Which church has produced more "fruit" catholic or protestant?

[ALLFORHIM]

The whole premise of this thread is divisive(SP?)

Its like your saying I did more then you did nanny nanny foo foo

The point is ALL churches should and probably are helping at some level.

Arent we suppose to do good works unto God and not be bragging I thought we were also not suppose to talk about good things we do. There is a bible verse somewhere about this.

I realize that was probably not the OP intent but it seems to have turned into that.

 

[lak611]

The whole premise of this thread is divisive(SP?)

Its like your saying I did more then you did nanny nanny foo foo

The point is ALL churches should and probably are helping at some level.

Arent we suppose to do good works unto God and not be bragging I thought we were also not suppose to talk about good things we do. There is a bible verse somewhere about this.

I realize that was probably not the OP intent but it seems to have turned into that.

I agree.

 

[m134e5]

how should we respond to protestants who claim that the catholic church does not produce enough “fruit” or isn’t reaching out to the lost enough?

It doesn’t produce enough fruit. My parents could always tell who the Catholics were in college- they could drink more than everybody else. The Catholic High School in this town is known to have the best parties. I can’t go 10 minutes at a Knights of Columbus fish fry without hearing someone swear or tell a dirty joke. Until recently, most of the publicity Catholicism got around here were when habitless nuns, and cassockless priests publically disagreed with Church teaching on various issues. Tell protestants, and others who claim the Catholic Church does not produce enough “fruit” or isn’t reaching out to the lost enough that the Church is made up of people who make mistakes and don’t always like to listen to reason. Tell them that there are many in the Church who love their faith, who are the good fruits of the Church. Sometimes it seems they are few and far between- and even they tend to be slow to speak up when the ACLU, or NOW, or Planned Parenthood, or Call to Action, or DignityUSA, or the National Catholic Reporter attack our Church- but that one day, we pray they will not tolerate being pushed around anymore, and demand the rights that are due to them that are given to the groups that bash them instead.

 

[rwoehmke]

It really is weird that you should mention feeling strange and indifferent at the ALPHA course run at the catholic church…i say this because i know of two people both catholics] who had nightmareish experiences doing ALPHA at local protestant churches methodist ; non-denominational]. One of the people involved was my nephew and he was disgusted at the lack of warmth shown by many participants…particularly as the whole experience is meant to be an introduction to christianity !!!
It is such a pity that you cannot come and experience ALPHA at our parish…we have it all…shared meals ; singing ; the video ; small group discussions where people are treated with the utmost respect…and finally prayer with all the ‘team’ in the church hall ! In fact we often have local methodists and episcopalians coming to our ALPHA , and i can assure you that each and every person has been overjoyed at having chosen our parish.
Don’t give up…also remember that you will always have people leaving and people joining the church…it’s happening as i type this positive message to all…blessings !

I have never done ALPHA at a Catholic Church. My experience at the Baptist Church is no problem with the taped presentations, which are pretty basic evangelization, and only a few differences in opinion in the discussion group that follows. I believe that Catholics use the same tapes with some supplementary material. Two more sessions left and no one has asked me to switch churches or made derogatory comments.on what Catholics believe.

 

[DB_AND_ALI]

The whole premise of this thread is divisive(SP?)

Its like your saying I did more then you did nanny nanny foo foo

The point is ALL churches should and probably are helping at some level.

Arent we suppose to do good works unto God and not be bragging I thought we were also not suppose to talk about good things we do. There is a bible verse somewhere about this.

I realize that was probably not the OP intent but it seems to have turned into that.

You obviously missed the original post , in which the person wanted to know of ways to reguvenate her parish…if you think i am boasting/bragging and that i am devisive…then it’s such a shame that you don’t know me personally ! For the record i have been arguing for christian unity since i was sixteen years old…i am 44 45 on 23 march !!!].
Today i have many protestant friends from the mainstream denominations who share my concern over the emergence of new ‘christian churches’ ; many that could be defined as cults…and many coming from the usa ?!

 

[DB_AND_ALI]

I have never done ALPHA at a Catholic Church. My experience at the Baptist Church is no problem with the taped presentations, which are pretty basic evangelization, and only a few differences in opinion in the discussion group that follows. I believe that Catholics use the same tapes with some supplementary material. Two more sessions left and no one has asked me to switch churches or made derogatory comments.on what Catholics believe.

Thankyou , thankyou…people seemed to have missed my point ; i was responding to a post and just asking the person if they had ALPHA at their church. Sorry if i offended any protestants out there …and yes the tapes are the same world-wide ; and no we do not use any additional material.
Peace in Christ !

 

[JesusforMadrid]

Thankyou , thankyou…people seemed to have missed my point ; i was responding to a post and just asking the person if they had ALPHA at their church. Sorry if i offended any protestants out there …and yes the tapes are the same world-wide ; and no we do not use any additional material.
Peace in Christ !

My own experience with Alpha in Catholic and evangelical settings is that it is an incredible movement for uniting Christ’s church. I, as an evangelical, feel much afinity with RCs who are doing Alpha. We are in common mission. Our differences are secondary. Praise be to God!

 

[TheHem]

Quote…

The Bible says that the mark of true followers of Christ is that the church is growing… if this is not happenning in your church than you are not following after Christ and you are not fulfilling the great commission.

I can only tell you from personal experience. I converted in '04 and to see the people coming into the church was overwhelming. At the rite of election that was held at the diocese, approx. 1500 came into the church. I only witnessed a third of that group. My mind took to me to heaven as I was amongst this group and wondered “WOW” what is it going to be like to see God’s children there?

It’s growing… and growing…and growing…

Our parish moved into a new building only 7 years ago and we need to expand already.

I understand the thought of those that are not as lively in their faith. I have a dear friend who uses the term “the frozen chosen” And this business about reaching out to the lost. Any one who calls themselves a believer is in one way or another reaching the lost or repelling the lost by their actions. Your life is a living testimony & it reflects whether or not we’re allowing Christ change us. right??**

 

[lak611]

Quote…

The Bible says that the mark of true followers of Christ is that the church is growing… if this is not happenning in your church than you are not following after Christ and you are not fulfilling the great commission.

I can only tell you from personal experience. I converted in '04 and to see the people coming into the church was overwhelming. At the rite of election that was held at the diocese, approx. 1500 came into the church. I only witnessed a third of that group. My mind took to me to heaven as I was amongst this group and wondered “WOW” what is it going to be like to see God’s children there?

It’s growing… and growing…and growing…

Our parish moved into a new building only 7 years ago and we need to expand already.

I understand the thought of those that are not as lively in their faith. I have a dear friend who uses the term “the frozen chosen” And this business about reaching out to the lost. Any one who calls themselves a believer is in one way or another reaching the lost or repelling the lost by their actions. Your life is a living testimony & it reflects whether or not we’re allowing Christ change us. right??**Of course, a particular faith (Catholic, Lutheran, Baptist, etc.) may have an increase in members, but some individual parishes or congregations may lose members whereas other individual parishes or congregations may gain members due to demographics in the neighbourhood. For instance, in the Diocese of Cleveland, the overall Catholic population has grown, but more members have moved to the outlying areas of the Diocese, leaving the parishes in the city proper and inner-ring suburbs with fewer members.

 

[Catholic_Mike]

One can go on and on about how deceptive emotion is in professing a faith, but I will tell you warm feelings can go a long way in helping to satisfy ones religous longings.

Yeah, but isn’t that sort of… counterfeit? The focus should be on God, not on social things.

But the point raised by the person 6glargento quoted can’t be dismissed out of hand just by saying that there are 1.1 billion Catholics. How many of those are Catholic in name only? How much of the growth in the Catholic Church is because we’re spreading the gospel, and how much of it is just what you’d expect due to people having kids? (Not that having children isn’t a good thing)

On the other hand, how much of the apparently exposive growth among some Protestant denominations (some are really hurting, I think) is people moving back and forth between Protestant churches? How much staying power do they have? How much of it is based on entertainment, emotionalism (Some people seem to think “I feel happy = I feel God”), and an admittedly great, supportive social atmosphere?

Christian communities across the board have problems we need to work on. In any case, does the “fruit” the Bible speaks of really mean “number of members?” Is fast, continuous growth really the mark of the true church?

 

[wisdomseeker]

I’m not sure what you are trying to show with your statistics. It looks to me like there are more Catholics overall but less people actually practicing Catholicism or raising their children as Catholics. Or was that your point?/QUOTE

to see the beauty of the Catholic Church one must look at this Church through the eyes of the Holy Spirit. Peter saw Jesus as a mighty King of God while others with their high expectations for a king with a mighty army saw Jesus as a simple man with nothing to offer, fort that they rejected and prosecuted him. One must have faith that Jesus built this Church and the gates of Hades will not prevail. God bless his Curch until the end of time.

 

[wisdomseeker]

to see the beauty of the Catholic Church one must see it through the eyes of the Holy Spirit. Peter saw Jesus as the Mighty King of God, others saw Jesus as a simple man with nothing to offer for they expected a king with a mighty army to rule over the whole world. for that they prosecuted and despised him. don’t let your eyes deceive you. God bless his Church until the end of time just like he promised. amen.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I made a post on another forum defending the catholic church’s teaching on the eucharist and its claim to be the only true church on earth. A protestant responded with the following

how should we respond to protestants who claim that the catholic church does not produce enough “fruit” or isn’t reaching out to the lost enough? What exactly are the statistics of catholic converts, last time i heard it was growing?

1. The question in the title is impossible to answer.​

1. Maybe the criticisms mentioned are a guide for some soul-searching
2. Stats are no measure of spiritual fruitfulness - because God’s work cannot be quantified.
3. What we can’t afford to lose sight of is that we are sinners - & this is bound to affect our service of Christ; no matter what Church we are in.

 

[thecoach]

Yes there was poll out that 75% of Catholics reject the Church’s teachings which is shameful.

Though I am not surprise, especially amongst American Catholics. There are only a few of us traditional Catholics devoted to Jesus Christ and his Holy Catholic Church.

perhaps its the traditional catholics that are driving people away.

 

[Mannyfit75]

perhaps its the traditional catholics that are driving people away.

I think the best way to show other Catholics to practice their faith more is to have the devout Catholic who are always faithful, lead by example. By their charity and living day by day like Jesus would. Then I tell you, there will be people coming to the Church…

 

[NotWorthy]

perhaps its the traditional catholics that are driving people away.

If Traditional Catholics are driving people away by preaching the truth, then so be it. Preaching anti-abortion, non-contraception, homosexuality (the acts of) is sinful, and women can’t be priests, is simply preaching the truth when done in the right manner.

But, if Traditional Catholics are driving people away by lording the Truth over others, then shame on them. Sounds a lot like the Pharisees, eh?

 

[lukewarm]

I would say the Catholic Church it has spread the Gospel longer and it’s charities have helped countless millions. A few bad apples doesn’t negate all the good it has done over the years.

 

[annem]

Perhaps the Protestant who was complaining about the lack of fruit in America was right. The 70’s were a catastrophe for the church in America…the nuns who had taught our Catholic schools fled the convents in droves, schools closed, Catholics left the church, and our priests…well…

Our numbers would be much smaller, except for the flood of Catholics from Mexico. But most of those cheap Catholic schools with nuns as teachers are gone. So right now 40% of all children born to the immigrants are illegitimate. And the second generation, utterly without formation, tend to fall into the gang culture.

And I can’t really see things getting much better. Not when our culture so toxic. TV is a cesspool, with shows promoting homosexuality, a promiscuous lifestyle, and profanity. The serial killer is usually a devout Christian. Virtue is mocked.

Sometimes I feel like one of the early persecuted Christians living amid the debauched citizens of Rome.

So looking for fruit here is hard, even though of course there are great saints among us, holy priests and devout parishes.

But there are always areas in the church that are in trouble. Always have been. And there are always areas where there is huge growth, as we have in Asia and Africa today.

Anne

 

[Noobasaurus_Rex]

Whoever the responder was, he was pretty ignorant.

He wants to talk about denominational leadership? Ask him who the protestant leader is and how many people know that leader.

Then tell him about John Paul II.

John Paul II was listed as the 8th most admired person in the USA.
He was one of the key figures in the fall of communism. For the first time in so many years, there were was so much religious dialogue between religons thanks to him. And Pope Benedict XVI is now continuing that.

Let the responder know that they must have lived under a rock, implicitly don’t say it directly.

Lol

 

[Good_Fella]

Our modern day “hospital” is the offspring of the Catholic “hospice”.

Pax vobiscum
Good Fella