaching to the early Christians, what the Baptist Church now teaches, Jesus would have put a stop to it pretty quickly.
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John was from the southern part of Israel, so his name should actually be “John the Southern Baptist” !!!

😃
 
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