Who gave the world the Bible?

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sambos671 said:
To whom do you speak?
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Oops, JPaul 1953. I’m not sure if he’s quoting without responding to add emphasis to certaiin posts, or if he’s unfamiliar with the forum and is hitting quote and post in error. (He has a trial membership. I think he’s a he.)

I saw your post after I sent mine. So, “Yeah, what he said.” 🙂
 
I’m happy to see someone comprehend what Pope John Paul II was speaking about when he claimed that there are the invincibly ignorant that cannot see but can still be saved . To all, please read Roman 2:12-16. The KJV has a different ending than does the Church’s first completed text of the bible, but the claim is still there.

To all who say that Jesus said: " I am the way, the truth, and the light. No one comes to the Father except through me" maybe ask the Holy Spirit to guide you to a possible deeper understanding. Most Protestants believe that if you don’t accept Christ as your Savior and ask for your sins to be forgiven that there is no salvation in you possible and you will go to Hell. That seems so small-minded to me. So God made us all but only those who see it their way can and will be saved. Boy, that makes them quite important in their own eyes, being one of the chosen few. I would think if they are above-average Christians that they would spend all of their waking hours trying to save even one soul.

How about this view. When we all die, Jesus Christ will be our final Judge and at that time He will decide who will go to Heaven and who will be cast into the Lake of Fire. Which means He will decide who will go to our Father via Jesus and who will not. This allows Jesus to be the judge not people who believe the verse to be so restrictive. Jesus said those who know more and disobey will be punished harshly and those who know less and disobey will be punished lightly. Isn’t that sort of different than the way certain Protestants see it.

I hope Pope John Paul II is correct and they are not.
 
kalt said:
Oops, JPaul 1953. I’m not sure if he’s quoting without responding to add emphasis to certaiin posts, or if he’s unfamiliar with the forum and is hitting quote and post in error. (He has a trial membership. I think he’s a he.)

I saw your post after I sent mine. So, “Yeah, what he said.” 🙂
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Sorry Kalt . Being new limits my understanding on how to use the forum.

Thanks:
 
Devil’s advocate here … 😉
jpaul1953 said:
I’m happy to see someone comprehend what Pope John Paul II was speaking about when he claimed that there are the invincibly ignorant that cannot see but can still be saved . To all, please read Roman 2:12-16. The KJV has a different ending than does the Church’s first completed text of the bible, but the claim is still there.
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What then, about those who come here trying to correct us Catholics (as Christalone is doing in this thread), and while they have been told the truth they continue to refuse to see? Does that make them invincibly ignorant? At what point does it become their responsibility to accept the truth rather than their own flawed interpretation?
jpaul1953 said:
To all who say that Jesus said: " I am the way, the truth, and the light. No one comes to the Father except through me" maybe ask the Holy Spirit to guide you to a possible deeper understanding. Most Protestants believe that if you don’t accept Christ as your Savior and ask for your sins to be forgiven that there is no salvation in you possible and you will go to Hell. That seems so small-minded to me. So God made us all but only those who see it their way can and will be saved. Boy, that makes them quite important in their own eyes, being one of the chosen few. I would think if they are above-average Christians that they would spend all of their waking hours trying to save even one soul.
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They do. It seems that many of them come to these forums to “save” us Catholics. :rolleyes:
jpaul1953 said:
How about this view. When we all die, Jesus Christ will be our final Judge and at that time He will decide who will go to Heaven and who will be cast into the Lake of Fire. Which means He will decide who will go to our Father via Jesus and who will not. This allows Jesus to be the judge not people who believe the verse to be so restrictive.
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So then, what reason is there to be Catholic? Why not just accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your saviour and then go off and do as you please? (I’ve seen many Protestants act that way and insist they are “saved.”) Being a Catholic is a far narrower path.
jpaul1953 said:
Jesus said those who know more and disobey will be punished harshly and those who know less and disobey will be punished lightly. Isn’t that sort of different than the way certain Protestants see it.
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There are Catholics that are just as ignorant as Protestants about the Catholic church. Are they to be punished more harshly simply because they’re Catholics?
jpaul1953 said:
I hope Pope John Paul II is correct and they are not.
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Psst… I suspect Pope John Paul II is correct over protestants. 😉
 
Not when the reformation began.The early protesters believed in transubstantiation, the virginity of our Blessed Mother, even in purgatory. These all changed with time as certain Protestants wanted to further separate themselves from the Church by limiting what they read in the Bible. Scott Hahn said that he knew the Bible inside out while he was a Presbyterian and that when he became Catholic, he realized that everything that he had not highlighted was exclusively Catholic.
 
GodIsGracious said:
Devil’s advocate here … 😉

What then, about those who come here trying to correct us Catholics (as Christalone is doing in this thread), and while they have been told the truth they continue to refuse to see? Does that make them invincibly ignorant? At what point does it become their responsibility to accept the truth rather than their own flawed interpretation?

They do. It seems that many of them come to these forums to “save” us Catholics. :rolleyes:

So then, what reason is there to be Catholic? Why not just accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your saviour and then go off and do as you please? (I’ve seen many Protestants act that way and insist they are “saved.”) Being a Catholic is a far narrower path.

There are Catholics that are just as ignorant as Protestants about the Catholic church. Are they to be punished more harshly simply because they’re Catholics?

Psst… I suspect Pope John Paul II is correct over protestants. 😉
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Of course Pope John Paul II is correct over the Protestants. Remember Mr. Protestant not every Portestant sees it your way. There is only one teaching on everything of THE CHURCH. There are over 20,000+ different denominations of Protestants. There is only one Catholic Church with a few sects, but all primary beliefs are the same.

For instance, you don’t believe in Catholic confession, which you also don’t understand. Well, you’all live by a very broad interpretation of John 3:16. Read John 20:22-23. Does that not clear up your denial of confession?. If you let the Spirit move you rather than your intellect, you will find the truth and the truth will set you free.

May God bless you and hold you close to his spiritual heart.
 
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Godisgracious:
So then, what reason is there to be Catholic? Why not just accept the Lord Jesus Christ as your saviour and then go off and do as you please? (I’ve seen many Protestants act that way and insist they are “saved.”) Being a Catholic is a far narrower path.
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Yet one so many Catholics miss or fail to travel on. Jesus gives a parable about two sons and a father. The Father tells the one son to do something and the son says Yes I’ll do it but doesn’t. The Job isn’t done so the Father tells the other son to do it but he says No but goes and does it anyway. Which one is doing the Fathers will? The second of course. This is how I see many protestants. Sure the Catholic may have accuracy in teaching but what good is it if their lives aren’t reflective of it? They participate in the sacraments to their own condemnation. What about protestants who err on certain aspects of the faith but their lives reflect what God wants? Feeding the poor, visiting the sick, helping the widows, repenting and turning from their sin, engaging in a personal relationship with God. Where many Catholics go to the sacraments but still habitually sin. Do not seek God or his righteousness. Which one is doing the fathers will? John the baptist told the Jews “you better not even use the fact that your father is Abraham to think you’ll be saved!” (my paraphrase) To the Catholic Just participating in the sacraments with out a really repentant heart is not enough. Repent, turn to God, and then recieve the grace of the Sacraments. Now I’m not saying there aren’t Catholics who do this but keep in mind many Catholics have the same mind set as the Jews did that John the Baptist was addressing.
 
sambos671 said:
Ah but note in Qumran we found Hebrew text for Tobit and some other apocryphal books. So who is correct the Massorites? Or the LXX?
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NO, just the one true Church of Christ. Read and please ask the Holy Spirit to let you grasp Matt 16:15-20. Don’t just think you know what it means. Research it.
 
sambos671 said:
Yet one so many Catholics miss or fail to travel on. Jesus gives a parable about two sons and a father. The Father tells the one son to do something and the son says Yes I’ll do it but doesn’t. The Job isn’t done so the Father tells the other son to do it but he says No but goes and does it anyway. Which one is doing the Fathers will? The second of course. This is how I see many protestants. Sure the Catholic may have accuracy in teaching but what good is it if their lives aren’t reflective of it? They participate in the sacraments to their own condemnation. What about protestants who err on certain aspects of the faith but their lives reflect what God wants? Feeding the poor, visiting the sick, helping the widows, repenting and turning from their sin, engaging in a personal relationship with God. Where many Catholics go to the sacraments but still habitually sin. Do not seek God or his righteousness. Which one is doing the fathers will? John the baptist told the Jews “you better not even use the fact that your father is Abraham to think you’ll be saved!” (my paraphrase) To the Catholic Just participating in the sacraments with out a really repentant heart is not enough. Repent, turn to God, and then recieve the grace of the Sacraments. Now I’m not saying there aren’t Catholics who do this but keep in mind many Catholics have the same mind set as the Jews did that John the Baptist was addressing.
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jpaul1953 said:
Of course Pope John Paul II is correct over the Protestants. Remember Mr. Protestant not every Portestant sees it your way. There is only one teaching on everything of THE CHURCH. There are over 20,000+ different denominations of Protestants. There is only one Catholic Church with a few sects, but all primary beliefs are the same.

For instance, you don’t believe in Catholic confession, which you also don’t understand. Well, you’all live by a very broad interpretation of John 3:16. Read John 20:22-23. Does that not clear up your denial of confession?. If you let the Spirit move you rather than your intellect, you will find the truth and the truth will set you free.

May God bless you and hold you close to his spiritual heart.
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Is this in response to my post?

Uhm. I’m Catholic. I was simply posing some questions as a Catholic regarding (some) Protestant beliefs and also what the Catholic church teaches us about who is saved or not.

I’m having a real problem right now with being able to allow just anyone to be saved. Granted, I fully acknowledge that God is the only one who judges us, but Christ did say that he was the way to the father. And since I firmly believe that the Catholic church is the one true church, it annoys me when some people say that nearly anyone can be saved.

Also what annoys me is that protestants can be saved in one moment of time, say a 3 or 4 line prayer, and then they go off and do as they please. Catholics, while many do, don’t have such a “luxury.” Our path is narrower, it seems. And my ego almost nearly demands that we get special consideration over others. But then again, I admit it is my ego. 😉
 
Boy you got everything figured out. The Catholics might know the truth but the Portestants obey it. Are you for real. So you may know some sinful Catholics. So what.

At least we acknowledge that if ones strays away and dies they will burn. So you better be ready Mr Protestant.

You comments are so ridiculously immature and incredibly small-minded, but that’s okay. Ignorance is bliss. You dissappoint me. You must be quite young.
 
sambos671 said:
Yet one so many Catholics miss or fail to travel on. Jesus gives a parable about two sons and a father. The Father tells the one son to do something and the son says Yes I’ll do it but doesn’t. The Job isn’t done so the Father tells the other son to do it but he says No but goes and does it anyway. Which one is doing the Fathers will? The second of course. This is how I see many protestants. Sure the Catholic may have accuracy in teaching but what good is it if their lives aren’t reflective of it? They participate in the sacraments to their own condemnation. What about protestants who err on certain aspects of the faith but their lives reflect what God wants? Feeding the poor, visiting the sick, helping the widows, repenting and turning from their sin, engaging in a personal relationship with God. Where many Catholics go to the sacraments but still habitually sin. Do not seek God or his righteousness. Which one is doing the fathers will? John the baptist told the Jews “you better not even use the fact that your father is Abraham to think you’ll be saved!” (my paraphrase) To the Catholic Just participating in the sacraments with out a really repentant heart is not enough. Repent, turn to God, and then recieve the grace of the Sacraments. Now I’m not saying there aren’t Catholics who do this but keep in mind many Catholics have the same mind set as the Jews did that John the Baptist was addressing.
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Thanks for the reminder of this parable. I had forgotten it. 😉

How about if the two do equally the same? Except one is Catholic the other is not?

And actually, I just realized I’m derailing this thread. So I’ll stop. 😉
 
Lischou said:
If that is all that matters…then why is the Bible such a big book? :confused:

Lisa
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Excellent point! If salvation is a simple matter of shouting out the name of Jesus in the course of a man-made “sinner’s prayer”, why have a bible at all? If faith is so simple as merely confessing His Name, throw the book away! You’re saved.

And yet… And yet, some of these are the same ones who appear to worship the bible, claiming that it interprets itself like a living being; who apparently believe that the bible simply fell from Heaven complete and intact; that no Church authority was or is needed to maintain unity and correctly teach and interpret scripture.

The evil one has succeeded in dividing us so that we fight each other, rather thn him.

The Holy Spirit always unites.
The demon always divides.
 
po18guy said:
The evil one has succeeded in dividing us so that we fight each other, rather thn him.

The Holy Spirit always unites.
The demon always divides.
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Yep. Check out the C.S. Lewis quote in my signature. 👍
 
Things can and certainly do become rather contentious on these forums. Let us remember that we are speaking with fellow Christians who are loved by God and are called into a more complete relationship with Him.

One fact which I hope all Christians will consider and remember: The Catholic ('universal") Church teaches that all validly baptized Christians are members, if imperfectly, of the One True Church. They are true brothers and sisters in Christ. So, let us focus on leading them to the richness and fulness of God’s revealed truth in the One Church which He alone established. Amen!
 
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