Who here really enjoys their Single Life Vocation?

[mrsdizzyd]

Tis_Bearself:

God never lets anything happen without a reason. That includes things that happen as a result of the free will of man.

What can be said is that God can bring about some good out of something evil or bad - and in being omnipotent nothing happens without Him permitting. That does not mean the evil or bad are of Our Lord’s Holy will.

…But your first sentence I quoted is extremely dangerous Bear, because I have found that same usage in several sects seeking to manipulate and use their followers, that quote served to legitimize what served their purposes as being God’s will.

Amen. I have a family member who is unfortunately under the authority of a very cultic form of Christianity. She lurches from one disaster to another according to what her church claims is God’s will. It’s heartbreaking to watch.

Yes, God can and will bring some good out of it, but we can quickly get ourselves into trouble when we view even potentially harmful things as God’s will.

 

[adgloriam]

adgloriam:

Tis_Bearself:

God never lets anything happen without a reason. That includes things that happen as a result of the free will of man.

What can be said is that God can bring about some good out of something evil or bad - and in being omnipotent nothing happens without Him permitting. That does not mean the evil or bad are of Our Lord’s Holy will.

…But your first sentence I quoted is extremely dangerous Bear, because I have found that same usage in several sects seeking to manipulate and use their followers, that quote served to legitimize what served their purposes as being God’s will.

Amen. I have a family member who is unfortunately under the authority of a very cultic form of Christianity. She lurches from one disaster to another according to what her church claims is God’s will. It’s heartbreaking to watch.

Yes, God can and will bring some good out of it, but we can quickly get ourselves into trouble when we view even potentially harmful things as God’s will.

Alas!! Someone understands me!!

 

[mrsdizzyd]

Alas!! Someone understands me!!

Haha

Well, I will say that if I didn’t have this experience with my relative in the Christian “cult,” I might have a harder time understanding.

As it is, I know that there is a big difference between saying God “permits” a thing vs. saying God “wills” a thing. (Having conversations with atheists about the problem of evil also highlights this point.)

 

[TheLittleLady]

Her wording reflects St Paul’s words “I have learned in whatever state I am, therewith to be content.”

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I think this is one of those issues where we’ll just have to agree to disagree. Nowhere did I say that God wills evil or bad things.

We are specifically discussing three states in life: single, married, or religious life. None of those things are evil or bad in and of themselves. Therefore, I don’t see how I said anything about God willing a person to be in a “disaster”.

I find myself right now single. It is not pleasant. It is a trial. I didn’t bring it on myself or act in some way to create a sin situation or a disaster, it just happened out of the blue. Somebody dying at a particular time, in this case my husband, is to me God’s will that it was their time to go. I don’t go around saying that to the bereaved at funerals, but I myself don’t take issue with the concept. It is what it is. If you truly believe in eternal life, and reasonably think the dead person is Heaven bound, then death is not a bad terrible thing.

I think God wants me to learn something and grow from the experience. Otherwise, why would this happen to me? I don’t see how this is some terrible thing to think or how it’s cultish or anything. I also don’t think I should be looked down upon for not having a “vocation” in life because I was married before (vocation) and now I’m widowed and not in religious life so I’m just single (no vocation).

It’s our vocation in life to learn and grow from the situation we are in. Obviously if we respond by wrecking our own lives by creating disasters or committing sins and calling it “God’s will”, we aren’t practicing our vocation well and we aren’t learning anything or growing in any good way.

I think I’ll just leave it at that because this topic seems to be the same as when I said we offer things up for penance and someone else said that this concept of penance emphasizes suffering too much and forces people to stay in abuse situations. God expects people to use common sense when they discern a situation in both instances.

Muting thread now, and I hope the negativity towards single people does not persist as this thread seems to have gotten sidetracked into a totally different topic.

 

[adgloriam]

Her wording reflects St Paul’s words “I have learned in whatever state I am, therewith to be content.”

Hi @TheLittleLady, please try to understand: with the current numbers in divorce and low birth rates Catholics should be defending marriage and family. And that defense -requires apologetic in positive definitions- a clear view of the hardships and dangers to family. Because, those not married and without children are reminded that time is fleeting - least contentment turn conformity.

 

[adgloriam]

Amen. I have a family member who is unfortunately under the authority of a very cultic form of Christianity. She lurches from one disaster to another according to what her church claims is God’s will. It’s heartbreaking to watch.

Yes, God can and will bring some good out of it, but we can quickly get ourselves into trouble when we view even potentially harmful things as God’s will.

Had your family member destroyed another person in the process you can imagine how much of an injustice it is to say that’s God’s will.

The other person (both actually) might have lost their family due to it.

That much for vocation and state of life.

 

[Lee1]

I agree with Tis bear.
I’m not keen on ambiguity, either God wills these things or He wills some or He wills none. Which is it?

I think there’s a lot to be learned from adversity and for that matter from success. Learning from adversity is a lot easier if you’re open to the idea that it is supposed to help.

I don’t know about cults but if they exist they must be part of God’s plan, or don’t interfere with it?

The more I learn the less I know.

 

[adgloriam]

I’m not keen on ambiguity (…) Which is it?

God desires our eternal salvation. And God desires our holiness in this world.

[We can leave it at that.]

 

[TheLittleLady]

For one, I fail to see how being content with our state in life, again as St Paul provided the example, is somehow a negative against marriage and family. For those who have discerned a vocation to marriage, nothing runs off potential spouses like discontent!

 

[adgloriam]

nothing runs off potential spouses like discontent!

…or reminding them that the words Love and Responsibility go hand-in-hand.

Let me give you a paradox: A potential spouse insists she must keep seeing her ex-bf. Are you to be content with that? Or to conform??

Crisis -from the Greek- means a time to make choices. And as biological clocks tick and fertility goes, the deadline approaches…So, it seems, possible contentment is conforming to such realities. Anything else is discontent.

 

[TheLittleLady]

or reminding them that the words Love and Responsibility go hand-in-hand.

Seem to be all over the page here.

If I am dating someone with the intent of marriage, part of that would be determining if we have the same world view with regard to marriage.

Let me give you a paradox: A potential spouse insists she must keep seeing her ex-bf. Are you to be content with that? Or to conform??

Again, if I am in an exclusive dating relationship, it would only be after we had both determined that we share the same values and world view. Once we define our relationship as exclusive, it is exclusive.

And as biological clocks tick and fertility goes, the deadline approaches…

Marriage is far more than ticking biological clocks. No one should plunge into a marriage because they feel their fertility is going. This sort of pressure on women is what sets people up for bad marriages.

 

[Sarcelle]

TheLittleLady:

nothing runs off potential spouses like discontent!

…or reminding them that the words Love and Responsibility go hand-in-hand.

Let me give you a paradox: A potential spouse insists she must keep seeing her ex-bf. Are you to be content with that? Or to conform??

Crisis -from the Greek- means a time to make choices. And as biological clocks tick and fertility goes, the deadline approaches…So, it seems, possible contentment is conforming to such realities. Anything else is discontent.

Well, when the biological clock starts ticking down and the deadline approaches, let it approach, and I’ll see if I explode or not.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I’m not sure what determines such things. I’m married and have been for a long time. There was never a time in my life when I thought for a moment that I would be anything but married with children. Other guys gave the priesthood at least a thought, but I never did. Nothing against the priesthood. I just knew it wasn’t me.

On the other hand, I have a sister who never married. She’s retired now. She lived a very active life before retirement and still does. She keeps up her professional licensure and still goes to continuing education sessions (especially if they’re in a neat place). She is in two book clubs and at least one bridge club. She’s all over the place, it seems. Does a lot of church and charity stuff.

She dated some back when she was in school, but I don’t know that she did to speak of afterwards. She is one of those people who just plain admit that their own sense of “running their own lives” is pretty exclusive.

I’m marriage oriented, but I don’t think a person like her has any business getting married, period. There’s just something about that mindset.

 

[The_Old_Maid]

Two suggestions:

Read The Jesuit guide to almost everything by James Martin, SJ. I enjoyed this book on the called-to-single-life.

And two, consider signing up for sponsored children through the for-pennies-a-day programs. Being single doesn’t mean you can’t have a wonderful impact on a child.

There’s a lot of meat in this thread that I don’t have time to visit right now, so, sorry if this seems like a fly-by.

 

[Norseman82]

Isn’t being single just a state in life and not a vocation?

I hear a lot of people say that while married and consecrated religious people have vocations, single people do not.

You are correct! One of the characteristics of a vocation is that there is a vow taken that “locks you in” and serves as an impediment to another vocatiopn. That is why marriage, Holy Orders, and vowed religious/consecrated life are considered vocations whereas just being single in and of itself is not a vocation. A priest may not marry, and in the Latin rite a married man (with very few exceptions for protestant converts) may not get ordained, but a single person who has not taken any vows is free to marry or, if accepted, enter into Orders or religious/consecrated life.

 

[Annie]

I am getting divorced, and am looking forward to the future. Having my children was and is a blessing, but my husband and I were not like compatible, so that was a problem.

I feel like now I can do anything I want, even though I will be doing it alone. I am going to take courses to have a new career and I will be able to be involved with the parish.

One thing I look forward to is putting together a group house kind of situation. I lived in group houses before and after graduating and I think it would be great to have one that is more like intentional but not really rigid or anything. But if we had a spare room, maybe we could help out someone who is pregnant and needs help, right?

I feel like I wasted a lot of opportunities before I married. I wasn’t Catholic and I just did what stuff on the spur of the moment, I didn’t think about life. Now I feel like I know a lot more and I want to be able to live well and do things like go on missionary trips to help people, and to have time to do things where I live.

I think sometimes it is easy to think in a way that sees something as all-good or all-bad.

Seeing a romantic relationship or marriage as a perfect thing makes every other sort sort of life seem like a bummer, but there are enough bad marriages out there that we can think that there are good and bad points about being married, and there are bad and good points about being single. Married life is what you and someone else make it, but single life is what you make it.

So who knows? Maybe one day you will live in the same house as me