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Fiasco
Guest
That`s the right angle of approach.
The bridal couple will cosine the marriage register.
The sooner this twisted thread (!) is painlessly put down and given a decent burial, the better!
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The bridal couple will cosine the marriage register.
The sooner this twisted thread (!) is painlessly put down and given a decent burial, the better!
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PacoG
Guest
That’s a bit of hyperbola.That`s the right angle of approach.
The bridal couple will cosine the marriage register.
The sooner this twisted thread (!) is painlessly put down and given a decent burial, the better!
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TheRealJuliane
Guest
:bowdown2:
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Wisely
Guest
What was Pope Zachary’s problem with Saint Uriel?
I find it offensife that a Pope prohibited veneration to a -real- saint…
I find it offensife that a Pope prohibited veneration to a -real- saint…
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MarkThompson
Guest
Well, he finds it offensive that you would pray to a demon as though it were a saint.
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pnewton
Guest
There is not St. Uriel.
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Swiss_Guy
Guest
Funny thread.
Anyway, no Angles have been recognized by the Church ever since the Saxons invaded England.
Anyway, no Angles have been recognized by the Church ever since the Saxons invaded England.
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Swiss_Guy
Guest
But they aren’t anymore because they have been rejected by Rome.
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Wisely
Guest
Yep, lets forget Sacred Tradition exists and use Sola Scriptura to determine our Angels.
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Fiasco
Guest
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pnewton
Guest
That would be ridiculous. Rather we rely upon Sacred Tradition, just not Jewish Kabal Tradition, and the teaching authority of the Holy Catholic Church. That is what we do as Catholic. Thus, there is no St. Uriel, any more than there is an angel Moroni.Yep, lets forget Sacred Tradition exists and use Sola Scriptura to determine our Angels.
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Wisely
Guest
Nobody mentioned Jewish Tradition, I mentioned Sacred Tradition. That’s why St.Gregory the Great and St.Dionysus say he’s the fourth archangel. Also, let’s not forget he IS a saint in both the Anglican, Oriental and Eastern Orthodox Communions.
Why is it so hard to accept that a Pope erred? It even wouldn’t be the first time.
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pnewton
Guest
Sacred Tradition is that there are only three named angels. Here they are listed in the Catechism:
vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p1s2c1p5.htm
I do not put any stock in the opinions of Anglican or Orthodox traditions, not where it contradicts Catholic doctrine.
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Wisely
Guest
May God have mercy on Gregory the Great, the Melkite, Byzantine and Ukranian Catholics who venerate him.
And how do you know St.Gregory (and St.Ambrose who also mentions him) is wrong and Zachary right?
2 Saints vs a no-name Pope. Common sense.
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newyorkcatholic
Guest
I have to agree. The Pope has the authority to forbid public / liturgical veneration of St. Uriel for sure.
But he can’t change facts. St. Gregory and the Pseudo-Dionysius talked about a St. Uriel, the fourth angel, and that’s a very strong point.
Also if the EO commemorate St. Uriel, I wonder if Byzantine Catholics do? If they do, lex orandi, lex credendi, there is a St. Uriel.
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pnewton
Guest
Maybe to you, but I do not understand the Orthodox mindset. Yet we do as the Catholic Church teaches. For what it is worth, even St. Thomas is not perfect. However, this Pope, that you call the “no-name” Pope (we call him St. Zachery) spoke with the authority of Jesus, as he served as his representative. Today, our current Catechism teaches this also, naming the three archangels, thus maintaining this doctrine.
Spin off into your own spirituality if you want. I will maintain that I have no business engaging in such spirituality and the danger of idolatry and demon worship.
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Wisely
Guest
That is why we need to pray for the** Eastern Catholics** who pray to him.
They’re engaging in demon worship!
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pnewton
Guest
If you are to be accurate in representing what I said, I said the *danger *of idolatry and demon worship. I do not believe in rolling the dice on such things. There is no need. I really do not know if Eastern Catholic venerate Uriel. I tried to find out and the only Churches I could find with the name of St. Uriel were Anglican and Gnostic Christian. Therefore, I will stick with the advice of St. Zachery and current Catholic teaching.That is why we need to pray for the** Eastern Catholics** who pray to him.
They’re engaging in demon worship!
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Wisely
Guest
St.Uriel in Eastern Catholicism,
ststephenbyzantine.org/sstephenbulletin11-06-11.pdf
stsophiaukrainian.cc/resources/nave/
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=381805
Therefore, Uriel is Catholic.
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Alfonsus
Guest
Enough to say that, in history of the Latin Church, there was tendency of excess in venerating the angels, thus in the Latin Church only Michael, Gabriel and Raphael are invoked by name.
Through them, the whole choirs of angel are venerated in corporate manner.
In the Eastern tradition, and in this case also in the tradition of Eastern Catholics Churches, several angels aside from those three are still named, for instance Uriel.
So what a Catholic should do? Surely a Catholic can use the prayer to Uriel if it come from true Catholic tradition (approved prayer), mainly from the Eastern Catholic collection of prayers and for private devotion.
But at the same time, we must use it according each ecclesial tradition. While the Byzantines do names Uriel, it is not right for a Latin to insert that name to the Litany of Saints for instance.
Through them, the whole choirs of angel are venerated in corporate manner.
In the Eastern tradition, and in this case also in the tradition of Eastern Catholics Churches, several angels aside from those three are still named, for instance Uriel.
So what a Catholic should do? Surely a Catholic can use the prayer to Uriel if it come from true Catholic tradition (approved prayer), mainly from the Eastern Catholic collection of prayers and for private devotion.
But at the same time, we must use it according each ecclesial tradition. While the Byzantines do names Uriel, it is not right for a Latin to insert that name to the Litany of Saints for instance.
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