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Lisa44
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Do atheists go straight to hell? Or can they go to purgatory, or even heaven?
Thanks
Thanks
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johnnyvgoode
Guest
Jesus said that God will ask from us depending on how much did he give to us. Therefore, if an atheist was an atheist because he never heard of Jesus, he never willfully reject God, but God is just, therefore He would not send Him to Hell.
However, if the atheist DID reject God, then I think we can’t know. This is a mystery for us. How could someone willfully reject God? Faith is a gift from the Holy Spirity, so how could God punish someone who had no faith?
These are things we don’t know. What we do know is that if you choose to follow God then you will be with God, and if you don’t, you will not. But if a person didn’t choose with full knowledge, then we don’t know.
However, if the atheist DID reject God, then I think we can’t know. This is a mystery for us. How could someone willfully reject God? Faith is a gift from the Holy Spirity, so how could God punish someone who had no faith?
These are things we don’t know. What we do know is that if you choose to follow God then you will be with God, and if you don’t, you will not. But if a person didn’t choose with full knowledge, then we don’t know.
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Lisa44
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Some people choose not to believe in God. Its hard to imagine why? However, the fact remains.
I would think if a person was the least bit curious in spiritual matters they’d do a bit of an investigation. Even if its just reading general information on Jesus. There is no one living in the U.S. who has never heard of Jesus. Yet, they are not Christians and choose to believe there is no god, let alone a Christian god.
Is this person destined for hell?
This person must, I would imagine, be so consumed by worldly matters, that they feel that finding answers to life’s questions is pointless. Or worse, they did look for an answer and willfully decided there is no god. Either way, it doesn’t look good for that person does it?
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johnnyvgoode
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I believe most atheists, and actually most people in the US and the world in general, have received a bad Christian education. Thus, maybe they weren’t so encouraged to investigate, specially when the world is so trick with these stupid rock arguments and that things, and won’t be so encouraged to read about the religion his parents taught him or any other as he will see it as something cultural and relative to each person.
Besides, a lot of people who doubt about faith have had a troubling childhood.
Besides, a lot of people who doubt about faith have had a troubling childhood.
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TheDoctor
Guest
They go to the same place we all go when we die - before the judgment seat of God. There, God will judge them knowing what was in their minds and in their hearts every second of their lives. Then, in his infinite justice and mercy, they will be sent to either Heaven, Purgatory or Hell.
That is about all anyone can say for sure.
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johnnyvgoode
Guest
Don’t saints go to Heaven directly, or at least the Virgin Mary?
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JMJ_coder
Guest
Ultimately it is God’s judgment, but it doesn’t look good for them as far as I’m concerned. While the Church recognizes that some unbaptized may go to heaven when, due to no fault of their own, they haven’t been proclaimed the Gospel and try to do God’s will.
It doesn’t look good because:
- very few can claim to be totally, invincibly ignorant of the Gospel (those undisturbed tribes in S. America might qualify)
- belief in the one God is part of the natural law which all men must believe because it is written on the heart - atheists reject this most basic and innate of God’s law and revelation.
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Lisa44
Guest
I know Mary ascended into Heaven. I think the saints do too but I’m not sure. No, I would think only Mary did. Because if you have any stains, or sins, then you would have to look at those. Mary was sinless therefore she would ascend straight to Heaven.
I’m just guessing.
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Lisa44
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Thank you. I didn’t know that, although it makes sense. Does anyone know where there is information on this topic? Did any Church Fathers write on these subjects?
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RosaryFan
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No one can ever presume anyone is in hell. The Church recognizes certain saints as definitely being in heaven, but that’s all we know for sure.
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clmowry
Guest
I’m willing to bet on Mary. Outside of that, no telling.
I seem to recall the testimony of one of the Cannonized Saints
that another Saint upon their death found themselves in purgatory and upon release appeared to the 2nd Saint to thank him for and testify to the efficacy of his prayers.
Ring a bell with anyone else?
Chuck
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Fox
Guest
All Saints are in heaven or they wouldn’t be called Saints.
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Melchior
Guest
Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God.
- Jesus
Our job is to proclaim Christ to the unbeliever. He is their hope. We should assume the atheist is outside of Christ and will go to hell not vice versa. We do them no service by hoping in and exception clause. Yes, God can save someone through extraordinary means. But nowhere in scripture of Church teaching are we to assume a non evangelistic view. The unbaptized and unbelieving are generally speaking without hope.
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Nepenthe
Guest
Well, as far as we nontheists know, either in a box in a hole in the ground, or into an incinerator! 
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Genesis315
Guest
If someone obstinately persists in atheism (or idolotry for that matter), they cannot be saved. Belief in God is necessary for faith, and without faith it is impossible to please God.*
Now, anyone who seeks the truth will ultimately find it–since even someone who was an avowed atheist their whole may come to know the truth even an instant before death (since God sends everyone the helps necessary to come to salvation), we cannot condemn them and should still pray for their souls.
*The Apostle Paul declares there is no excuse for not believing in God. This document from the now CDF explains why such belief is necessary (it is cited in Lumen Gentium paragraph 16):
This is why Vatican II’s Lumen Gentium (paragraph 16) distinguishes between those who may be saved in their current condition with those who do not yet believe in God or worship the creature rather than the Creator, but He stills makes available to them the helps necessary to come to salvation.
See also the section of the Summa and the Scripture verses cited in the same paragraph.
Now, anyone who seeks the truth will ultimately find it–since even someone who was an avowed atheist their whole may come to know the truth even an instant before death (since God sends everyone the helps necessary to come to salvation), we cannot condemn them and should still pray for their souls.
*The Apostle Paul declares there is no excuse for not believing in God. This document from the now CDF explains why such belief is necessary (it is cited in Lumen Gentium paragraph 16):
matt1618.freeyellow.com/appendixe.html
This is why Vatican II’s Lumen Gentium (paragraph 16) distinguishes between those who may be saved in their current condition with those who do not yet believe in God or worship the creature rather than the Creator, but He stills makes available to them the helps necessary to come to salvation.
See also the section of the Summa and the Scripture verses cited in the same paragraph.
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JMJ_coder
Guest
It is as much an error to think that everyone will go to heaven as it is to believe that everyone who is not what you consider to be a good Catholic will go to hell.
The Church has always taught that you must be within the Catholic Church to go to heaven. The ordinary means of entry into the Church is by the Sacrament of Baptism. But the Church also teaches that there are extraordinary means, namely Baptism of Blood and Baptism of Desire. We have several named Saints who experienced a Baptism of Blood (they were martyred - usually by the pagan Romans). A Baptism of Desire is that those who are invincibly ignorant and would have desired to be Baptized if they had known and who obey the natural law written on their hearts. These, too, may enjoy the glory of heaven. That is Church teaching and not some ecumenical fairytale!
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Melchior
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You addressed something I never said. Respectfully, you did not address the substance of my post at all. Respectfully, go back and read it and addess what I wrote and I will be happy to engage.
I don’t think anyone is saved by being good. I do think Christians (Catholic, Protestant and Orthodox) are much more likely to go to heaven because they are baptized and primarily because they throw themselves on Christ mercy. You will notice that I started with a quote from Jesus himself on the matter. I don’t see how one can argue with that.
No atheist in the western world is invinsibly ignorant. They are willfully rejecting Christ. Even if they do not have a full understanding of the gospel. If they reject the very idea of God they are clearly rejecting Christ and He said such a person is condemned already. Now if one dies on such a state we cannot contradict Jesus.
Faith comes through hearing. The exception is not the rule. Scripture and the Catechism are clear how we are saved. The exception clause has never been the primary teaching fo the church on the matter.
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Melchior
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The Catechism of the Catholic Church
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Lisa44
Guest
Unfortunately, I don’t think many people in the western world fall under that criteria. I’ve never met anyone in my life who never heard of a bible or Jesus Christ. And every athiest I know says “oh I don’t believe in that…etc”. They reject Jesus, but they also reject the entire notion of a God who loves us and who created the world.
I think children or even young adults might fall under baptism of desire, as they have not yet been educated about religion, growing up in an atheist house. Then when they are adults they may become baptized. However, the belief in god was always in them despite the fact that their parents did nothing to cultivate it and even tried to suppress it.
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