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Singinbeauty
Guest
He probably won’t because this would mean he would have to admit he is incorrect in his assertion. Thank you for posting this thread my dear!
- Status
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paarsurrey
Guest
Hi everypody participating in this thread!
I don’t understand as to what is the problem here. You all believe in free will of a person, I am sure, then why you want to impose your will or defination on others? or you want to define or want to give a name to someone else’s faith or denomination yourself.Isn’t it a bad thin?
There are enough members of Lutherans/Anglicans/Protestants/Reformists/Baptists here I think. If you want to ask a person if he is a Protestant or of any other denomination, just ask that person directly or just see his profile, whatever he mentions, must be accepted by everybody.
Kindly be kind enough and tell me as to why someone else’s faith is being defined rather than he himself does the same.
Thank
I don’t understand as to what is the problem here. You all believe in free will of a person, I am sure, then why you want to impose your will or defination on others? or you want to define or want to give a name to someone else’s faith or denomination yourself.Isn’t it a bad thin?
There are enough members of Lutherans/Anglicans/Protestants/Reformists/Baptists here I think. If you want to ask a person if he is a Protestant or of any other denomination, just ask that person directly or just see his profile, whatever he mentions, must be accepted by everybody.
Kindly be kind enough and tell me as to why someone else’s faith is being defined rather than he himself does the same.
Thank
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lak611
Guest
You’re welcome. So far, he has ignored my thread, though.He probably won’t because this would mean he would have to admit he is incorrect in his assertion. Thank you for posting this thread my dear!
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lintpick1
Guest
The SSPX is not in schism, the Pope has said this a few times now. Their priests are suspended, but they are not in schism. I thought Mel Gibson was sedevacantist, not SSPX. SSPX still accepts Pope Benedict as the true Pope where as sede’s don’t.
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Aramis
Guest
Supposedly, Mr. Gibson is affiliated with the SSPV, a sedevaticanist “traditionalist” group.
As to “not in schism” for the SSPX priests: yeah, right… violating their suspension is a self-imposed excommunication. ANd every mass they say is exactly that.
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Catholic_Dude
Guest
I dont see any conflict between the two definitions you listed.
The fact is all Protestants believe in Sola Scriptura, yet each denomination has different INTERPRETATIONS of Scripture, thus Sola Scriptura is first and foremost about interpretation, and as far as I can see almost every doctrine (except the Trinity) is fair game as long as it isnt a Catholic interpretation at the end of the day.
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holdencaulfield
Guest
Any Church that is not Catholic or Eastern Orthodox is considered a Protestant Church. The term Protestant comes from “to protest” because they were protesting the corruption of the Catholic Church. The Eastern Orthodox Churches broke off way before the Protestant Reformation, this was because of the Filoque Clause.
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2ndGen
Guest
Now…with the different “forms” that the word “protestant” is represented in, which definition are you looking for? Uppercase P, lowercase p, adjective or noun?
You have to be specific as to “which” definition you’re looking for.
Prot·es·tant
–noun
You have to be specific as to “which” definition you’re looking for.
Prot·es·tant
–noun
- any Western Christian who is not an adherent of a Catholic, Anglican, or Eastern Church.
- an adherent of any of those Christian bodies that separated from the Church of Rome during the Reformation, or of any group descended from them.
- (originally) any of the German princes who protested against the decision of the Diet of Speyer in 1529, which had denounced the Reformation.
- (lowercase) a person who protests.
–adjective - belonging or pertaining to Protestants or their religion.
- (lowercase) protesting.
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2ndGen
Guest
2
2ndGen
Guest
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2ndGen
Guest
“I never approved of a schism, nor will I approve of it for all eternity…
It is not by separating from the Church that we can make her better.”
Now…who do you suppose said that?
Martin Luther!
I have to give him a hearty AMEN!
Come home all you prodigal children…come home.
It is not by separating from the Church that we can make her better.”
Now…who do you suppose said that?
Martin Luther!
I have to give him a hearty AMEN!
Come home all you prodigal children…come home.
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2ndGen
Guest
But wait…there’s more!
" That the Roman Church is more honored by God than all others is not to be doubted. St, Peter and St. Paul, forty-six Popes, some hundreds of thousands of martyrs, have laid down their lives in its communion, having overcome Hell and the world; so that the eyes of God rest on the Roman church with special favor.
Though nowadays everything is in a wretched state, it is no ground for separating from the Church. On the contrary, the worse things are going, the more should we hold close to her, for it is not by separating from the Church that we can make her better.
We must not separate from God on account of any work of the devil, nor cease to have fellowship with the children of God who are still abiding in the pale of Rome on account of the multitude of the ungodly.
There is no sin, no amount of evil, which should be permitted to dissolve the bond of charity or break the bond of unity of the body. For love can do all things, and nothing is difficult to those who are united.”
Is this true? Is this the real Martin Luther?
" That the Roman Church is more honored by God than all others is not to be doubted. St, Peter and St. Paul, forty-six Popes, some hundreds of thousands of martyrs, have laid down their lives in its communion, having overcome Hell and the world; so that the eyes of God rest on the Roman church with special favor.
Though nowadays everything is in a wretched state, it is no ground for separating from the Church. On the contrary, the worse things are going, the more should we hold close to her, for it is not by separating from the Church that we can make her better.
We must not separate from God on account of any work of the devil, nor cease to have fellowship with the children of God who are still abiding in the pale of Rome on account of the multitude of the ungodly.
There is no sin, no amount of evil, which should be permitted to dissolve the bond of charity or break the bond of unity of the body. For love can do all things, and nothing is difficult to those who are united.”
Is this true? Is this the real Martin Luther?
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2ndGen
Guest
But it get’s worse!
“I would rather drink blood with a Papist than wine with a Zwinglian”
-Martin Luther
“I would rather drink blood with a Papist than wine with a Zwinglian”
-Martin Luther
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holdencaulfield
Guest
Yes the Protestant religion of Ulrich Zwingli, he didn’t even allow images.
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2ndGen
Guest
Protestant? Or simply Reformer?
Christ…was the only Son of Mary, and the Virgin Mary bore no children besides Him… “brothers” really means “cousins” here, for Holy Writ and the Jews always call cousins brothers. (Sermons on John, chapters 1-4, 1537-39).
He, Christ, our Savior, was the real and natural fruit of Mary’s virginal womb…This was without the cooperation of a man, and she remained a virgin after that. (Ibid.)
God says…“Mary’s Son is My only Son.” Thus Mary is the Mother of God. (Ibid.).
God did not derive his divinity from Mary; but it does not follow that it is therefore wrong to say that God was born of Mary, that God is Mary’s Son, and that Mary is God’s mother…She is the true mother of God and bearer of God…Mary suckled God, rocked God to sleep, prepared broth and soup for God, etc. For God and man are one person, one Christ, one Son, one Jesus, not two Christs…just as your son is not two sons…even though he has two natures, body and soul, the body from you, the soul from God alone. (On the Councils and the Church, 1539).
It is a sweet and pious belief that the infusion of Mary’s soul was effected without original sin; so that in the very infusion of her soul she was also purified from original sin and adorned with God’s gifts, receiving a pure soul infused by God; thus from the first moment she began to live she was free from all sin" (Sermon: “On the Day of the Conception of the Mother of God,” 1527).
She is full of grace, proclaimed to be entirely without sin—something exceedingly great. For God’s grace fills her with everything good and makes her devoid of all evil. (Personal {“Little”} Prayer Book, 1522).
There can be no doubt that the Virgin Mary is in heaven. How it happened we do not know. And since the Holy Spirit has told us nothing about it, we can make of it no article of faith…It is enough to know that she lives in Christ.
Luther held to the idea and devotional practice of the veneration of Mary and expressed this on innumerable occasions with the most effusive language:
The veneration of Mary is inscribed in the very depths of the human heart. (Sermon, September 1, 1522).
[She is the] highest woman and the noblest gem in Christianity after Christ…She is nobility, wisdom, and holiness personified. We can never honor her enough. Still honor and praise must be given to her in such a way as to injure neither Christ nor the Scriptures. (Sermon, Christmas, 1531).
No woman is like you. You are more than Eve or Sarah, blessed above all nobility, wisdom, and sanctity. (Sermon, Feast of the Visitation, 1537).
One should honor Mary as she herself wished and as she expressed it in the Magnificat. She praised God for his deeds. How then can we praise her? The true honor of Mary is the honor of God, the praise of God’s grace…Mary is nothing for the sake of herself, but for the sake of Christ…Mary does not wish that we come to her, but through her to God. (Explanation of the Magnificat, 1521).
Luther goes even further, and gives the Blessed Virgin the exalted position of “Spiritual Mother” for Christians, much the same as in Catholic piety:
It is the consolation and the superabundant goodness of God, that man is able to exult in such a treasure. Mary is his true Mother, Christ is his brother, God is his father. (Sermon, Christmas, 1522) Mary is the Mother of Jesus and the Mother of all of us even though it was Christ alone who reposed on her knees…If he is ours, we ought to be in his situation; there where he is, we ought also to be and all that he has ought to be ours, and his mother is also our mother. (Sermon, Christmas, 1529).
Wow…I guess that means Protestants “protest” Luther too.
So that makes them what?
Protestant Protestants?
Christ…was the only Son of Mary, and the Virgin Mary bore no children besides Him… “brothers” really means “cousins” here, for Holy Writ and the Jews always call cousins brothers. (Sermons on John, chapters 1-4, 1537-39).
He, Christ, our Savior, was the real and natural fruit of Mary’s virginal womb…This was without the cooperation of a man, and she remained a virgin after that. (Ibid.)
God says…“Mary’s Son is My only Son.” Thus Mary is the Mother of God. (Ibid.).
God did not derive his divinity from Mary; but it does not follow that it is therefore wrong to say that God was born of Mary, that God is Mary’s Son, and that Mary is God’s mother…She is the true mother of God and bearer of God…Mary suckled God, rocked God to sleep, prepared broth and soup for God, etc. For God and man are one person, one Christ, one Son, one Jesus, not two Christs…just as your son is not two sons…even though he has two natures, body and soul, the body from you, the soul from God alone. (On the Councils and the Church, 1539).
It is a sweet and pious belief that the infusion of Mary’s soul was effected without original sin; so that in the very infusion of her soul she was also purified from original sin and adorned with God’s gifts, receiving a pure soul infused by God; thus from the first moment she began to live she was free from all sin" (Sermon: “On the Day of the Conception of the Mother of God,” 1527).
She is full of grace, proclaimed to be entirely without sin—something exceedingly great. For God’s grace fills her with everything good and makes her devoid of all evil. (Personal {“Little”} Prayer Book, 1522).
There can be no doubt that the Virgin Mary is in heaven. How it happened we do not know. And since the Holy Spirit has told us nothing about it, we can make of it no article of faith…It is enough to know that she lives in Christ.
Luther held to the idea and devotional practice of the veneration of Mary and expressed this on innumerable occasions with the most effusive language:
The veneration of Mary is inscribed in the very depths of the human heart. (Sermon, September 1, 1522).
[She is the] highest woman and the noblest gem in Christianity after Christ…She is nobility, wisdom, and holiness personified. We can never honor her enough. Still honor and praise must be given to her in such a way as to injure neither Christ nor the Scriptures. (Sermon, Christmas, 1531).
No woman is like you. You are more than Eve or Sarah, blessed above all nobility, wisdom, and sanctity. (Sermon, Feast of the Visitation, 1537).
One should honor Mary as she herself wished and as she expressed it in the Magnificat. She praised God for his deeds. How then can we praise her? The true honor of Mary is the honor of God, the praise of God’s grace…Mary is nothing for the sake of herself, but for the sake of Christ…Mary does not wish that we come to her, but through her to God. (Explanation of the Magnificat, 1521).
Luther goes even further, and gives the Blessed Virgin the exalted position of “Spiritual Mother” for Christians, much the same as in Catholic piety:
It is the consolation and the superabundant goodness of God, that man is able to exult in such a treasure. Mary is his true Mother, Christ is his brother, God is his father. (Sermon, Christmas, 1522) Mary is the Mother of Jesus and the Mother of all of us even though it was Christ alone who reposed on her knees…If he is ours, we ought to be in his situation; there where he is, we ought also to be and all that he has ought to be ours, and his mother is also our mother. (Sermon, Christmas, 1529).
Wow…I guess that means Protestants “protest” Luther too.
So that makes them what?
Protestant Protestants?
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2ndGen
Guest
Another nail…
Our prayer should include the Mother of God…What the Hail Mary says is that all glory should be given to God, using these words: “Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee; blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus Christ. Amen!” You see that these words are not concerned with prayer but purely with giving praise and honor…We can use the Hail Mary as a meditation in which we recite what grace God has given her. Second, we should add a wish that everyone may know and respect her…He who has no faith is advised to refrain from saying the Hail Mary. (Personal Prayer Book, 1522).
Our prayer should include the Mother of God…What the Hail Mary says is that all glory should be given to God, using these words: “Hail Mary, full of grace. The Lord is with thee; blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus Christ. Amen!” You see that these words are not concerned with prayer but purely with giving praise and honor…We can use the Hail Mary as a meditation in which we recite what grace God has given her. Second, we should add a wish that everyone may know and respect her…He who has no faith is advised to refrain from saying the Hail Mary. (Personal Prayer Book, 1522).
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2ndGen
Guest
So what does this make a “Protestant” that disagrees with the founder of “Protestantism”?
A Protestant Apostate?
A Protestant Heretic?
Are they condired a Protestant still?
Who defines what a Protestant is?
Martin Luther or those who follow him or those who ignore his teachings and beliefs?
A Protestant Apostate?
A Protestant Heretic?
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=210962
Are they condired a Protestant still?
Who defines what a Protestant is?
Martin Luther or those who follow him or those who ignore his teachings and beliefs?
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2ndGen
Guest
Sorry, just so there’s no accusations of name calling here;
her·e·tic
–noun
4. heretical.
or…
a·pos·tate
–noun
2. of or characterized by apostasy.
Will the real Protestant(s) please stand up?
her·e·tic
–noun
- a professed believer who maintains religious opinions contrary to those accepted by his or her church or rejects doctrines prescribed by that church.
- Roman Catholic Church. a baptized Roman Catholic who willfully and persistently rejects any article of faith.
- anyone who does not conform to an established attitude, doctrine, or principle.
4. heretical.
or…
a·pos·tate
–noun
- a person who forsakes his religion, cause, party, etc.
2. of or characterized by apostasy.
Will the real Protestant(s) please stand up?
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2ndGen
Guest
I heard Luther (the Roman Catholic founder of Protestantism) tried to have Zwingli burned at the stake…anybody heard of this?
Wasn’t it this exact kind of behaviour (the stake burnings, the veneration for Mary, the acceptiance of The Catholic Church’s unity, etc…) exactly why the Protestants broke away from The Church in the first place?
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lak611
Guest
I capitalized “Protestant” in the title of the thread. Why is this so hard for you to understand?Now…with the different “forms” that the word “protestant” is represented in, which definition are you looking for? Uppercase P, lowercase p, adjective or noun?
You have to be specific as to “which” definition you’re looking for.
Prot·es·tant
–noun
- any Western Christian who is not an adherent of a Catholic, Anglican, or Eastern Church.
- an adherent of any of those Christian bodies that separated from the Church of Rome during the Reformation, or of any group descended from them.
- (originally) any of the German princes who protested against the decision of the Diet of Speyer in 1529, which had denounced the Reformation.
- (lowercase) a person who protests.
–adjective- belonging or pertaining to Protestants or their religion.
- (lowercase) protesting.
- Status