White people have 13 dollars for every dollar held by black Americans

[RGCheek]

The issue at hand was your claim that we pay 50% of our income in taxes. You were making a claim about the median taxpayer without citing median data. So once again, where is your evidence that we pay 50% of our income in taxes?

Lol, ALL THE FACTS GIVEN, dude. The aggregate data supports the 32% claim directly, and when you remove the ‘averaged’ tax payer data that the median tax payer would not receive and yet still pays in all the additional taxes that come in the form of lost income due to employer payments to social security, the costs of business taxes passed on to the consumer, and other taxes like sales taxes it is easily seen to be well over 50%.

Here the authors add up almost everything and come to a grand total of 53% for the people in the 39.6% bracket.

The detailed figures add up even higher.
17% federal income tax.
10.1% state and local tax
9.7% sales taxes of all kinds
15.3% social security and medicare taxes
2.5% state and federal corporate taxes that get passed on to consumer
2.5% property taxes
0.5% fuel taxes
6% other taxes.
64.6% of annual income paid into taxes at all levels by median or typical tax payer who does not have almost doubled income fro proprietor, dividend or investment income.

But the bottom line is that compared to the 3% top tax rate that Roman citizens paid, we are taxed beyond what people historically would tolerate, way more. At 3% Romans were leaving their own cities and joining the Visigoths and Franks, renouncing their Roman citizenships.

We are way, way, way past that. We are way past the tea and paper taxes that of about 1% that the Founding Fathers were told they had to pay and incited the American Revolution.

And why is that? Because any time people like me try to point this out, people like you come along and try to obfuscate the whole matter with nit picks and irrelevant distractions.

 

[zz912]

Price is determined by the intersection of supply and demand. In the overwhelming majority of cases it works very nicely. Occasionally things can get overblown, but those are rare occasions. If the arms length interactions of buyers and sellers don’t determine value, what does?

Price and value are two different things.

 

[RGCheek]

Lol, ALL THE FACTS GIVEN, dude. The aggregate data supports the 32% claim directly, and when you remove the ‘averaged’ tax payer data that the median tax payer would not receive and yet still pays in all the additional taxes that come in the form of lost income due to employer payments to social security, the costs of business taxes passed on to the consumer, and other taxes like sales taxes it is easily seen to be well over 50%.

Here the authors add up almost everything and come to a grand total of 53% for the people in the 39.6% bracket.

The detailed figures add up even higher.
17% federal income tax.
10.1% state and local tax
9.7% sales taxes of all kinds
15.3% social security and medicare taxes
2.5% state and federal corporate taxes that get passed on to consumer
2.5% property taxes
0.5% fuel taxes
6% other taxes.
64.6% of annual income paid into taxes at all levels by median or typical tax payer who does not have almost doubled income fro proprietor, dividend or investment income.

But the bottom line is that compared to the 3% top tax rate that Roman citizens paid, we are taxed beyond what people historically would tolerate, way more. At 3% Romans were leaving their own cities and joining the Visigoths and Franks, renouncing their Roman citizenships.

We are way, way, way past that. We are way past the tea and paper taxes that of about 1% that the Founding Fathers were told they had to pay and incited the American Revolution.

And why is that? Because any time people like me try to point this out, people like you come along and try to obfuscate the whole matter with nit picks and irrelevant distractions.

I apologize, but I somehow managed to delete the link on the detailed data.

nowandfutures.com/taxes.html

 

[stinkcat_14]

I apologize, but I somehow managed to delete the link on the detailed data.

nowandfutures.com/taxes.html

I hate to tell you this but your data is horrible. Especially if you are trying to determine the tax burden for the median taxpayer. From your data source, the average federal tax rate is 13% for those in the top 50% of AGI, and 3% for those in the bottom half. So it is no where close to the 17% that you claim. So for the person right at 50%, it is somewhere between these two numbers,. If you want to really understand economics you are going to have to try harder.

 

[RGCheek]

I hate to tell you this but your data is horrible. Especially if you are trying to determine the tax burden for the median taxpayer.

1. I have given different data for different reasons. Not every time has it been to show the median tax payer’s tax bill.
2. I have given the sources to all the data I have used, and those sources often cite the sources they have used. You have, on the other hand, given no sources and yet claim my data is ‘horrible’. I cannot avoid a certain level of mirth in reading that.

From your data source, the average federal tax rate is 13% for those in the top 50% of AGI, and 3% for those in the bottom half. So it is no where close to the 17% that you claim.

The sources cited in the post you are responding to was looking at the top rate to delve the worst case scenarios. I referenced them just to show that the 52% I gave isn’t simply invented out of thin air, something you would have realized well before that had you read the data I have given with an open mind.

So for the person right at 50%, it is somewhere between these two numbers,. If you want to really understand economics you are going to have to try harder.

That is only the income tax rate. That is not the total tax burden that American payers pay, not even close, and I am not going to explain it all again to you.

Suffice it to say that what we pay is more than 10 times what people have historically tolerated generally in western nations by people who were supposedly free people.

The Romans paid no more than 3% of their income in taxes while we pay about 13 times that, and yet in our culture the Roman tax collector was generally considered an example of moral detritus and the Romans to have been oppressively taxed.

And that puts what we endure today into an historical context that is illuminating.

 

[Jerurussia]

Bella Dodd, the Communist attorney, split after seeing the New York-based Communist Party USA working intimately with the banksters to enslave the people. Dodd identified “progressives” as Communists with degrees. So the people’s party has primed the sheeple for death by a thousand cuts.

Democrat Jimmy Carter, who OK’d the gangsta Hugo Chavez’ gunpoint election in Venezuela, removed the usury limits so we got skinned by 24% interest rates. “I feel yer pain” William Jefferson Clinton eradicated the Glass-Steigall Act that once created a protective wall between investment bankers/gamblers and your neighborhood consumer bank. Now your assets are “their” assets; and anti-capitalist banksters are no longer because capitalists can fail. The USA has the Mexico-style oligarchs they define as “too big to fail.” Clinton drove out the one voice of sanity, Brooksley Born, who predicted an economic implosion if derivatives went totally unregulated. She notes it is still unregulated. Observers predict that “civil unrest” will result in a replay of usurious government mortgages for the poor poor and another housing bubble and another Fannie Mae-triggered collapse of the housing market and derivatives based on mortgages will suck our money to cover their losses.

Famous Barack’s spending 3/4 of his budget on banksters, spying on people, militarizing the police, and the Military Industrial Complex per Gerald Solenti while accidentally forgetting to implement 7 billion in foreclosure relief, or earmark any TARP funds for shovel-ready jobs. And he laughed about no shovel-ready jobs. The people’s poor little rich president shoveled cash into Wall Street with quantitative easing and low interest rates so the banksters can loan it back to us at high interest rates. The Democrats are the welfare party–welfare for the rich who get richer. Propaganda has spawned a gaggle of ignorant bigots with degrees–progressives–who click a “like” button as their sole act of social justice and all the while they are too brainwashed to realize THEY are the problem. This is the low-information high-education American that is self-deluded and self-destructive like the German industrialists who supported national socialism and Hitler only to have their businesses nationalized. This is a global Ponzi scheme with Barack as point man.

Yeah, white people may have all the money–white and half-white oligarchs. Wealth has become increasingly concentrated at the expense of we the people, with 85 people in the world having as much wealth as 1/2 the entire world’s population. But that’s good. More civil unrest, more usury, more peace-keeping Military Industrial Complex products for domestic and foreign sales. It’s all good.

**“The Lord hears the cry of the poor.” **

 

[RGCheek]

Bella Dodd, the Communist attorney, split after seeing the New York-based Communist Party USA working intimately with the banksters to enslave the people. Dodd identified “progressives” as Communists with degrees. So the people’s party has primed the sheeple for death by a thousand cuts.

Democrat Jimmy Carter, who OK’d the gangsta Hugo Chavez’ gunpoint election in Venezuela, removed the usury limits so we got skinned by 24% interest rates. “I feel yer pain” William Jefferson Clinton eradicated the Glass-Steigall Act that once created a protective wall between investment bankers/gamblers and your neighborhood consumer bank. Now your assets are “their” assets; and anti-capitalist banksters are no longer because capitalists can fail. The USA has the Mexico-style oligarchs they define as “too big to fail.” Clinton drove out the one voice of sanity, Brooksley Born, who predicted an economic implosion if derivatives went totally unregulated. She notes it is still unregulated. Observers predict that “civil unrest” will result in a replay of usurious government mortgages for the poor poor and another housing bubble and another Fannie Mae-triggered collapse of the housing market and derivatives based on mortgages will suck our money to cover their losses.

Famous Barack’s spending 3/4 of his budget on banksters, spying on people, militarizing the police, and the Military Industrial Complex per Gerald Solenti while accidentally forgetting to implement 7 billion in foreclosure relief, or earmark any TARP funds for shovel-ready jobs. And he laughed about no shovel-ready jobs. The people’s poor little rich president shoveled cash into Wall Street with quantitative easing and low interest rates so the banksters can loan it back to us at high interest rates. The Democrats are the welfare party–welfare for the rich who get richer. Propaganda has spawned a gaggle of ignorant bigots with degrees–progressives–who click a “like” button as their sole act of social justice and all the while they are too brainwashed to realize THEY are the problem. This is the low-information high-education American that is self-deluded and self-destructive like the German industrialists who supported national socialism and Hitler only to have their businesses nationalized. This is a global Ponzi scheme with Barack as point man.

Yeah, white people may have all the money–white and half-white oligarchs. Wealth has become increasingly concentrated at the expense of we the people, with 85 people in the world having as much wealth as 1/2 the entire world’s population. But that’s good. More civil unrest, more usury, more peace-keeping Military Industrial Complex products for domestic and foreign sales. It’s all good.

**“The Lord hears the cry of the poor.” **

Good post.

 

[SuperLuigi]

“The Lord hears the cry of the poor.”

True enough. But I want to throw this out there and earnestly ask:

What would He say to the well-fed “poor” in America who have DVD players, internet, cable TV and a cell phone plan who consistently vote anti-life, anti-marriage and peddle an overrated claim to victimhood on the basis of identity politics?

Does being poor give someone the right to renege on their obligation to vote pro-life and pro-marriage?

I’m sure it does not.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Bella Dodd, the Communist attorney, split after seeing the New York-based Communist Party USA working intimately with the banksters to enslave the people. Dodd identified “progressives” as Communists with degrees. So the people’s party has primed the sheeple for death by a thousand cuts.

Democrat Jimmy Carter, who OK’d the gangsta Hugo Chavez’ gunpoint election in Venezuela, removed the usury limits so we got skinned by 24% interest rates. “I feel yer pain” William Jefferson Clinton eradicated the Glass-Steigall Act that once created a protective wall between investment bankers/gamblers and your neighborhood consumer bank. Now your assets are “their” assets; and anti-capitalist banksters are no longer because capitalists can fail. The USA has the Mexico-style oligarchs they define as “too big to fail.” Clinton drove out the one voice of sanity, Brooksley Born, who predicted an economic implosion if derivatives went totally unregulated. She notes it is still unregulated. Observers predict that “civil unrest” will result in a replay of usurious government mortgages for the poor poor and another housing bubble and another Fannie Mae-triggered collapse of the housing market and derivatives based on mortgages will suck our money to cover their losses.

Famous Barack’s spending 3/4 of his budget on banksters, spying on people, militarizing the police, and the Military Industrial Complex per Gerald Solenti while accidentally forgetting to implement 7 billion in foreclosure relief, or earmark any TARP funds for shovel-ready jobs. And he laughed about no shovel-ready jobs. The people’s poor little rich president shoveled cash into Wall Street with quantitative easing and low interest rates so the banksters can loan it back to us at high interest rates. The Democrats are the welfare party–welfare for the rich who get richer. Propaganda has spawned a gaggle of ignorant bigots with degrees–progressives–who click a “like” button as their sole act of social justice and all the while they are too brainwashed to realize THEY are the problem. This is the low-information high-education American that is self-deluded and self-destructive like the German industrialists who supported national socialism and Hitler only to have their businesses nationalized. This is a global Ponzi scheme with Barack as point man.

Yeah, white people may have all the money–white and half-white oligarchs. Wealth has become increasingly concentrated at the expense of we the people, with 85 people in the world having as much wealth as 1/2 the entire world’s population. But that’s good. More civil unrest, more usury, more peace-keeping Military Industrial Complex products for domestic and foreign sales. It’s all good.

**“The Lord hears the cry of the poor.” **

Well, if working class white farmers want to vote for Jimmy Carter thinking he cares about all of them so very much because he was a peanut farmer and if African-Americans want to vote for Barack Obama because he’s Black so he MUST care about African-Americans, then those are the kinds of returns on your investment ye shall receive. Because as one African-American notes “this kind of voting behavior is idolatry”.

It really may be reduced down to that.