Who else here likes the New Order mass, but would like to hear more traditional music at mass?

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I like the New Order mass better than the Tridentine Latin mass, because it’s easier for me to follow. However, I’d love to see more perishes return to the traditional Latin hymns. Those hymns, particularly the ones written for choirs, are some of the best pieces of music ever written, and their lyrics, when translated, really touch me a whole lot more than the modern hymns sung today.

I’d love to go into a New Order perish on a Marian feast day, and hear Grieg’s “Ave Maris Stella,” which really hits home for me, and is musically one of the best pieces I’ve ever heard. What ever happened to Samuel Webbe’s “Tantum Ergo,” Mozart’s “Laudate Dominum,” Bach’s “Ave Maria,” Franc’s “Panis Angelicus” (another one of my all time favorites), etc?

How many of you would also like to see this music brought back into the mass, without going back to the Tridentine mass? Also, it would be really interesting to hear the New Order mass in Latin some times.
 
My parish actually celebrates both the OF and EF Masses and I have been to both. I prefer the OF Mass but that is because the pastor of the parish tends to “overdo” the EF Mass (it is always the High Mass). I have yet to see a Low Mass celebrated.

Saying that, the music at the OF Mass is always the more traditional music and that includes Chant so that is not an issue.
 
My diocese has yet to offer the EF. However, when I lived in Austin, I managed to get to the EF and I really enjoyed it.

Unfortunately, the music my parish uses comes from the OCP catalogue which leaves much to be desired. For once, I would love to hear genuine sacred music that pireces the soul instead of something that sounds like the Joan Baez era that should have been gone ages ago. The SLJ stuff is not sacred music, not by a long-shot, nor is anything by Bob Hurd or Fr. Manolo, CSP. Now, something along the lines of the Attende Domine, O Sun of Justice, Hoe Firm a Foundation, Draw Us in the Spirit’s Tether, Let All Mortal Flesh Keep Silence, Alleluia Sing to Jesus and Word of God to Earth Come Down would suit me just fine.
 
benedictgal said:
For once, I would love to hear genuine sacred music
that pireces the soul instead of something that sounds like the Joan Baez era that should have been gone ages ago.
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If you want to hear something that not only pierces the soul, but melts the heart, listen to Mozart’s Requiem. It’s my favorite sacred work of all time, and nothing surpasses it in my oppinion. Hearing it in a great time of spiritual need on September 10 of this year was what led me to eventually start going back to RCIA classes. I have never before, or since, been moved as much by music as I was that day.
 
I would also love to hear the more traditional music.

Another source of irritation is when they take a a beloved hymn and totally change the words.
 
MarionC said:
I would also love to hear the more traditional music.

Another source of irritation is when they take a a beloved hymn and totally change the words.
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I agree. I was at a New Order mass one time almost seven years ago. When the people went up for Communion, I heard the choir start singing Samuel Webbe’s “Tantum Ergo,” but they were singing a completely different hymn, and it was in English. They should have at least sung an English translation of the Tantum Ergo, but I don’t even think that they did that. I would have rather heard it in Latin though. The Tantum Ergo sounds beautiful in Latin, because that was the language it was originally written in. After the mass, I asked the music director why the words were changed, and she said that they use traditional music, but they sometimes sing different hymns to the old melodies. If I ever heard a completely different hymn sung to Edvard Grieg’s “Ave Maris Stella,” I would probably be so disappointed, that I would be distracted throughout the rest of mass.

I recently learned of at least one occurance of Franc’s “Panis Angelicus” being butchered in this manner. A Protestant contemporary Christian music artist took Franc’s music, and sang a completely different hymn to it. There was nothing wrong with the new lyrics, but it broke my heart to hear them sung to that beloved music. I have a suspicion that a lot of the butchery of the beloved hymns is being done by Protestants, and the new versions are somehow making it into the Catholic hymnals. If they’re going to sing one of these classics, they should do it right! That’s just my oppinion, for what it’s worth.

My musical tastes make me mostly a traditionalist when it comes to the music at mass, although I don’t mind new songs, or some translations of the old ones, being sung in English every once in a while. The thing that makes me weird is that I like the New Order mass better than the Tridentine mass. With the English mass, I feel like I’m more of a part of it. Since the New Order mass is what I’m used to, I could probably follow it if it was translated into Latin, but I get lost at a Tridentine mass.
 
Josh, I agree that there are some new songs that are a pleasure to hear. Many times, though, our Leader of Song will pull out a song that is unharmonious and may be suitable for a soloist but not for the congregation at large.

Often, our Leader of Song will stop singing so that everyone else will sing, but I cringe because if the song is unharmonious or the notes are all over the place, it’s a mess!

I vote for a little more “Holy God, We Praise Thy Name” and a little less of this other stuff.
 
I do. I love the OF Mass, and prefer it to the EF, but it is at its best and grandest with traditional hymnody and Gregorian chant, as the Council directed. I have nothing against contemporary compositions per se, but the unfortunate fact is many, of not most, contemporary compositions are just plain banal and try to be more catchy than prayerful. Even classical Protestant hymns are so much richer than today’s modern Catholic compositions. So I tend to lean more towards traditional hymns. Of course, one can never go wrong with Gregorian chant.
 
Our Parish has (at least) reached the level of more English traditional hymns ( Holy, Holy, Holy, Alleluia Sing to Jesus, For all the Saints etc.) but I would like us to reach the level of chanting the antiphons and the Ordinary of Mass (and some propers too!) but we’re not there yet, I would like us to celebrate the Pauline Mass ad orientem and in Latin too, but wishful thinking (because that’s how it is supposed to be celebrated.) I would like only one High Motu Proprio Mass a week, and Daily Low Masses, not exclusively, because while I do really love the Motu Proprio Mass, the Pauline Mass is what Vatican II promulgated, and this council was inspired by the Holy Spirit, and I believe that the Pauline Mass can be celebrated just as reverently (If not, more reverently) as the Motu Proprio Mass.

XC
Patrick
 
MarionC said:
Josh, I agree that there are some new songs that are a pleasure to hear. Many times, though, our Leader of Song will pull out a song that is unharmonious and may be suitable for a soloist but not for the congregation at large.

Often, our Leader of Song will stop singing so that everyone else will sing, but I cringe because if the song is unharmonious or the notes are all over the place, it’s a mess!

I vote for a little more “Holy God, We Praise Thy Name” and a little less of this other stuff.
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If they want to sing newer songs, why haven’t they ever looked into some of the newer African-American gospel music that’s out there, especially the songs with slower tempos? I know that it’s Protestant music, but most of it either comes directly from scripture, or it is genuinely praising and worshiping God with feeling, unlike a lot of the newer Protestant and Catholic music. One African-American gospel song that could easily be incorperated into a mass is “More Than Anything,” by Lamar Campbell. I love the lyrics to that song, because it expresses what’s in my heart, and what I want to be in my heart. It would be nice to hear both that song, and something like “Panis Angelicus,” at a mass. If they only use newer music, it often takes away from my worship experience, but it’s ok with me if they throw some decent newer music in there every now and then.
 
I just don’t understand how a Catholic can hate the Mass. It’s the same Mass for both EF and ON, just a different way of celebrating it. I love both of them because I love the Eucharist.

As for songs: So long as they’re Church songs - like “Ave Maria”, “One Bread One Body”, and “Change Our Hearts” - I’m fine with it. No rock music or anything. The Mass is meant to be reverent, not conformed to the culture and time like a concert.
 
I just don’t understand how a Catholic can hate the Mass. It’s the same Mass for both EF and ON, just a different way of celebrating it. I love both of them because I love the Eucharist.

As for songs: So long as they’re Church songs - like “Ave Maria”, “One Bread One Body”, and “Change Our Hearts” - I’m fine with it. No rock music or anything. Mass is a Sacrament, not a concert.
 
TBolt1000T said:
If you want to hear something that not only pierces the soul, but melts the heart, listen to Mozart’s Requiem. It’s my favorite sacred work of all time, and nothing surpasses it in my oppinion. Hearing it in a great time of spiritual need on September 10 of this year was what led me to eventually start going back to RCIA classes. I have never before, or since, been moved as much by music as I was that day.
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The Catholic churches in our city are performing this next March, and I have the privilege of serving as the rehearsal accompanist! What a joy!
 
I had a rare opportunity on Sunday.

I was scheduled to play for a 9: 00 A.M. Mass. The Liturgical Director forgot to email me the list of hymns. I even called her late Saturday night, but on Sunday morning, there was still no list. And when I got to the church, there were no hymns posted on the magnetic sign board. Ai Yi Yi!

So I had to choose the hymns, and yes, I asked Father if he approved of my choices (he did–in fact, he said they were very appropriate).

And what hymns do you all think I chose?! Bwoo ha ha!

Spoilers
Processional Hymn–“Come Christians, Join To Sing”

Offertory Hymn–“Beautiful Savior”

Communion Hymn–“O Sacrament Most Holy”

Closing Hymn–“Joyful Joyful We Adore Thee”

I selected these traditional hymns because we had no cantor, and I felt that they would be easier to sing (more melodic and regular in their rhythm) then many of the modern hymns.

I also happen to like them, but I know that’s not supposed to be taken into consideration.

I wasn’t sure if the choices were being sung well or not. But when I announced the page number and title for “O Sacrament Most Holy,” a sweet elderly lady in the middle of the church held up her missalette, grinned, and gave me a thumb’s up! I was absolutely touched–it was good to know that somebody like the hymns! (O Sacrament Most Holy is one of my favorites.)

So yes, I like the traditional hymns in the NO. But I also like the modern hymns–if there is a cantor to lead the congregation in singing them.
 
TBolt1000T said:
I like the New Order mass better than the Tridentine Latin mass, because it’s easier for me to follow. However, I’d love to see more perishes return to the traditional Latin hymns. Those hymns, particularly the ones written for choirs, are some of the best pieces of music ever written, and their lyrics, when translated, really touch me a whole lot more than the modern hymns sung today.

I’d love to go into a New Order perish on a Marian feast day, and hear Grieg’s “Ave Maris Stella,” which really hits home for me, and is musically one of the best pieces I’ve ever heard. What ever happened to Samuel Webbe’s “Tantum Ergo,” Mozart’s “Laudate Dominum,” Bach’s “Ave Maria,” Franc’s “Panis Angelicus” (another one of my all time favorites), etc?

How many of you would also like to see this music brought back into the mass, without going back to the Tridentine mass? Also, it would be really interesting to hear the New Order mass in Latin some times.
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Definitely, and ad orientum, Latin in some of responses by the congregation, etc.
 
Ooh! Ooh! Me!

Lately, I’ve had to go to the 11AM Mass after CCD in my parish, and I much prefer the usual 5PM on Saturday that I usually go to.

Our main organist usually manages to pick from the better selections in the OCP repertoire, so it’s not too bad on that front. Could be better, but it could be better just about anywhere.

The 11AM Mass, though, isn’t so lucky. It’s all guitar, so it’s a complete different set of people choosing the music(the Music Director doesn’t pick the hymns, the organist/guitarist does), and they pick from the, shall we say, lesser half. Their talent isn’t so hot, either - they use a woman with a lisp and a very screechy voice for the main voice, and then they have her sing all the optional descants, so it’s difficult for the congregation to sing along with the melody if they don’t know it, and makes it seem more like a performance.

And Cat, that’s another reason that I like the more traditional stuff. So much of it is both familiar to the congregation, and is IMHO easier to sing. A lot of the new stuff has weird rhythms and goes up and down the scale, and my range isn’t so huge. Much of the more traditional stuff has a more simple rhythm, like you said, and I’ve noticed the melodies are simply easier to sing.
 
I also dislike guitars at mass, but I don’t think that there’s anything morally wrong with them being used.

I never said that I hated the Tridentine mass. I just have a hard time following it. I’m totally blind, and I’ve been that way since birth, so I obviously can’t read the missalette.
 
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