Who claims to be the Truth? (new thread)

[Kitty_Chan]

From the book again

*In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1: 1

The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory John 1:14

He was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood., and His name is called “The Word of God.” Rev 19:13*

Behind the expression of sound, speech, and substance lies the fact of thought. The philosophy of Hebrew doctrine declares that behind thought is a thinker, whose mind is infinite in wisdom and knowledge. The Word of life in past centuries had been expressed in speech (Heb 1:1 )

The evidence of the invisible Godhead was also demonstrated in a tangible creation. However, it was not until the manifestation of Christ that humanity received a clear and full revelation of Gods personal being.

The emergence of Christ from the obscure to the obvious, fulfilled an age-old prophetic forecast, “Your God shall come” ( Isa 25:9; 35: 4-6 )

This may account for the deputation John sent to Jesus to ask the question “Art Thou He that should come, or do we look for another?” (Matt 11:3)

The apostle John describes the coming into visibility of the previously invisible Maker and declares Him to the the very prototype of God. He who is **everlastingly the Word **is made flesh, and manifests the Father in His Grace and Truth.

He disclosed the Father perfectly in mind, will and heart, distinguished His personality, and definitely displayed Deity to mankind.

end book

thoughts?? also, what John asked of Jesus was quite a question, I bet its lost on alot of us.



ps thanks MH that helps too.

 

[dessert]

From the book again

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1: 1

The Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory John 1:14

He was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood., and His name is called “The Word of God.” Rev 19:13

Behind the expression of sound, speech, and substance lies the fact of thought. The philosophy of Hebrew doctrine declares that behind thought is a thinker, whose mind is infinite in wisdom and knowledge. The Word of life in past centuries had been expressed in speech (Heb 1:1 )

The evidence of the invisible Godhead was also demonstrated in a tangible creation. However, it was not until the manifestation of Christ that humanity received a clear and full revelation of Gods personal being.

The emergence of Christ from the obscure to the obvious, fulfilled an age-old prophetic forecast, “Your God shall come” ( Isa 25:9; 35: 4-6 )

The apostle John describes the coming into visibility of the previously invisible Maker and declares Him to the the very prototype of God. He who is **everlastingly the Word **is made flesh, and manifests the Father in His Grace and Truth.

He disclosed the Father perfectly in mind, will and heart, distinguished His personality, and definitely displayed Deity to mankind.

end book

thoughts?? also, what John asked of Jesus was quite a question, I bet its lost on alot of us.

This may account for the deputation John sent to Jesus to ask the question “Art Thou He that should come, or do we look for another?” (Matt 11:3)

Yes this is a good pull of a question and could make a thread on it’s own.
Before I came back to the Catholic faith(Church) I knew the way and said it many times but not really knew how the meaning applied to my life. I wondered am I right in this way now, is this just another church or way, but soon realized that it is all three in the Catholic church which I had not really embraced before.
So to understand better I had to start living the way and speaking the truth and accepting the truth and getting past the lies. I was a Judas but Jesus never called me a traitor nor the church so to get to the life was to to live the life, as Jesus did. The Holy spirit descended on Jesus at His baptism as a witness and living in Him and this is what He (both) wished for us tobe having the truth abiding in us. Bringing joy to His heart is my way to Him, the truth He wants to bring life to my soul eternally.

 

[Valke2]

oh good point! these are the kinds of things I was looking for.

I didnt think of authority as meaning that.

When Jesus is compairing Moses’ Torah and His Torah He says “It was said to them of old . . but “I” say to you . . .” No teacher of the law could legitimately say that, which is why the people were alarmed. He teaches not as the rabbis do, but as one who has “authority.” Their reaction is understandable. Jesus is making an open claim that he himself is on the same exalted level as the Lawgiver. (God) I believe this to be true.

I’d disagree with the conclusions above for the followng reasons.
What Jesus was doing with the whole “but I say to you…” teachings was common among Jewish teachers. They were doing what is called building a fence around the Torah. That is, taking laws that were in existance and expanding them as a way of insuring that the original laws would be obeyed. We have a long tradition of doing this. By way of example, it is prohibited to carry money on Shabbat. The reason is that if we carry money, we may be tempted to spend it, and the act of spending it would violate the laws regarding our sabbath. This is what Jesus was doing, more or less.

I do agree that it was his act of replacing Torah with his authority that many Jews had a big problem with. The “follow me” instead of “follow Torah” aspects of his speeches.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

I do agree that it was his act of replacing Torah with his authority that many Jews had a big problem with. The “follow me” instead of “follow Torah” aspects of his speeches.

so you think thats why they were “alarmed” so much??

 

[Valke2]

so you think thats why they were “alarmed” so much??

I think that where Jesus truly departs from Judaism, from a Jewish POV, is by conditioning salvation on obeying or following him, and not so much as by putting forth his interpetation of how one is to live their life.

 

[Kitty_Chan]

I think that where Jesus truly departs from Judaism, from a Jewish POV, is by conditioning salvation on obeying or following him, and not so much as by putting forth his interpetation of how one is to live their life.

Well that would be understandable. When you said they would insure that the original laws would be obeyed. Jesus may have been responding to something like that when He said He didnt come to abolish but fulfill the Law. It kind of underscores what John meant when he said are you the one that was to come

 

[ryanoneil]

Well that would be understandable. When you said they would insure that the original laws would be obeyed. Jesus may have been responding to something like that when He said He didnt come to abolish but fulfill the Law. It kind of underscores what John meant when he said are you the one that was to come

Another thing to think about is that many expected that the Messih would overthrow the oppression of the Romans and some people were arming themselves in readiness. Another expectation was the healing of those who are afflicted.Well, considering that Jesus wasn’t a fiery preacher of damnation and judgement like John’s message of repent now. John sent his disciples to check out Jesus and report back.

Jesus, as Messiah, was overthowing the oppresion of blindness, leprosy, poverty, and exclusion. He tells John’s disciples to “go back and tell John what you see and hear.” By describing what they saw and heard, they were able to describe the biginning of the Messianic Age. He was different than John’s expectations. Jesus sat with women, outcasts, and the marginalized. Instead of a military overthrow, Jesus was calling for a conversion of heart for those who heard the Good News and was asking people to be open to God’s Kingdom.

Jesus proclaims John’s greatness as a prophet and then he reverses John’s elevation by bringing the nost needy and neglected to the top. Anyone, regardless of their circumstances was invited to God’s banquet. In a very structured society this reversal confronted those who felt they were already the elect.

So in a way we are like John. We know that the Messiah has come. We are in the in-between time of knowing who the Messiah is and are waiting for the completion of the Kingdom of God.

Peace,

Ryan

 

[dessert]

With the law as truth we can predict what is going to happen, we are organized, we know who is going to sing next sunday whho is going to usher etc. what we will do on Christmas whose house we hope to be at etc. This is good and it is proper to be on time etc. but Jesus gives us more the unpredictable the allowing the Holy spirit to work, the apostles wanted to know all the time what was going to happen they wanted to be safe. Our priest gave us a good sermon on this the other day, just let God rule our life in those moments be vulnerable be open.