Which parts of the Gospels specifically have not been corrupted?

[Jay53]

If this question has already been asked and answered please direct me to the appropriate thread. Thank you.

I have heard it bantered about in these forums that the Bible is corrupt and that is why many people do not follow the Gospels or believe in the divinity of Jesus. My question therefore is 2 part:

1. Who corrupted the Gospels and to what end/purpose?
2. What passages from the Gospels have not been corrupted? (I’m trying to focus on the 4 Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John - I don’t want to get into a whole discussion of Paul. (I believe there is another thread for that. ))

(Just for example, the wedding feast at Cana (John, 2) where Jesus performs the miracle of turning water into wine that His Blessed Mother witnessed: Have these passages been corrupted? If so, how? What should the passages have been?)

I am hoping this will help me understand why some people/faiths do not believe in the divinity of Jesus. (And PLEASE, if there are any Muslims that respond to this, please do not bring up the whole “partners with Allah/3 gods” point. That whole idea has been refuted and discussed ad nauseum and is not what my question is about.

Thank you in advance for your help.

 

[Jay53]

Bump

 

[ralphinal]

I have never seen a good answer to this. From what has been posted, it is either that they were not written by Jesus or under his direction, so they are suspect or that they just are corrupted.

At the same time, they are considered fine by the Quran,

It is confusing.

 

[ckempston]

If this question has already been asked and answered please direct me to the appropriate thread. Thank you.

I have heard it bantered about in these forums that the Bible is corrupt and that is why many people do not follow the Gospels or believe in the divinity of Jesus. My question therefore is 2 part:

1. Who corrupted the Gospels and to what end/purpose?
2. What passages from the Gospels have not been corrupted? (I’m trying to focus on the 4 Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John - I don’t want to get into a whole discussion of Paul. (I believe there is another thread for that. ))

(Just for example, the wedding feast at Cana (John, 2) where Jesus performs the miracle of turning water into wine that His Blessed Mother witnessed: Have these passages been corrupted? If so, how? What should the passages have been?)

I am hoping this will help me understand why some people/faiths do not believe in the divinity of Jesus. (And PLEASE, if there are any Muslims that respond to this, please do not bring up the whole “partners with Allah/3 gods” point. That whole idea has been refuted and discussed ad nauseum and is not what my question is about.

Thank you in advance for your help.

I’m curious who usually makes these claims? I’ve only ever heard anything like this from Muslims, Mormons, and I suppose Jehovah’s Witnesses. Or are you referring to the KJV-Only crowd?

 

[Jay53]

I don’t remember specifically everyone who has claimed this. I do know that planten, who I believe is a Muslim, has made this claim. I’ve also noticed that no one has answered this. Perhaps I am mistaken and have misread or misinterpreted the posts, and if so, and no one answers this, then I suppose that I should expect not to see this assertion here anymore.

 

[ckempston]

I don’t remember specifically everyone who has claimed this. I do know that planten, who I believe is a Muslim, has made this claim. I’ve also noticed that no one has answered this. Perhaps I am mistaken and have misread or misinterpreted the posts, and if so, and no one answers this, then I suppose that I should expect not to see this assertion here anymore.

I wouldn’t hold your breath.

 

[Ed_Rand]

I am not a Mormon, but from their perspective, you would have to believe that the promises to Peter are a fabrication. As Jesus tells the Nephites:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, that this is my doctrine, and whoso buildeth upon this buildeth upon my rock, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against them.–3 Nephi 11:39

 

[paarsurrey]

Hi

We Muslims believe in Moses, Jesus and Mary only because God Allah has mentioned their names and accounts of their life in Quran.

Jesus never dictated any Gospels or authenticated them. Neither Jesus nor Mary ever read these gospels. It were most probably written when Jesus alongwith Mary and his trusted friend were on their way to India.

The Gospels are not strictly speaking even one hundred per cent accurate historical sources. We therefore only believe in them what tallies with Quran or at least is not against Quran.

Gospels do not record full life account of Jesus life. They mention only a partial account of Jesus’ and Mary’s life.

This is my opinion; others could differ with me.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks

 

[Reuben_J]

In other words that would be Mt27 & 28, Mk 15 & 16, Lk22, 23 & 24, Jn 19,20 & 21, and Acts 1 to 28. Oh you said only the Gospels. Ok you can throw out the Acts first.

There are others somewhere else in the four Gospels. The above are for starters.

 

[Sister_Amy]

Muslims believe that Jesus was given some revelation, called the Injil. You can call it the Gospel, since New Testament literature uses the word “Gospel” to refer to the message Jesus was preaching.

 

[Ruthie]

Hi, Jay,

There is a symposium of modernist scholars, called the Jesus Seminar, that got together and voted on which sayings of Jesus were authentic and which weren’t. They decided that only 20 percent of the sayings attributed to Jesus were genuine.

Could that be what you’ve been hearing?

Voted. Harumph. The Church is not a democracy!

God bless you,

Ruthie

 

[paarsurrey]

There is a symposium of modernist scholars, called the Jesus Seminar, that got together and voted on which sayings of Jesus were authentic and which weren’t. They decided that only 20 percent of the sayings attributed to Jesus were genuine.
God bless you,

Ruthie

Hi

They must be giving some arguments and reasons about every saying of Jesus; that should be seen, and if reasonable, there is no harm in accepting it.

Thanks

 

[ralphinal]

Hi

They must be giving some arguments and reasons about every saying of Jesus; that should be seen, and if reasonable, there is no harm in accepting it.

Thanks

Any sayings that allowed for miracles were thrown out.

Any sayings that foretold of any future event were thrown out.

Any sayings that did not agree with the agenda that these heretics had were thrown out.

The one thing that these people agree on is that at no time has God had any interaction with man once the world was created.

 

[Jay53]

Hi, Jay,

There is a symposium of modernist scholars, called the Jesus Seminar, that got together and voted on which sayings of Jesus were authentic and which weren’t. They decided that only 20 percent of the sayings attributed to Jesus were genuine.

Could that be what you’ve been hearing?

Voted. Harumph. The Church is not a democracy!

God bless you,

Ruthie

Ruthie,
Thanks for your reply. I had not heard of the Jesus Seminar, but your reply leads me to a point that I had not considered. Is the fact that Jesus, himself, did not write the Gospels, but his followers did is why they are considered corrupted? What about Matthew, Mark, Luke and John makes them unreliable? And wouldn’t the other apostles and witnesses to Jesus’ life have corrected them? What purpose would a “corrupted” Bible have served to the people of that time - I mean how would the Gospel writers have benefited from that - fame, wealth, followers/pride??

 

[Jay53]

7
The one thing that these people agree on is that at no time has God had any interaction with man once the world was created.

Do they believe in any of the approved apparitions of Blessed Mother (i.e. Fatima) and if so, how are they explained? - wouldn’t God have to have allowed this to happen? I can’t imagine that they believe Blessed Mother can appear without God’s permission?

 

[hamba2han]

Christians are very courageous people.

This video was written and presented by a Christian theologian.

Bearing in mind what is at stake in the Hereafter, all I can say is that anyone who would peg his or her own fate in the afterlife to their belief in the authenticity and accuracy of the Bible to be the true Word of God, is surely someone who is very brave indeed.

I can never have this kind of “courage”.

 

[Booklover]

Christians are very courageous people.

This video was written and presented by a Christian theologian.

Bearing in mind what is at stake in the Hereafter, all I can say is that anyone who would peg his or her own fate in the afterlife to their belief in the authenticity and accuracy of the Bible to be the true Word of God, is surely someone who is very brave indeed.

I can never have this kind of “courage”.

What about you? You’ve staked your immortal soul on the so-called “private” revelations of one man. You may consider that wise, but I consider it extreme foolishness.

Vickie

 

[paarsurrey]

Do they believe in any of the approved apparitions of Blessed Mother (i.e. Fatima) and if so, how are they explained? - wouldn’t God have to have allowed this to happen? I can’t imagine that they believe Blessed Mother can appear without God’s permission?

Hi

I don’t think there are any approved authentic apparition of Jesus or Mary seen by any Catholic. If you mean from “approved” vatican approval; that does not add any credence to the issue.

I don’t think, the vatican clergy have themselves seen any apparitions. Those who see don’t mention a clear picture of Jesus or Mary; they see something foggy, they cannot describe clear physical features of Jesus or Mary. They don’t agree on the features.

I love Jesus and Mary as I do love Buddha and Krishna

Thanks

 

[paarsurrey]

Any sayings that allowed for miracles were thrown out.

Hi

Kidly mention one specific miracle Jesus Seminar people deny with their arguments. We can then see if they are wrong or the Catholics have misunderstood the verses. In my opinion, this is reasonable.

Thanks

 

[ralphinal]

Hi

Kidly mention one specific miracle Jesus Seminar people deny with their arguments. We can then see if they are wrong or the Catholics have misunderstood the verses. In my opinion, this is reasonable.

Thanks

The feeding of the multitude in John 6 for one. The Resurection for another.

The Virgin Birth